Viz and Teheran listed as top trade candidates

It never hurts to ask, which is what the Red Sox have done. That doesn’t mean the response hasn’t been cringe-worthy.

Judging by what the Braves are asking for starting pitcher Julio Teheran and relief pitcher Arodys Vizcaino, it sure doesn’t appear as though either pitcher are going to be realistic non-waiver trade deadline targets.

According to one Major League Baseball executive, the Braves continue to request teams to “back up the truck” for both Teheran and Vizcaino, with the asking price continuing to be “crazy” heading toward the Aug. 1 deadline.

For the Red Sox, such an approach would undoubtedly mean the inclusion of prospects Yoan Moncada and/or Andrew Benintendi, two players that don’t appear to be available in such a deal.

Both Teheran and Vizcaino would seemingly be solid fits for what the Red Sox are looking for. The 25-year-old Teheran has totaled a 2.72 ERA in 112 2/3 innings, while Vizcaino is 10-for-13 in save opportunities with a 2.75 ERA (having struck out 47 in 36 innings).

The approach by the last-place Braves is understandable considering the pitchers’ contract status, with Teheran under team control through 2020, and Vizcaino having two more years of being arbitration eligibility.

Red Sox president of baseball operations Dave Dombrowski touched on where the Red Sox are in terms of chasing pitching when speaking on Thursday night’s conference call following his trade for Aaron Hill.

“Conversations have become more rampant,” Dombrowski said. “But I don’t know if that means anything. Just like if you had asked me about this trade yesterday, I wouldn’t have thought we were going to make this trade today. But whatever reason, Milwaukee felt it was the right day for them. We’ve been trying. It’s just, they were ready to do it today. We have had more conversations about pitching, but again, I’m not sure that means we’re any closer to making a deal or not.”

http://fullcount.weei.com/sports/bo...cutive-braves-asking-price-on-pitchers-crazy/
 
It never hurts to ask, which is what the Red Sox have done. That doesn’t mean the response hasn’t been cringe-worthy.

Judging by what the Braves are asking for starting pitcher Julio Teheran and relief pitcher Arodys Vizcaino, it sure doesn’t appear as though either pitcher are going to be realistic non-waiver trade deadline targets.

According to one Major League Baseball executive, the Braves continue to request teams to “back up the truck” for both Teheran and Vizcaino, with the asking price continuing to be “crazy” heading toward the Aug. 1 deadline.

For the Red Sox, such an approach would undoubtedly mean the inclusion of prospects Yoan Moncada and/or Andrew Benintendi, two players that don’t appear to be available in such a deal.

Both Teheran and Vizcaino would seemingly be solid fits for what the Red Sox are looking for. The 25-year-old Teheran has totaled a 2.72 ERA in 112 2/3 innings, while Vizcaino is 10-for-13 in save opportunities with a 2.75 ERA (having struck out 47 in 36 innings).

The approach by the last-place Braves is understandable considering the pitchers’ contract status, with Teheran under team control through 2020, and Vizcaino having two more years of being arbitration eligibility.

Red Sox president of baseball operations Dave Dombrowski touched on where the Red Sox are in terms of chasing pitching when speaking on Thursday night’s conference call following his trade for Aaron Hill.

“Conversations have become more rampant,” Dombrowski said. “But I don’t know if that means anything. Just like if you had asked me about this trade yesterday, I wouldn’t have thought we were going to make this trade today. But whatever reason, Milwaukee felt it was the right day for them. We’ve been trying. It’s just, they were ready to do it today. We have had more conversations about pitching, but again, I’m not sure that means we’re any closer to making a deal or not.”

http://fullcount.weei.com/sports/bo...cutive-braves-asking-price-on-pitchers-crazy/

Granted it's a Boston reporter and I didn't think the article was biased, but I kind of get tired of the slant against all non-contenders at the trade deadline. The meme seems to be "You guys are crappy. You should trade all your good players to contenders for next-to-nothing." It can be risky, but I believe in Teheran enough to hold onto him unless the offer is overwhelming.
 
It never hurts to ask, which is what the Red Sox have done. That doesn’t mean the response hasn’t been cringe-worthy.

Judging by what the Braves are asking for starting pitcher Julio Teheran and relief pitcher Arodys Vizcaino, it sure doesn’t appear as though either pitcher are going to be realistic non-waiver trade deadline targets.

According to one Major League Baseball executive, the Braves continue to request teams to “back up the truck” for both Teheran and Vizcaino, with the asking price continuing to be “crazy” heading toward the Aug. 1 deadline.

