REAL FOOTBALL Thread

gilesfan said:
Well, I don't really think 40 time means anything.

http://network.yardbarker.com/nfl/a...e_burst_and_moves_for_such_a_big_man/19391233


He's certainly now a slow, lumbering running back. Its obviously early, but he's shown signs to be much quicker and frankly better than he was billed.
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He had the angle because they stuck their head inside (flat out poor technique) and was run down by four Cleveland Browns (including a DLinemen) pretty quickly on a run he likely should have taken to the house.

I wasn't looking at 40 times. I looked at Short Shuttle and 3 Cone. They both measure quickness and I guess what you are referring to as "burst". He wasn't in the top 10 at his position in either I don't think.
 
Stupid to be arguing this but, I don't see how your description is even close to accurate. There is a safety that had 10 yards on him and the angle to cut him off. The DL doesn't even come close to running him down. And he out runs number 24, who I assume is a corner.
 
gilesfan said:
Stupid to be arguing this but, I don't see how your description is even close to accurate. There is a safety that had 10 yards on him and the angle to cut him off. The DL doesn't even come close to running him down. And he out runs number 24, who I assume is a corner.
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It is stupid to argue against measured numbers and claiming otherwise by "watching".

You are like the "thethe" of redskins football.
 
Tapate50 said:
It is stupid to argue against measured numbers and claiming otherwise by "watching".

You are like the "thethe" of redskins football.
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If I said Jones was going to be a pro bowler or something. I said he's been much better than what he was billed coming out of college and has a better burst than what he was given credit for. (something essentially everyone is saying about him) I said I hope he can be a future part of a running back by committee type approach). The Skins were heavily criticized (including by you) for drafting Jones in the 3rd round, which looks like it's going to be a good selection. That's nothing like thethe.

But, keep hyping up Justin Hardy and Leonard Hankerson while calling others homers.....
 
gilesfan said:
If I said Jones was going to be a pro bowler or something. I said he's been much better than what he was billed coming out of college and has a better burst than what he was given credit for. (something essentially everyone is saying about him) I said I hope he can be a future part of a running back by committee type approach). The Skins were heavily criticized (including by you) for drafting Jones in the 3rd round, which looks like it's going to be a good selection. That's nothing like thethe.

But, keep hyping up Justin Hardy and Leonard Hankerson while calling others homers.....
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I didn't think Jones was much to talk about coming out of UF. Still don't really. He may be a solid contributor. I don't like UF but when his numbers were as below averagish at the combine as they were I had real doubts. I think BGE is a great comp and probably ceiling (which was pretty good actually).

You keep saying he is showing "burst" when his combine numbers clearly indicate otherwise. Maybe you see what you want, but clearly he has run stopwatched drills that show "burst" and he was at the middle to lower side of the pack vs the rest of the ragingly mediocre class other than Gordon and Gurley (who didn't test).

Maybe he gets magically faster and quicker on the field? Its just an odd thing to say contradicting the numbers.

It really isn't worth arguing over but you really harp on people on the baseball side about the exact same thing. Thats the only reason I mentioned it really.
 
Tapate50 said:
I didn't think Jones was much to talk about coming out of UF. Still don't really. He may be a solid contributor. I don't like UF but when his numbers were as below averagish at the combine as they were I had real doubts. I think BGE is a great comp and probably ceiling (which was pretty good actually).

You keep saying he is showing "burst" when his combine numbers clearly indicate otherwise. Maybe you see what you want, but clearly he has run stopwatched drills that show "burst" and he was at the middle to lower side of the pack vs the rest of the ragingly mediocre class other than Gordon and Gurley (who didn't test).

Maybe he gets magically faster and quicker on the field? Its just an odd thing to say contradicting the numbers.

It really isn't worth arguing over but you really harp on people on the baseball side about the exact same thing. Thats the only reason I mentioned it really.
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Yes, I think guys can play faster or slower on the football field than what their relative combine stats show. People that study and prepare for the 40 can run a great 40 time. Either way, a 4.6 time for a running back isn't slow. Hell, that's slightly below Giovani Bernanrd and faster than guys like Montee Ball and Joseph Randle.

