The Trump Presidency

That was the GOP plan.

I think it needs to be pointed out every day what a despicable human being we allowed the nuclear codes and to be the face of our nation.
We have given him a chance and he appointed (just one example) a segregationist to run the DOJ that oversee civil rights complaints.
If that isn't a big FU I am the Prime Minister of Australia
He should get the respect he gives

Hawk, your advocating appeasement.
 
57Brave said:
Hawk, your advocating appeasement.
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No, I'm not, but I am telling you that if you expect your animus to gain any kind of meaningful traction beyond the comfortable circles you reside in you should choose better battles ... instead of ones which have already been fought (and won).
 
Hawk said:
At some point - if it hasn't happened already - most people are likely to stop considering every word, action, or tweet, emanating from DJT as an apocalyptic flare or example of gross misconduct.

That's the danger of crying wolf too early and too often.
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That's a good point. Kinda tangential to what I'm talking about, though, which is people spinning some combination of poor discipline, poor character, and poor leadership into the idea that the man at the helm is a chessboxing black-belt who's employing some brilliant negotiation strategy.
 
Hawk said:
Do you believe the overthrow of Yanukovych was a naturally occurring phenomenon?
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It was certainly favored by the US. The degree that it was sponsored by the US is subject to debate. Again, I repeat: "Created." Did Yanukovych's overthrow create the instability in Ukraine?
 
Julio3000 said:
That's a good point. Kinda tangential to what I'm talking about, though, which is people spinning some combination of poor discipline, poor character, and poor leadership into the idea that the man at the helm is a chessboxing black-belt who's employing some brilliant negotiation strategy.
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I don't see it as brilliant, but I do see it as unconventional.

We've given Trump a sword to fall on. If you believe he's well on the way to doing just that, then wouldn't the smarter route be to let him do it on his own instead of forcing him upon in? If we're creating controversy where there is none then we're giving him the perfect defense. Catch the man with his pants down instead of desperately trying to pull them off. The 'so-called judge' quip is a perfect example. It was classic Trump - in a mode of operation we litigated long ago - but some are treating the comment like it was somehow more sinister than inappropriate. In the court of the common man it reads as unjust persecution and so, for every 'win' that Trump scores against that tide, it helps establish him as a kind of relentless anti-hero.
 
Hawk said:
I don't see it as brilliant, but I do see it as unconventional.

We've given Trump a sword to fall on. If you believe he's well on the way to doing just that, then wouldn't the smarter route be to let him do it on his own instead of forcing him upon in? If we're creating controversy where there is none then we're giving him the perfect defense. Catch the man with his pants down instead of desperately trying to pull them off. The 'so-called judge' quip is a perfect example. It was classic Trump - in a mode of operation we litigated long ago - but some are treating the comment like it was somehow more sinister than inappropriate. In the court of the common man it reads as unjust persecution and for every 'win' that Trump scores it helps establish him as a kind of relentless anti-hero.
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I think that's a pretty solid read.
 
Julio3000 said:
Again, I repeat: "Created." Did Yanukovych's overthrow create the instability in Ukraine?
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It created the particular instability which allowed Putin to annex Crimea, certainly.

But let's not pretend the Ukraine circa 2014 wasn't a proxy war between the US, EU, and Russia. And let's not pretend that Russia didn't win.
 
Hawk said:
It created the particular instability which allowed Putin to annex Crimea, certainly.

But let's not pretend the Ukraine circa 2014 wasn't a proxy war between the US, EU, and Russia. And let's not pretend that Russia didn't win.
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I agree with the larger point, though I quibble with that terminiology. But, sure.

Trying to stick to the point, though...whatever our involvement in 2014, it did not create the instability in Ukraine.

...which was a sidelight comment to the main thrust, which was why on earth should we kiss Putin's ass at the expense of what you call our "friends"?
 
Julio3000 said:
Trying to stick to the point, though...whatever our involvement in 2014, it did not create the instability in Ukraine.

...which was a sidelight comment to the main thrust, which was why on earth should we kiss Putin's ass at the expense of what you call our "friends"?
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Ukraine has been a cauldron of unrest since it went indy. I never said we created the general state of instability, but that we "created the instability in the Ukraine which allowed Putin to waltz in." This being the Orange Revolution.

My earlier comment was simply poking fun at the friend/enemy dynamic (as though Russia is some big, bad red devil).
 
Hawk said:
Ukraine has been a cauldron of unrest since it went indy. I never said we created the general state of instability, but that we "created the instability in the Ukraine which allowed Putin to waltz in." This being the Orange Revolution.

My earlier comment was simply poking fun at the friend/enemy dynamic (as though Russia is some big, bad red devil).
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I have a pretty distinct aversion to the Big Scary Bad Guy school of foreign policy manipulation...whether the putative bad guy is Russia, China, the old USSR, or "Radical Islamic Terrorists."

If you think I'm engaging in it, you're reading a LOT into my comment.
 
Hawk said:
No, I'm not, but I am telling you that if you expect your animus to gain any kind of meaningful traction beyond the comfortable circles you reside in you should choose better battles ... instead of ones which have already been fought (and won).
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I certainly hope you don't think I am trying to convince or convert you.
Rather think of it as a dog owner whose favorite dog just soiled his rug and finds it necessary to rub his nose in it.
I really don't care about gaining "meaningful traction "
whatever that is or with who ?
(whom?? )
 
Hawk said:
At some point - if it hasn't happened already - most people are likely to stop considering every word, action, or tweet, emanating from DJT as an apocalyptic flare or example of gross misconduct.

That's the danger of crying wolf too early and too often.
Click to expand...

Was told not to take all his bull**** serious before he was elected

And now am being told, what are you bitching about? He's doing what he said

The goal posts keep getting moved
 
LOLGOP ‏@LOLGOP 7m7 minutes ago

LOLGOP Retweeted Elon Musk

Advise him to step down if he can't protect the country without torching the Constitution. Fascism won't be good for the electric car market
 
So ironic for the left to be screaming about fascism right now. Complete lack of self awareness.
 
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