REAL FOOTBALL Thread

Looking through potential cap casualties. Cameron Jordan seems a virtual lock for New Orleans, as is there a good chance of Curtis Lofton, Jahri Evans, and Marques Colston being cut. searching through the Saints scraps should be a boost for any team.
 
zitothebrave said:
Looking through potential cap casualties. Cameron Jordan seems a virtual lock for New Orleans, as is there a good chance of Curtis Lofton, Jahri Evans, and Marques Colston being cut. searching through the Saints scraps should be a boost for any team.
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Lock as in he stays?

I dont think they cut Lofton.

I can see Colston cut, Bunkley cut, Hawthorne cut, and Evans/Grubbs restructure.
 
Lock as in lock to get cut. That's way too much cap savings. They're like 20M projected over the cap cause of that shenanigans they did last year to stay under,
 
zitothebrave said:
Lock as in lock to get cut. That's way too much cap savings. They're like 20M projected over the cap cause of that shenanigans they did last year to stay under,
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I doubt they cut him.

They do have some interesting decisions to make with their cap situation though.
 
zitothebrave said:
Looking through potential cap casualties. Cameron Jordan seems a virtual lock for New Orleans, as is there a good chance of Curtis Lofton, Jahri Evans, and Marques Colston being cut. searching through the Saints scraps should be a boost for any team.
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The saints cap situation isnt nearly as bad as people make it out to be. Restructuring Brees and Gallette gets them back to even with the cap. Lofton, Hawthorne, Colston, Evans, Grubbs, Bunkley are all potential cuts. Some of them might stay but take pay cuts. Bunkley took one last year and Colston has already said he is willing to take a pay cut to stay. Lofton would probably be gone but he is the captain of the defense and makes all the play calls. Brees, Gallette, Graham, and Byrd will all restructure their base salary and roster bonuses. Dont be surprised if they sign one of the top 2 centers and a decent free agent cb.
 
cajunrevenge said:
The saints cap situation isnt nearly as bad as people make it out to be. Restructuring Brees and Gallette gets them back to even with the cap. Lofton, Hawthorne, Colston, Evans, Grubbs, Bunkley are all potential cuts. Some of them might stay but take pay cuts. Bunkley took one last year and Colston has already said he is willing to take a pay cut to stay. Lofton would probably be gone but he is the captain of the defense and makes all the play calls. Brees, Gallette, Graham, and Byrd will all restructure their base salary and roster bonuses. Dont be surprised if they sign one of the top 2 centers and a decent free agent cb.
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I can't see that happening. Sorry it just doesn't seem likely that everyone restructures and they save enough money. There's only so much maneuvering you can do.
 
I agree with Zeets, i think they'll get back to the cap, but i dont see how they sign 2-3 FA's with their cap situation.
 
zitothebrave said:
I can't see that happening. Sorry it just doesn't seem likely that everyone restructures and they save enough money. There's only so much maneuvering you can do.
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Brees,Galette, and Byrd restructuring brings the Saints to 1.9 mill in cap space. All 3 are virtual locks to get restructure. Brees because thats what old expensive qbs do and Galette/Byrd because the majority of their salary are roster bonuses the Saints would have to pay anyways. Just make them bonuses to stretch it over the next 5 years. Releasing Colston, Hawthorne, and Bunkley gets them to 10 million in cap space. Beyond that they can still create as much cap space as they want. They could give Graham/Evans/Grubbs their base salary up front as a bonus and get 15 million more in cap space. Its actually a better situation than last year. Whats really bailing them out is the big cap increases every year. I dont know why you dont think they will do this. They have done it several years in a row now. Being in cap hell when Brees retires is part of the plan.
 
Sorry I don't see it cajun. The saints are ****ed.

Byrd just signed as a FA is owed like 14M in bonuses. Only way they can lower his cap hit is to lower his roster bonus this year from 6M to something else and give him more guaranteed money later. It's not like his cap hit is base salary.

Same thing with Gallette, massive roster bonus.

Saints could possibly get themselves under this year, but it's going to wreck them down the line. I get your point to try to win now, but at some point they won't be able to defer any more and that point is coming, if it doesn't hit this year, it will be next year. They blew their wad on keeping Graham and paying 2 guards a **** load of money.

I find it hard to believe that 2 guys they just signed (Byrd and Gallette) would restructure their deal without the Saints paying a pretty penny.
 
zitothebrave said:
Sorry I don't see it cajun. The saints are ****ed.

Byrd just signed as a FA is owed like 14M in bonuses. Only way they can lower his cap hit is to lower his roster bonus this year from 6M to something else and give him more guaranteed money later. It's not like his cap hit is base salary.

Same thing with Gallette, massive roster bonus.

Saints could possibly get themselves under this year, but it's going to wreck them down the line. I get your point to try to win now, but at some point they won't be able to defer any more and that point is coming, if it doesn't hit this year, it will be next year. They blew their wad on keeping Graham and paying 2 guards a **** load of money.

