Farewell to Wood, Peraza, Jimmy Johns, and Avilans.

[weso1]

Because we gave up two good future pieces for a broken 30-year-old.

I said we're still trying to build long-term, but just as I liked the Kimbrel move because it sacrificed current value for future, I dislike this even more because it sacrifices long-term value for current.

I was ok with dealing Wood and Peraza, but I wanted similar long-term value at different positions for them, not current value.

Wood is going to start getting expensive beyond 2017, so not really a gaurantee long term pitcher for us. So we really only gave up one true long term prospect. But we got a 20 year old pitcher and a draft pick back for him.

 

[bravesnumberone]

Wood is going to start getting expensive beyond 2017, so not really a gaurantee long term pitcher for us. So we really only gave up one true long term prospect. But we got a 20 year old pitcher and a draft pick back for him.

And Wood could have helped us win in 2017. Which I thought was this organization's goal.

 

[cajunrevenge]

I think I am at the point where I can't really acknowledge any success the Dodgers will have because they arent playing anywhere close to a level playing field as 90% of other teams. It might not be against the rules technically but it's worse than a player using steroids in my book. I hate selling players for money. We could have had this guy and Wood/Peraza too.

Olivera has some good upside and he looks like a RH Anthony Rendon both for good and bad reasons.

 

[yeezus]

Who? Can you show me someone who projects better than .280 with 20 HR?

Scouts seem to love him. I know Badler likes him a lot, though I can't look up much right now. FG seems to be on the lower end of him.
Besides, .280 with high walks, low-ish Ks, and with 20 homers at 2nd or 3rd is pretty damn good.

 

[smootness]

I think a few are underrating how highly LA thought of Bird. There is something there his numbers to date aren't showing. I think he could be a real find in this thing.

On a side note, addition by subtraction with Avilan. If Paco, Withrow, Winkler, Simmons, Viz, and a few others step up next year, GAH dang what a pen.

Bird's not nothing, but he's not close to a guy like De Leon right now. And had it been Olivera and De Leon, I would have accepted it but still not loved it.

 

[smootness]

Scouts seem to love him. I know Badler likes him a lot, though I can't look up much right now. FG seems to be on the lower end of him.
Besides, .280 with high walks, low-ish Ks, and with 20 homers at 2nd or 3rd is pretty damn good.

Again, that's his upside, and he's not likely to give you high walks. He'll give you some walks, a few more than somebody like Cespedes. He's not a walk machine.

I said .270/.320/.450, giles suggested .285/.330/.450. I think both are reasonable as an immediate upside, with regression from that point forward likely, even if healthy.

 

[striker42]

Here's my prediction on Olivera:

The Braves say he should be ready to come off the DL and start for the major league club in a couple weeks. I predict the hamstring injury will continue to be a problem, he'll have setbacks, and we wont see him until September. He'll get a little playing time, collect some hits, then get shut down for a minor injury for the last few weeks because there's no reason to play him hurt in meaningless games.

He'll come to ST next year and just rack up the hits. He'll wow everyone with rockets all over the field. However, late in ST he'll suffer some sort of injury to something like his wrist that will cause him to start the year on the DL. He'll be on and off the DL all year next year with a procession of minor injuries. He'll show flashes of talent and the Braves will call it a lost year.

His elbow will go the next year and he'll miss all, or nearly all, of 2017 with TJ surgery.

He'll be back in 2018 but his bat will have finally slowed. He'll play in a little over half the games, hit around .240 with 5-6 HRs.

By 2019 the Braves will be looking to trade him and they'll find some team willing to take him as a bench player with the Braves chipping in some extra cash.

I don't find this prediction at all unlikely. In fact, I find an injury marred career full of disappointment and underachievement to be the most likely scenario.

 

[sturg33]

Here's my prediction on Olivera:

The Braves say he should be ready to come off the DL and start for the major league club in a couple weeks. I predict the hamstring injury will continue to be a problem, he'll have setbacks, and we wont see him until September. He'll get a little playing time, collect some hits, then get shut down for a minor injury for the last few weeks because there's no reason to play him hurt in meaningless games.

