Hypothetically speaking...

[ixiXSolidXixi]

Any idea what should cost us Wil Myers from the padres?

 

[Enscheff]

Short of almost an entire roster overhaul this team isn't 20 games better next season.

I would say a new player at SS, 2B, 3B, C and LF, plus an arm for the BP is about as close to a roster overhaul as a team can realistically do in a single offseason. And that's exactly what everyone is proposing.

Do you even read the threads before you reply?

 

[Enscheff]

Yulieski Gurriel is another interesting name to think about for 3b. He could be signed now, spend a couple weeks at AAA getting up to speed, and then be the guy at 3b for the next few years.

I expect him to sign a 4-5 year deal for $10m-$12m per year.

 

[clvclv]

Yulieski Gurriel is another interesting name to think about for 3b. He could be signed now, spend a couple weeks at AAA getting up to speed, and then be the guy at 3b for the next few years.

I expect him to sign a 4-5 year deal for $10m-$12m per year.

Hold onto your hat - won't be long before you get the Olivera screamers riled up!!!

 

[Russ2dollas]

I still thank we need the blockbuster. Tehran viz and taking sandovals deal solves all of the sox problems. Will the sox clear the farm for that?

Edit bc I know some will get tired of selling mlb for prospects. But we should get players in a deal like that who play for us in 17 and play really well.

Benintindi could be a stud this yr. travis has some scouts who think he can play lf. If he can play lf he'd be a huge upgrade bc he can hit.

They have lots of options. I assume m
Decree and Montana would be untouchable

 

[UNCBlue012]

I still thank we need the blockbuster. Tehran viz and taking sandovals deal solves all of the sox problems. Will the sox clear the farm for that?

Edit bc I know some will get tired of selling mlb for prospects. But we should get players in a deal like that who play for us in 17 and play really well.

Benintindi could be a stud this yr. travis has some scouts who think he can play lf. If he can play lf he'd be a huge upgrade bc he can hit.

They have lots of options. I assume m
Decree and Montana would be untouchable

I actually agree with you. Adding Teheran and Viz and relieving them financially would be unbelievable for any team. Yes, they'd have to give up a crap-ton, but it's worth it.

 

[Russ2dollas]

I actually agree with you. Adding Teheran and Viz and relieving them financially would be unbelievable for any team. Yes, they'd have to give up a crap-ton, but it's worth it.

Thank you. B/c most think I'm crazy.
Sandoval is owed like 18 million in 17, 19 million in 18 and 19 and a 5 million buy out. There is a chance he becomes a useful player, small chance. We have like 40 million in dead money now and we're under budget. I'm thinking we'd have to have benintindi. After that maybe Travis if you think he can play LF. Chavis seems like another Riley. Probably need espinoza or kopech. Then some bp arms or longer away hitting options.

I don't think I'd do all of that if I didn't think Travis was a LF option. My original thought was benintindi + travis give you two legit, controllable, cheap and upside hitters in the corners to pair with Mallex or Inciarte. IF travis can't field that well you have Mallex as a platoon or late inning defensive sub. From a hitting perspective Travis + Inciarte/Mallex + Benintindi is a cheap and really talented. Should be plus hitting at most spots and really good D in CF and RF.

It would be tough but I think we're more likely to be able to replace Tehran and Viz than get impact bats........but it's not a slam dunk. If you could get Devers and Benintindi.....wow.

Maybe they take Olivera back to even salary some and just cut him.

 

[Chico]

I fully expect us to be big players in the free agent market this year. We're going to have 50-60 million to spend and the main objective is going to be selling tickets to get ancillary revenue from the complex. They're going to make a splash this offseason.

 

[praeceps93]

Yulieski Gurriel is another interesting name to think about for 3b. He could be signed now, spend a couple weeks at AAA getting up to speed, and then be the guy at 3b for the next few years.

I expect him to sign a 4-5 year deal for $10m-$12m per year.