I find it hard to believe that 2 guys they just signed (Byrd and Gallette) would restructure their deal without the Saints paying a pretty penny.
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I don't know about Byrd, but Gallette they can convert his roster bonus and spread the cap hit without his consent. That saves them 11 million.

But I do think Saints fans are delusional.The Saints can get to the cap limit fairly easily, but they have to release some really good players and they don't have the ability to replace those players via free agency. For a team that is already extremely thin that's not a good sign.
 
chop2chip said:
I don't know about Byrd, but Gallette they can convert his roster bonus and spread the cap hit without his consent. That saves them 11 million.

But I do think Saints fans are delusional.The Saints can get to the cap limit fairly easily, but they have to release some really good players and they don't have the ability to replace those players via free agency. For a team that is already extremely thin that's not a good sign.
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THey can do that, but you think that will endear themselves to big name FAs if they did that? Like cajun is hinting at? I get hanging on while you have Brees, he doesn't have too much longer, no reason to rebuild with him. But maybe they'd be better off seeing what happens this year and trading Brees off to another team after this year.
 
BTW, has anyone considered if the salary cap in the NFL is worthless? We constantly see teams manipulating contracts to stay under, it's rare that a team who really manages the cap well winds up being good. Usually stinky teams have a ton of cap space because they have stinky players.

What if the NFL just ditched the cap and let the owners who want to pay, pay. Institute a system kind of like MLB where you have luxury taxes, etc. I'd also add a poor tax to avoid teams not fielding a competitive enough team. If you don't spend say 60M you get charged a super hefty fine.
 
I can see maybe Brees sign an extension to lower his cap hit, and a few guys take paycuts/bonuses, etc.

One or both of the guards, and cut the likes of Hawthorne, Bunkley, maybe Colston.

But guys like Byrd, Graham arent gonna restructure after signing deals last year.

They can get to the cap limit but signing 2 OL, a CB, and other spots with their situation is pretty wishful thinking.
 
zitothebrave said:
BTW, has anyone considered if the salary cap in the NFL is worthless? We constantly see teams manipulating contracts to stay under, it's rare that a team who really manages the cap well winds up being good. Usually stinky teams have a ton of cap space because they have stinky players.

What if the NFL just ditched the cap and let the owners who want to pay, pay. Institute a system kind of like MLB where you have luxury taxes, etc. I'd also add a poor tax to avoid teams not fielding a competitive enough team. If you don't spend say 60M you get charged a super hefty fine.
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It makes the league competitive.

Without a cap, Seattle could keep everyone from last year.

It's why there's rarely any dynasties anymore.
 
zitothebrave said:
THey can do that, but you think that will endear themselves to big name FAs if they did that? Like cajun is hinting at? I get hanging on while you have Brees, he doesn't have too much longer, no reason to rebuild with him. But maybe they'd be better off seeing what happens this year and trading Brees off to another team after this year.
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It depends. Every team converts these bonuses so I doubt it moves the needle. And I'm not entirely sure how Junior is hurt by doing that.

But I think there is something to be said about accelerating the rebuild to this year. I don't see much upside in the Saints moving forward unless they hit a grand slam in this draft. That team is going to be atrocious once Brees retires/gets hurt/regresses
 
zitothebrave said:
BTW, has anyone considered if the salary cap in the NFL is worthless? We constantly see teams manipulating contracts to stay under, it's rare that a team who really manages the cap well winds up being good. Usually stinky teams have a ton of cap space because they have stinky players.

What if the NFL just ditched the cap and let the owners who want to pay, pay. Institute a system kind of like MLB where you have luxury taxes, etc. I'd also add a poor tax to avoid teams not fielding a competitive enough team. If you don't spend say 60M you get charged a super hefty fine.
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The NFL won't do it because it's transfers money from the owners to the players. In fact, I don't ever foresee the players union being strong enough to collectively bargain something substantially different from the current model.
 
Heyward said:
It makes the league competitive.

Without a cap, Seattle could keep everyone from last year.

It's why there's rarely any dynasties anymore.
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But does it really keep it competitive?

Super bowl teams since 2000

Rams twice
Titans
Ravens
GIants 3 times
Pats 5 times
Panthers
Eagles
Steelers 3 times
Seahawks 3 times
Colts twice
Bears
Cardinals
Saints
Packers
49ers
Broncos

so in 16 superbowls there were 16 distinct teams.

Same thing with the world series

Yankees 4 times
Mets
Diamondbacks
Angels
Giants 4 times
Marlins
Redsox 3 times
Cardinals 4 times
White Sox
Astros
Tigers 2 times
Rockies
Phillies 2 times
Rays 1 time
Rangers 2 times
Royals

So in 30 possible pairings. You have 16 distinct teams. It doesn't really indicate to me that the cap is working .There are still NFL dynasties. they just fall faster because of the NFL player playinv career being much shorter than MLB.

For much more in depth research, read this stark blog post

http://espn.go.com/blog/jayson-star...-has-greater-parity-than-mlb-well-think-again
 
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