He'll come to ST next year and just rack up the hits. He'll wow everyone with rockets all over the field. However, late in ST he'll suffer some sort of injury to something like his wrist that will cause him to start the year on the DL. He'll be on and off the DL all year next year with a procession of minor injuries. He'll show flashes of talent and the Braves will call it a lost year.

His elbow will go the next year and he'll miss all, or nearly all, of 2017 with TJ surgery.

He'll be back in 2018 but his bat will have finally slowed. He'll play in a little over half the games, hit around .240 with 5-6 HRs.

By 2019 the Braves will be looking to trade him and they'll find some team willing to take him as a bench player with the Braves chipping in some extra cash.

I don't find this prediction at all unlikely. In fact, I find an injury marred career full of disappointment and underachievement to be the most likely scenario.

This is certainly more likely than him being healthy for the next 5 years

 

[Tapate50]

Here's my prediction on Olivera:

The Braves say he should be ready to come off the DL and start for the major league club in a couple weeks. I predict the hamstring injury will continue to be a problem, he'll have setbacks, and we wont see him until September. He'll get a little playing time, collect some hits, then get shut down for a minor injury for the last few weeks because there's no reason to play him hurt in meaningless games.

He'll come to ST next year and just rack up the hits. He'll wow everyone with rockets all over the field. However, late in ST he'll suffer some sort of injury to something like his wrist that will cause him to start the year on the DL. He'll be on and off the DL all year next year with a procession of minor injuries. He'll show flashes of talent and the Braves will call it a lost year.

His elbow will go the next year and he'll miss all, or nearly all, of 2017 with TJ surgery.

He'll be back in 2018 but his bat will have finally slowed. He'll play in a little over half the games, hit around .240 with 5-6 HRs.

By 2019 the Braves will be looking to trade him and they'll find some team willing to take him as a bench player with the Braves chipping in some extra cash.

I don't find this prediction at all unlikely. In fact, I find an injury marred career full of disappointment and underachievement to be the most likely scenario.

Jeez

 

[jimsnores]

Here's my prediction on Olivera:

The Braves say he should be ready to come off the DL and start for the major league club in a couple weeks. I predict the hamstring injury will continue to be a problem, he'll have setbacks, and we wont see him until September. He'll get a little playing time, collect some hits, then get shut down for a minor injury for the last few weeks because there's no reason to play him hurt in meaningless games.

He'll come to ST next year and just rack up the hits. He'll wow everyone with rockets all over the field. However, late in ST he'll suffer some sort of injury to something like his wrist that will cause him to start the year on the DL. He'll be on and off the DL all year next year with a procession of minor injuries. He'll show flashes of talent and the Braves will call it a lost year.

His elbow will go the next year and he'll miss all, or nearly all, of 2017 with TJ surgery.

He'll be back in 2018 but his bat will have finally slowed. He'll play in a little over half the games, hit around .240 with 5-6 HRs.

By 2019 the Braves will be looking to trade him and they'll find some team willing to take him as a bench player with the Braves chipping in some extra cash.

I don't find this prediction at all unlikely. In fact, I find an injury marred career full of disappointment and underachievement to be the most likely scenario.

If you're going to be so specific with a dire prediction, make it even more depressing.....say, in the 2018 year that he finally plays (poorly), he strikes out to end the wildcard playoff game against the Dodgers, as Alex Wood finishes his complete game 1-0 shutout in our new ballpark.

 

[smootness]

I would rank the pieces in this as such:

1. Wood

sizable gap

2. Olivera

3. Peraza

4. draft pick

5. Bird

6. Jim Johnson

7. money from Arroyo

8. Avilan

So to make up for the gap between Wood and Olivera, they gave us...4, 5, and 7 while we gave up 3, 6, and 8? That's dumb.

 

[DirkPiggler]

If you're going to be so specific with a dire prediction, make it even more depressing.....say, in the 2018 year that he finally plays (poorly), he strikes out to end the wildcard playoff game against the Dodgers, as Alex Wood finishes his complete game 1-0 shutout in our new ballpark.