I really do think we should make a run at him. We have the payroll, have the need, and DEFINITELY have the desire to sign his younger, 22 year old brother that's also super hyped.

 

[Southcack77]

This is my problem with you guys that say they won't play. You hedge to make the argument fit whichever way you want it to go.

The two top free-agent bats that will be available this year are going to be Cespedes and Desmond. Both are going to get $20+ million per each. That IS the top of the market this winter, and there's absolutely no reason the Braves shouldn't be "in" on both of them since they're perfect fits.

I realize the total contract dollars is your "out", but you're just playing the semantics game. The two top bats would likely cost the Braves $275 million - 5/$100 million for Desmond and 5/$175 for Cespedes, and they can easily afford that. That's still $50 million less than Stanton's deal with Miami.

The biggest contract the organization has ever handed out before Freeman's deal was less than $100 million, sure. The problem is that you're not allowing for the change in economics league-wide. Freeman's deal looks like a bargain, and it's the biggest contract in team history.

I realize it's tough to grasp, but a $175 million outlay for Cespedes these days isn't much different than Chipper's largest deal when adjusted. I also understand that everyone loves to hate on the brass for floating the idea that the club could be competitive as early as next season. They didn't come up with that idea without coming to the realization that they were going to spend substantial money to fill a hole or two to make that happen. They were smart enough to understand ALL the "answers" weren't coming from within - no matter how many prospects and picks they were going to be able to acquire.

Bigger question is why would you want to pay Cespedes at 31 like a HOF in his prime or pay Ian Desmond at all?

 

[rawwr]

Bigger question is why would you want to pay Cespedes at 31 like a HOF in his prime or pay Ian Desmond at all?

Ian Desmond has been one of the best players in baseball this year, and very good for 4 of the last 5 seasons. I'm not sure why you wouldn't want to pay him, assuming he's not asking for more than the post you quoted.

 

[Enscheff]

Ian Desmond has been one of the best players in baseball this year, and very good for 4 of the last 5 seasons. I'm not sure why you wouldn't want to pay him, assuming he's not asking for more than the post you quoted.

I wouldn't go anywhere near the contracts clv posted for Ces or Desmond.

MLBTR pegs Ces as being the only FA that will top $100M this offseason. Last offseason he was looking for something in the range of 6/150, and nobody bit. The Nats offered him something in the neighborhood of 5/100 with many deferrals. I would be surprised if he gets more than 5/110 plus an option year or 2 this offseason.

MLBTR says Desmond is in line for a 3 year deal, so giving him $100M over 5 years would be asinine. If he continues to hit well I could see him getting something along the lines of 4/75 or 5/90. He looks to have regained his 3.5-4 WAR form though, which would make him plenty valuable to a team with a hole in LF or 3B.

 

[clvclv]

I wouldn't go anywhere near the contracts clv posted for Ces or Desmond.

MLBTR pegs Ces as being the only FA that will top $100M this offseason. Last offseason he was looking for something in the range of 6/150, and nobody bit. The Nats offered him something in the neighborhood of 5/100 with many deferrals. I would be surprised if he gets more than 5/110 plus an option year or 2 this offseason.

MLBTR says Desmond is in line for a 3 year deal, so giving him $100M over 5 years would be asinine. If he continues to hit well I could see him getting something along the lines of 4/75 or 5/90. He looks to have regained his 3.5-4 WAR form though, which would make him plenty valuable to a team with a hole in LF or 3B.

My "numbers" were just tossed out there to stress the point that the Braves CAN afford to play at the top end of the free-agent market now that the system's been overhauled - not to reflect an exact bid. You even agree that we can (and should) play on those guys if the intent is to be relevant in 2017 and 2018. With $60+ million to play with, we could even afford both AND a mid-rotation veteran arm if they think Albies and Swanson are going to be significant upgrades, and you could argue (as John was pointing out) that this team COULD become real competitive real quick if they added the few pieces that are available - even in this *hitty free-agent class - because they actually fit where our holes are.