20 reps...not bad for a RB
20 yard shuttle of 4.2 is good for a running back.
No 3 cone at combine, but did 6.8 in workouts, which is excellent for a RB.

Where do you even get below average for the combine? Any other measures for "burst" because so far he's looking good.
 
Saw a lot of Matt Jones while he played at UF. And was equally unimpressed. Not great vision and never made many people miss, depsite very good OLs the entire time he there.

That being said, it's certainly possible young RBs can get better, and sometimes find perfect fits in certain systems. I was never particularly impressed with Arain Foster when he played for UT. Flashed some excellence but was overshadowed by poor ball control and a poor vision quite often. Obviously something changed once he signed with the Texans as an UDFA.
 
gilesfan said:
Yes, I think guys can play faster or slower on the football field than what their relative combine stats show. People that study and prepare for the 40 can run a great 40 time. Either way, a 4.6 time for a running back isn't slow. Hell, that's slightly below Giovani Bernanrd and faster than guys like Montee Ball and Joseph Randle.

20 reps...not bad for a RB
20 yard shuttle of 4.2 is good for a running back.
No 3 cone at combine, but did 6.8 in workouts, which is excellent for a RB.

Where do you even get below average for the combine? Any other measures for "burst" because so far he's looking good.
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He wasn't in the top ten in any event measuring "burst" for his mediocre class (other than Gurley and Gordon) and mostly toward the back of the class. Seems pretty fair to me. Washington has a habit of getting a lot out of their RBs so he may be a fine option, but I don't expect anything other than league average. Having a running QB should help him a bit.

I just think your eyes deceive you. A common theme from the baseball side that you like to be a dick about. Just ironic to me.
 
Tapate50 said:
He wasn't in the top ten in any event measuring "burst" for his mediocre class (other than Gurley and Gordon) and mostly toward the back of the class. Seems pretty fair to me. Washington has a habit of getting a lot out of their RBs so he may be a fine option, but I don't expect anything other than league average. Having a running QB should help him a bit.

I just think your eyes deceive you. A common theme from the baseball side that you like to be a dick about. Just ironic to me.
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League average RB would be awesome and fit my commentary as it would be better than he was projected.

Being as you thought he was a scrub, then maybe your eyes deceive you.
 
gilesfan said:
League average RB would be awesome and fit my commentary as it would be better than he was projected.

Being as you thought he was a scrub, then maybe your eyes deceive you.
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He wasn't that good at UF behind an excellent line. I use that data a little more than a handful of preseason carries but that's just me. Maybe he does get burst and runs faster after putting on pads and a helmet, but I think that's football speak at its finest.
 
Speaking of silly preseason hype, the Falcons look fantastic. I'm worried about depth in a few areas, but the starting 22 look like they could compete with just about anybody.
 
chop2chip said:
Speaking of silly preseason hype, the Falcons look fantastic. I'm worried about depth in a few areas, but the starting 22 look like they could compete with just about anybody.
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They have to be favorite and should win if defense is anywhere in top half of NFL.
 
Tapate50 said:
He wasn't that good at UF behind an excellent line. I use that data a little more than a handful of preseason carries but that's just me. Maybe he does get burst and runs faster after putting on pads and a helmet, but I think that's football speak at its finest.
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He averaged 5 yards a carry on a team that couldnt complete a pass and had solid combine numbers for a RB.
 
gilesfan said:
He averaged 5 yards a carry on a team that couldnt complete a pass and had solid combine numbers for a RB.
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You watched probably zero games of Florida. He did the majority of that damage in 3 games vs defenses that were pretty awful at stopping the run. The rest of the year he was fairly non-existent, much like his whole career at Florida.

Now he could very well turn out to be the next Marshawn Lynch and surprise everybody. But none of that disproves what Tapate said. He was unimpressive at Florida and his combine numbers were middle of the pack.
 
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