For the Red Sox, such an approach would undoubtedly mean the inclusion of prospects Yoan Moncada and/or Andrew Benintendi, two players that don’t appear to be available in such a deal.

Both Teheran and Vizcaino would seemingly be solid fits for what the Red Sox are looking for. The 25-year-old Teheran has totaled a 2.72 ERA in 112 2/3 innings, while Vizcaino is 10-for-13 in save opportunities with a 2.75 ERA (having struck out 47 in 36 innings).

The approach by the last-place Braves is understandable considering the pitchers’ contract status, with Teheran under team control through 2020, and Vizcaino having two more years of being arbitration eligibility.

Red Sox president of baseball operations Dave Dombrowski touched on where the Red Sox are in terms of chasing pitching when speaking on Thursday night’s conference call following his trade for Aaron Hill.

“Conversations have become more rampant,” Dombrowski said. “But I don’t know if that means anything. Just like if you had asked me about this trade yesterday, I wouldn’t have thought we were going to make this trade today. But whatever reason, Milwaukee felt it was the right day for them. We’ve been trying. It’s just, they were ready to do it today. We have had more conversations about pitching, but again, I’m not sure that means we’re any closer to making a deal or not.”

http://fullcount.weei.com/sports/bo...cutive-braves-asking-price-on-pitchers-crazy/

Our fans would have been livid if this had happened with one of our guys.

You mean he didn't shop HILL for the best offer?!?!?! WTF was the rush!?!?!?
 
Put Castro/Ramos, Desmond and Prado in this lineup, and the team still isn't going to the playoffs. All that would be different is a few more meaningless wins, a worse draft pick the following year and a lot more committed money long term.

Not saying we should make all these moves, but if we did, then next year's team would add Castro, Desmond, Prado/Turner, Swanson, Albies, and a healthy Mallex Smith. I'm sorry but that is SIGNIFICANTLY upgrading this team, not just offensively, but defensively as well. If you don't think we can compete for the playoffs with a lineup like that, then you are insane.
 
I think we can improve to something close to a .500 team without handing out 5-6 year deals to Cespedes and/or Desmond. It is true that the better we do the lower our draft position. That is always a given. But I also agree with the point made by others that we are not likely to make a 20+ win improvement to a 90 win team in one season.

All you need is about 85ish wins with the 2nd wild card now. That's definitely attainable.
 
Granted it's a Boston reporter and I didn't think the article was biased, but I kind of get tired of the slant against all non-contenders at the trade deadline. The meme seems to be "You guys are crappy. You should trade all your good players to contenders for next-to-nothing." It can be risky, but I believe in Teheran enough to hold onto him unless the offer is overwhelming.

I like this article. It makes sense.

Braves want the moon b/c we have two guys we like and we control. If you want them you have to like them a lot more than we do. A lot.
Sox should balk at that price.

The question will be who blinks first. Or is there a common ground. IF we are asking Moncada + Benintendi and they offer Moncada + something else........do we pull the trigger?

I think we keep them. In the offseason a team might give more. IF the sox crash and burn they might pay up.

I still think Tehran would be even more attractive to a mid market team. Maybe someone else makes a run at the winter meetings.

Viz....I'd trade him if we got someone we think will be an above avg regular position player next year.
 
Not saying we should make all these moves, but if we did, then next year's team would add Castro, Desmond, Prado/Turner, Swanson, Albies, and a healthy Mallex Smith. I'm sorry but that is SIGNIFICANTLY upgrading this team, not just offensively, but defensively as well. If you don't think we can compete for the playoffs with a lineup like that, then you are insane.

Castro isn't good. Desmond is having his best offensive season at 30 years old. Ramos is doing it at 28. All of those guys have significant question marks. Prado is the only one of the group I'd like to sign because his price would likely be reasonable, but even then, I'd be tempted to start Ruiz at third and see what we have in him.

And I like Swanson, Albies and Mallex a lot, but expecting those three to save our offense feels off to me.
 
Castro isn't good. Desmond is having his best offensive season at 30 years old. Ramos is doing it at 28. All of those guys have significant question marks. Prado is the only one of the group I'd like to sign because his price would likely be reasonable, but even then, I'd be tempted to start Ruiz at third and see what we have in him.

And I like Swanson, Albies and Mallex a lot, but expecting those three to save our offense feels off to me.

Just so we are clear...