If you meet Cespedes' asking price, are willing to sacrifice a second round pick to add Desmond to fill the long-unfilled hole at 3B, and add a Catcher that can hit a bit, this team could become a legitimate contender almost overnight. Trade Markakis for a middling prospect to spend his money on a veteran rotation piece instead of shopping at the Dollar Store, and you are a threat - even if Swanson and Albies aren't better than league-average for a little bit. No, you wouldn't have an "Ace" by present-day definition, but the pitching depth we have is already close to unmatched and if one or two guys take steps forward our 1-5 would stand up with anyone's. I actually prefer going the way you point out at 3B - signing Gurriel - both because it'd save us that pick PLUS give us an inside edge if we wanted to play on Lourdes, but figure many people would go nuts and scream about the Olivera mess.

Julio, Folty, Wisler, Blair, Gant, Williams, Ellis, etc. are good enough to keep the present team in most games. If you added a couple bats with pop and a veteran arm to help slot everyone a spot lower in the rotation, this team could realistically be competitive as early as next spring.

 

[rawwr]

I wouldn't go anywhere near the contracts clv posted for Ces or Desmond.

MLBTR pegs Ces as being the only FA that will top $100M this offseason. Last offseason he was looking for something in the range of 6/150, and nobody bit. The Nats offered him something in the neighborhood of 5/100 with many deferrals. I would be surprised if he gets more than 5/110 plus an option year or 2 this offseason.

MLBTR says Desmond is in line for a 3 year deal, so giving him $100M over 5 years would be asinine. If he continues to hit well I could see him getting something along the lines of 4/75 or 5/90. He looks to have regained his 3.5-4 WAR form though, which would make him plenty valuable to a team with a hole in LF or 3B.

I would be pretty happy if the Braves got Desmond for 4/75.

 

[bravos4evr]

Thank you. B/c most think I'm crazy.

Sandoval is owed like 18 million in 17, 19 million in 18 and 19 and a 5 million buy out. There is a chance he becomes a useful player, small chance. We have like 40 million in dead money now and we're under budget. I'm thinking we'd have to have benintindi. After that maybe Travis if you think he can play LF. Chavis seems like another Riley. Probably need espinoza or kopech. Then some bp arms or longer away hitting options.

I don't think I'd do all of that if I didn't think Travis was a LF option. My original thought was benintindi + travis give you two legit, controllable, cheap and upside hitters in the corners to pair with Mallex or Inciarte. IF travis can't field that well you have Mallex as a platoon or late inning defensive sub. From a hitting perspective Travis + Inciarte/Mallex + Benintindi is a cheap and really talented. Should be plus hitting at most spots and really good D in CF and RF.

It would be tough but I think we're more likely to be able to replace Tehran and Viz than get impact bats........but it's not a slam dunk. If you could get Devers and Benintindi.....wow.

Maybe they take Olivera back to even salary some and just cut him.

crazy? no, but your idea is unwise

 

[Southcack77]

I would be pretty happy if the Braves got Desmond for 4/75.

I think they would regret it.

I would only sign Desmond on a big short term deal or at a really bargain rate long term and that isn't happening.

I guess he's doable for Atlanta in theory but the fact he's one of the more attractive free agents suggests he will be quite pricy.

 

[Enscheff]

My "numbers" were just tossed out there to stress the point that the Braves CAN afford to play at the top end of the free-agent market now that the system's been overhauled - not to reflect an exact bid. You even agree that we can (and should) play on those guys if the intent is to be relevant in 2017 and 2018. With $60+ million to play with, we could even afford both AND a mid-rotation veteran arm if they think Albies and Swanson are going to be significant upgrades, and you could argue (as John was pointing out) that this team COULD become real competitive real quick if they added the few pieces that are available - even in this *hitty free-agent class - because they actually fit where our holes are.