The one run coming on a Peraza HR with two out in the eighth, while our lights out closer Chris Withrow is warming up.

 

[PurpleBrave]

So all told, Atlanta gets a Cuban guy they offered $40MM for this offseason for $30MM for the next 5 years, plus Toussaint, Paco Rodriguez, Bird, and the Marlins' competitive balance pick for Gosselin, Wood, Peraza, Johnson, Avilan.

That's not bad, I guess.

 

[dak]

I would rank the pieces in this as such:

1. Wood

sizable gap

2. Olivera

3. Peraza

4. draft pick
5. Bird
6. Jim Johnson
7. money from Arroyo
8. Avilan

So to make up for the gap between Wood and Olivera, they gave us...4, 5, and 7 while we gave up 3, 6, and 8? That's dumb.

Money from Arroyo should be moved up to 5, IMO. Would be surprised if it's not at least the $4.5m buyout. Also, I'd put Paco either just ahead or just behind Bird.

 

[CyYoung31]

Here's my prediction on Olivera:

The Braves say he should be ready to come off the DL and start for the major league club in a couple weeks. I predict the hamstring injury will continue to be a problem, he'll have setbacks, and we wont see him until September. He'll get a little playing time, collect some hits, then get shut down for a minor injury for the last few weeks because there's no reason to play him hurt in meaningless games.

He'll come to ST next year and just rack up the hits. He'll wow everyone with rockets all over the field. However, late in ST he'll suffer some sort of injury to something like his wrist that will cause him to start the year on the DL. He'll be on and off the DL all year next year with a procession of minor injuries. He'll show flashes of talent and the Braves will call it a lost year.

His elbow will go the next year and he'll miss all, or nearly all, of 2017 with TJ surgery.

He'll be back in 2018 but his bat will have finally slowed. He'll play in a little over half the games, hit around .240 with 5-6 HRs.

By 2019 the Braves will be looking to trade him and they'll find some team willing to take him as a bench player with the Braves chipping in some extra cash.

I don't find this prediction at all unlikely. In fact, I find an injury marred career full of disappointment and underachievement to be the most likely scenario.

You must be a joy to be around. Just delightful.

 

[bravesfanforlife88]

So all told, Atlanta gets a Cuban guy they offered $40MM for this offseason for $30MM for the next 5 years, plus Toussaint, Paco Rodriguez, Bird, and the Marlins' competitive balance pick for Gosselin, Wood, Peraza, Johnson, Avilan.

That's not bad, I guess.

The addition of arroyo to the deal is key

 

[bravesnumberone]

Shanks trying to justify it by comparing piece by piece between the two teams. Not unlike going position by position and saying whoever is better on paper at more positions is the better team.

 

[SidSlid92]

The addition of arroyo to the deal is key

Doesn't improve it at all for us. Eat the Arroyo money and make the Dosgers include better prospects.

This notion that we will suddenly go and out bid teams for Heyward, Upton or Price is a pure pipe dream and realistically highly unlikely. You can't do business that way. Eat the money, get better long term pieces.

 

[smootness]

So all told, Atlanta gets a Cuban guy they offered $40MM for this offseason for $30MM for the next 5 years, plus Toussaint, Paco Rodriguez, Bird, and the Marlins' competitive balance pick for Gosselin, Wood, Peraza, Johnson, Avilan.

That's not bad, I guess.

If that's all I knew, I'd say, 'Ok, so we clearly got Toussaint and a pick for Wood, but what else did we get in that deal? I guess we saved some money and got Olivera for Peraza and Johnson, and Bird and Paco for Avilan and Gosselin.

So I would still wonder what else we got from the D-Backs. This deal has meant turning Toussaint for Gosselin straight up into an ultimate loss in value. That's pretty incredible.

 

[bravesfanforlife88]

I'm not saying we are going out to get a price upton or Hayward but maybe it allows us to make an additional move outside of what we could have done otherwise