jsebe10
Well-known member
Tex was on the bowtie boy because they wanted to send him out in style.
And Dan was a great sign at the time...so dont even. You were super stoked about that trade and sign.
Farewell to Wood, Peraza, Jimmy Johns, and Avilans.
- Thread starter CrimsonCowboy
- Start date
Tex was on the bowtie boy because they wanted to send him out in style.
And Dan was a great sign at the time...so dont even. You were super stoked about that trade and sign.
There's nothing that would indicate Olivera is ready to play 150 games. That would be belief in something with no evidence. I have an issue with our FO making decisions like that.
I mean, the FO could believe Wood is about to go down, Peraza is awful, and Olivera will be a massive stud who is healthy consistently. Sure. But I have an issue with a FO who believes those things without evidence and makes decisions based on those projections.
No FO worth anything would view a guy with Olivera's issues as a good bet to be healthy post-30.
NYCBrave
Well-known member
Correct me if I'm wrong, but since we're the team with assets to offer a team going for it in the playoffs, shouldn't we be in the position of power here? There is no way we should lose out on any trade. If a trade is not a clear cut win, i don't see why'd we'd consider it at this point
This.
Does that mean he ages well? Uggla was a proven major league hitter, Olivera is not.
And yet it appears our FO, which I think is a pretty good one, is willing to take that bet. Look, I don't love the deal at all, so I'm not trying to sell it.
But I do think Hart is a good GM so I'm more willing to give him the benefit of the doubt knowing that he knows FAR MORE about all of these players involved than we do.
Did we have to eat $24 million?
That's kind of the point I'm making, Hart views this as a win - he's not going to care what all the arm-chair GMs think.
He's thinking he just acquired a really good infield bat for some assets he thinks are overvalued. That's is. He could certainly be wrong, but he's not making this deal unless he thinks Olivera is worth all of Wood and Peraza.
zbhargrove
Well-known member
Yes... more athletic players do typically age better.
zitothebrave
Connoisseur of Minors
For the record I was in the pro-trade wood camp. As I'm also pro-trade Miller. Julio, etc. I believe pitchers are an asset that's move valuable to be traded then kept with a few exceptions. The exceptions being a rich team, or one of the few talented and durable pitchers (King Felix, Kershaw, Price)
Plus his entire career he's walked more than he's K'd
Can you provide support for this? In specific guys with the body type of Olivera and not little speedsters.
striker42
Well-known member
I think they're fairly comparable in many respects. Uggla was a pure power guy and Olivera is more a line drive hitter but they have similarities. Uggla had terrific bat speed for years and relied on that. Despite apparently being a workout freak, there started to be warning signs Uggla's bat speed was falling off at age 30. There were rumblings the Fish wanted to trade him because they thought he was set to decline. Sure enough, he comes to Atlanta and almost instantly collapses. His bat got slower and slower in Atlanta until he was useless.
The big thing you hear about Olivera is the bat speed. It's his chief selling point. When that starts dropping there's a good bet you'll see a rapid decline. Perhaps a better batting eye will allow him to slow his decline but often slower bat speed robs hitters of their ability to wait until they recognize the pitch.
zbhargrove
Well-known member
Me too... but not for this return... I wouldn't even trade Wood straight up for Olivera. Although I will be excited about watching Olivera.... this is too much.
Also, let's look at what Olivera actually did in Cuba and compare it with a guy like Jose Abreu.
Olivera, from 22-26, OPS'd at .924-1.088. Very good. He came back at 28 and put up an .885 OPS. Good.
Abreu put up a .962 OPS at 18 and from 22-24 OPS'd at 1.376, 1.583, and 1.379. Much better even than Olivera.
Abreu put up a .964 OPS last year at 27 and this year has dropped to .836. So I would not in any way expect better than that from Olivera, especially not post-30 after not playing that much over a 4-year period. Abreu did absurd things in Cuba, was very good last year, and this year has merely been good. Olivera did good things in Cuba, so why should anyone expect him to be better than simply pretty good?
Olivera, from 22-26, OPS'd at .924-1.088. Very good. He came back at 28 and put up an .885 OPS. Good.
Abreu put up a .962 OPS at 18 and from 22-24 OPS'd at 1.376, 1.583, and 1.379. Much better even than Olivera.
Abreu put up a .964 OPS last year at 27 and this year has dropped to .836. So I would not in any way expect better than that from Olivera, especially not post-30 after not playing that much over a 4-year period. Abreu did absurd things in Cuba, was very good last year, and this year has merely been good. Olivera did good things in Cuba, so why should anyone expect him to be better than simply pretty good?
Russ2dollas
10 yr, $185 million Extension
I think we should be in power. Selling only if we feel we get true difference makers. I cannot rationalize the trade. If we give up all of those assets, IMO we need a minimum of two long term solutions at position players. Even if we had a wink wink with Price to sign with us (which we all no we can't and DON'T). Even if a guy like Price was coming and free, it doesn't mean you give away Alex Wood for 50 cents on the dollar.
Orphan Black
Approaching Buddy Hernandez Territory
Stark just said this
Meanwhile, the Dodgers have no plans of including Alex Wood — if they acquire him — in deals to any other teams, Jayson Stark of ESPN.com tweets.
Meanwhile, the Dodgers have no plans of including Alex Wood — if they acquire him — in deals to any other teams, Jayson Stark of ESPN.com tweets.
yeezus
It's OVER 5,000!
disagree.
weso1
<B>Clique Leader</B>
There were live ab's there. Scouting reports are very positive in regards to his approach.