If you meet Cespedes' asking price, are willing to sacrifice a second round pick to add Desmond to fill the long-unfilled hole at 3B, and add a Catcher that can hit a bit, this team could become a legitimate contender almost overnight. Trade Markakis for a middling prospect to spend his money on a veteran rotation piece instead of shopping at the Dollar Store, and you are a threat - even if Swanson and Albies aren't better than league-average for a little bit. No, you wouldn't have an "Ace" by present-day definition, but the pitching depth we have is already close to unmatched and if one or two guys take steps forward our 1-5 would stand up with anyone's. I actually prefer going the way you point out at 3B - signing Gurriel - both because it'd save us that pick PLUS give us an inside edge if we wanted to play on Lourdes, but figure many people would go nuts and scream about the Olivera mess.

Julio, Folty, Wisler, Blair, Gant, Williams, Ellis, etc. are good enough to keep the present team in most games. If you added a couple bats with pop and a veteran arm to help slot everyone a spot lower in the rotation, this team could realistically be competitive as early as next spring.

If playing at the top of the FA market means paying Ces $110M, then yes, I think they should. I think they should have done so this past offseason when he was willing to sign at a bargain rate. It would have been a great move for the future in my opinion.

When I say the Braves are not going to play at the top of the market I mean for guys like Price, Strasburg and Harper. Guys that will require about 2x the contract Ces is going to get.

You don't have to convince me that the Braves can be decent next year. I think adding Swanson at SS, Albies at 2B, Desmond for 3B, Ces for LF and Castro for C makes this an 80 win team that can push for a WC spot if the young pitching progresses.

 

[Millwood1Hitter]

I fully expect us to be big players in the free agent market this year. We're going to have 50-60 million to spend and the main objective is going to be selling tickets to get ancillary revenue from the complex. They're going to make a splash this offseason.

Except there is only one problem with that, there is no one to make a splash on. The upcoming free agent pool is dreadful, honestly one of the worst if not the worst list that I have ever seen. It's putrid, and even worst, is you know most of those guys are going to get way overpaid for their worth.

 

[Southcack77]

If playing at the top of the FA market means paying Ces $110M, then yes, I think they should. I think they should have done so this past offseason when he was willing to sign at a bargain rate. It would have been a great move for the future in my opinion.

When I say the Braves are not going to play at the top of the market I mean for guys like Price, Strasburg and Harper. Guys that will require about 2x the contract Ces is going to get.

You don't have to convince me that the Braves can be decent next year. I think adding Swanson at SS, Albies at 2B, Desmond for 3B, Ces for LF and Castro for C makes this an 80 win team that can push for a WC spot if the young pitching progresses.

I wouldn't necessarily say plugging in Swanson and Albies next year really addresses the weakness at those positions or the weak hitting overall. It might, but they haven't proven themselves at AA and AAA respectively just yet. One would imagine they might struggle in the majors next season.

I don't see much reason for the Braves to push it next year. I think they should be measured in how they allot their still limited resources. Blowing their budget on two unwise long term deals simply because there wasn't really anyone else and the team wanted to have a chance at winning 80 games doesn't seem like a very good investment.

The last bit of patience in a tear down/rebuild is an important part of the deal, IMO.

 

[auyushu]

Thank you. B/c most think I'm crazy.
Sandoval is owed like 18 million in 17, 19 million in 18 and 19 and a 5 million buy out. There is a chance he becomes a useful player, small chance. We have like 40 million in dead money now and we're under budget. I'm thinking we'd have to have benintindi. After that maybe Travis if you think he can play LF. Chavis seems like another Riley. Probably need espinoza or kopech. Then some bp arms or longer away hitting options.

As much as I was arguing with folks about being crazy thinking we could possibly get Moncada for Julio, you are going way too far in the other direction. If we are giving them Julio, Viz, AND taking on Panda's horrible contract we need to be getting their next 4-5 best prospects behind Moncada.

I would want something like Benintendi, Espinoza, Devers, and Kopech at least to consider make that move (and I'd probably want them to take on Olivera).