Viz and Teheran listed as top trade candidates

dak said:
This #AskCoppy thing is unreal. He's amazingly forthcoming and dropping a ton of nuggets about the team's thinking a go-forward approach.
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agreed... perhaps a bit too forthcoming, but refreshing to read he gets it that the offense is abysmal
 
yeezus said:
Coppy just said he finds defensive metrics overrated and certain players get overvalued for their defense. "not naming names" he said. by saying that he's basically naming Jason Heyward.
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looks like John Schuerholz has gotten to him..... The thing is, he has no evidence in which to back up his claim, there is an equal chance that defensive metrics UNDERRATE players as overrate them.
 
bravos4evr said:
looks like John Schuerholz has gotten to him..... The thing is, he has no evidence in which to back up his claim, there is an equal chance that defensive metrics UNDERRATE players as overrate them.
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how do you know he doesn't have evidence? or at least his/their own way of evaluating that stuff?
 
yeezus said:
how do you know he doesn't have evidence? or at least his/their own way of evaluating that stuff?
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because NOBODY has presented any evidence yet confirming yes or no the amount that defensive metrics rate players. It's still in it's infancy and as more and more data comes in (especially with that new tracking system) we should know more. Maybe they have some metrics of their own that he thinks overrate defense, but UZR and DRS are still up in the air. The people who CREATED these stats agree as much. But they also agree that there is equal chance they underrate as overrate.
 
bravos4evr said:
batter K's don't matter if they come with big power and Chavis has the potential for big power. a strikeout is really not much less valuable than any other out , not for batters.
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That is really a stretch. I doubt even the biggest Sawx knob-slobber would say that.
 
yeezus said:
Coppy just said he finds defensive metrics overrated and certain players get overvalued for their defense. "not naming names" he said. by saying that he's basically naming Jason Heyward.
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I hope he and the scouts have been paying attention to the contrast between Heyward and Markakis as well as Simmons and Aybar.

And to note a distinction that might matter. To say that some defensive metrics are overrated is not to say that the measured defensive contributions of a particular player or group of players is biased in one direction or another.
 
dak said:
This #AskCoppy thing is unreal. He's amazingly forthcoming and dropping a ton of nuggets about the team's thinking a go-forward approach.
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I am completely ignorant about twitter. I click on the #askcoppy link and all I see are a bunch of questions/comments from fans. Where are his answers?
 
bravos4evr said:
because NOBODY has presented any evidence yet confirming yes or no the amount that defensive metrics rate players. It's still in it's infancy and as more and more data comes in (especially with that new tracking system) we should know more. Maybe they have some metrics of their own that he thinks overrate defense, but UZR and DRS are still up in the air. The people who CREATED these stats agree as much. But they also agree that there is equal chance they underrate as overrate.
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ok then...so in his opinion, defense is overrated in that sense...I think that's a fine opinion to have.
 
yeezus said:
ok then...so in his opinion, defense is overrated in that sense...I think that's a fine opinion to have.
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well, it's an opinion, and thus has no real merit other than on a personal level, his status doesn't give that opinion any more clout than you, I or anyone else.
 
bravos4evr said:
well, it's an opinion, and thus has no real merit other than on a personal level, his status doesn't give that opinion any more clout than you, I or anyone else.
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I think he and the FO probably have much more research and data than you or me.
 
Offensive metrics are more refined and reliable than defensive metrics. I think it's prudent for offensive metrics to play a bigger role in player valuation than defensive metrics. If that's what Coppy is getting at, I think it's pretty uncontroversial. His tone makes it seem like he's going a little farther than that, but it's hard to say. I'm at least encouraged that he seems to have a strong handle on defensive metrics, so any judgments he's making aren't coming from a place of general ignorance.
 
dak said:
I'm at least encouraged that he seems to have a strong handle on defensive metrics, so any judgments he's making aren't coming from a place of general ignorance.
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Maybe they just got unlucky with respect to Markakis and Aybar as far as defense goes.

Right now I would guess they like Inciarte's defense, but might sing a different tune when they trade him.
 
bravos4evr said:
well, it's an opinion, and thus has no real merit other than on a personal level, his status doesn't give that opinion any more clout than you, I or anyone else.
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Well.... Since his opinions largely determine where the Braves go in terms of roster construction, I would say his status does give him a lot more clout than you or I.
 
yeezus said:
I think he and the FO probably have much more research and data than you or me.
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Maybe, but judging from JS's book, most saber inclined fans have been at it longer than the Braves front office has. Coppy is a step in the right direction, but I really think the team would benefit by cleaning house of all the 90's old guard and getting some more modern thinking people involved.
 
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