You are knocking Desmond and Ramos because they are having their best season at the ages of 30 and 28, the typical peak of MLB players' careers? When would you prefer them to have their best seasons?

The Braves are not going to go from 65 wins to 85 wins in a single offseason, no matter how long they wait and attempt to time everything perfectly. At some point they have to improve from a 65 win team to a 75 win team, and then to a 85 win team. If they want to make that first step to 75+ wins, adding guys like Castro and Desmond is what they need to do.

And no, Castro isn't good. He is average. The Braves need more average MLB players since they have very few of them. A team full of average players gets you to 80 wins, a .500 record, the definition of "average". The Braves need to become average before they can become above average...see?
 
Just so we are clear...

You are knocking Desmond and Ramos because they are having their best season at the ages of 30 and 28, the typical peak of MLB players' careers? When would you prefer them to have their best seasons?

Considering the years and the money they would command in a bad free agent crop, I don't want those guys. Ramos I'd be more alright with since he's younger, but he has always been hurt and never close to the 149 wRC+ he's posting this year.

Desmond would command probably a 4-5 year deal at minimum, and he'd be 31 next season. You're paying for easily his best season and you'll be paying him big money as he begins to decline. Why do people want to do that?
 
Considering the years and the money they would command in a bad free agent crop, I don't want those guys. Ramos I'd be more alright with since he's younger, but he has always been hurt and never close to the 149 wRC+ he's posting this year.

Desmond would command probably a 4-5 year deal at minimum, and he'd be 31 next season. You're paying for easily his best season and you'll be paying him big money as he begins to decline. Why do people want to do that?

We have money that we have to spend. There are no rollover minutes.
If fans come out, and the complex makes money, then we get a higher budget going forward.
 
We have money that we have to spend. There are no rollover minutes.
If fans come out, and the complex makes money, then we get a higher budget going forward.

Sure you can't roll it over. But you can keep the money and avoid being sucked into a bad contract when we are actually ready to compete.
 
Considering the years and the money they would command in a bad free agent crop, I don't want those guys. Ramos I'd be more alright with since he's younger, but he has always been hurt and never close to the 149 wRC+ he's posting this year.

Desmond would command probably a 4-5 year deal at minimum, and he'd be 31 next season. You're paying for easily his best season and you'll be paying him big money as he begins to decline. Why do people want to do that?

Because the Braves need better players, and they can afford someone like Desmond for 4/70. They can NOT afford someone like Machado in a couple years, no matter how long they wait to buy a FA. No atter how long they wait to sign a FA they are not going to afford young premium FAs for $200M+.

Folks need to get it out of their head that the Braves are going to wait until this perfect time in the baseball universe when all their prospects magically mature at the same time, at which point they sign 2 FAs for $400M total and suddenly become a playoff team.

The Braves will always target the middle tier FAs to supplement their homegrown core. Guys like Castro, Desmond and Prado are exactly that.
 
Sure you can't roll it over. But you can keep the money and avoid being sucked into a bad contract when we are actually ready to compete.

Look at it like an advertising budget or an investment. You have to spend money to make money. So if you already have that money why not spend it?
 
Look at it like an advertising budget or an investment. You have to spend money to make money. So if you already have that money why not spend it?

Because I'd rather not be paying 35-year-old Ian Desmond $15-20 million in 2020 when we are ready to compete for the playoffs.
 
Personally, I think the $$$ is better spent on Cespedes, Prado and Castro than the other players (which those 3 probably cost similarly in AAV to say Desmond, Ramos and a different 3b candidate) Cespedes gives us star power and that will draw fans, Prado was a prior fan fave and Castro is a great defensive catcher with avg bat skills who should be affordable.

I can see the Desmond argument on a baseball level, but I think that Cespedes might be the better choice on a financial/marketing level for the team. True he will cost more but he probably generates more revenue on his own.
 
Because I'd rather not be paying 35-year-old Ian Desmond $15-20 million in 2020 when we are ready to compete for the playoffs.

so where are you going to get the team power from? just crap it out of thin air for $4m AAV?
 
Because I'd rather not be paying 35-year-old Ian Desmond $15-20 million in 2020 when we are ready to compete for the playoffs.

So you'd rather be paying whatever guy is the equivalent of a 35 year old Desmond $20M in 2022 when the same team is still competing for the playoffs?

All FA contracts end that way. The Braves will either be paying a declining Desmond in 2020, or some other declining player in 2022. Both will be a drain on the productivity of a playoff contending team.
 
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