THURSDAY MINORS FINAL 5/25 ... $$$$ Pitchers on Parade

Touki: 6 IP, 6 H, 4 ER, 3 BB, 6 K. Two of the three walks were intentional, one came right before a three-run homer that accounted for most of the damage.
 
Good for Brett. I was amazed that he was drafted high as a hitter, and then couldn't hit. Glad there's a little hope. That was going to be a big loss to have someone fail that highly drafted...he could still fail...but maybe not.
 
TheBravos said:
Good for Brett. I was amazed that he was drafted high as a hitter, and then couldn't hit. Glad there's a little hope. That was going to be a big lose to have someone fail that highly drafted...still fail...but maybe not.
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I've been hoping (with absolutely no insight) that we've been working with him almost exclusively on catching and that's caused his offensive struggles
 
Hawk said:
That's a BPA line right there.
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I honestly hope I'm wrong and Anderson becomes a stud. However, I'm still of the belief that he tops out as a number 3 starter. Last night was a great game for him but it's still just one game. Just like his previous start was poor but it was still just one game.

I really hope something clicked and this was a breakout game but it'll take more to make me believe he's more than a middle of the rotation guy long term.
 
striker42 said:
I honestly hope I'm wrong and Anderson becomes a stud. However, I'm still of the belief that he tops out as a number 3 starter. Last night was a great game for him but it's still just one game. Just like his previous start was poor but it was still just one game.

I really hope something clicked and this was a breakout game but it'll take more to make me believe he's more than a middle of the rotation guy long term.
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Why?

Everything I've read says the FB is really good and can move. For a young guy he spots it well. Has the frame, still very skinny. Other two pitches flash.

You are more likely to be right if you say someone is going to be MOR or fail based on numbers. There are so very few TOR. But I don't see why there is any reason to be down on this kid other than most prospects don't become TOR starters.
 
striker42 said:
I honestly hope I'm wrong and Anderson becomes a stud. However, I'm still of the belief that he tops out as a number 3 starter. Last night was a great game for him but it's still just one game. Just like his previous start was poor but it was still just one game.

I really hope something clicked and this was a breakout game but it'll take more to make me believe he's more than a middle of the rotation guy long term.
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One thing that always help a young pitcher bounce back.. Get to pitch against the absolute worst team in all of A ball. Great line.. he needs to follow it up now.
 
Russ2dollas said:
Why?

Everything I've read says the FB is really good and can move. For a young guy he spots it well. Has the frame, still very skinny. Other two pitches flash.

You are more likely to be right if you say someone is going to be MOR or fail based on numbers. There are so very few TOR. But I don't see why there is any reason to be down on this kid other than most prospects don't become TOR starters.
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Mainly because to be a TOR guy you need something really exceptional to hang your hat on. Thor has the fastball (when he's healthy). Halladay had the sinker. Glavine's chageup was exceptional. Maddux, on the other hand, had insane command that let him carve hitters up.

I don't see Anderson as having anything that you point to and say that he'll be able to hang his hat on that. I think he'll end up with a very good fastball but it will be a notch or two below aces that rely on the overpowering fastball. I think his secondary stuff will be good as well but I don't see him ever having a Wainright curve or a Glavine changeup.

Also, I see his command topping out at average. If you want to be an ace with average command, you better have unbelievably filthy stuff.

Ultimately, I think he's a pitchers that does a lot of things well ad has a lot of value but can't ever reach that next level.
 
striker42 said:
Mainly because to be a TOR guy you need something really exceptional to hang your hat on. Thor has the fastball (when he's healthy). Halladay had the sinker. Glavine's chageup was exceptional. Maddux, on the other hand, had insane command that let him carve hitters up.

I don't see Anderson as having anything that you point to and say that he'll be able to hang his hat on that. I think he'll end up with a very good fastball but it will be a notch or two below aces that rely on the overpowering fastball. I think his secondary stuff will be good as well but I don't see him ever having a Wainright curve or a Glavine changeup.

Also, I see his command topping out at average. If you want to be an ace with average command, you better have unbelievably filthy stuff.

Ultimately, I think he's a pitchers that does a lot of things well ad has a lot of value but can't ever reach that next level.
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probably right b/c of the %s....but that's a lot of words suggesting he's a relatively fixed product at 18.
 
He's what... 18?

I don't see the point projecting him to anything right now on the high side or low side. He could add MPH. He could add a pitch. Whats the point?

To this point, there is likely no other pitcher from that draft we'd rather have given the results he's shown. That's pretty much all we need to know.

And striker, there are lots of top of the rotation guys that didn't have a hammer pitch. They just weren't hall of famers like the guys you listed. Again, that's all way off projection to this point though.
 
Tapate50 said:
He's what... 18?

I don't see the point projecting him to anything right now on the high side or low side. He could add MPH. He could add a pitch. Whats the point?

To this point, there is likely no other pitcher from that draft we'd rather have given the results he's shown. That's pretty much all we need to know.

And striker, there are lots of top of the rotation guys that didn't have a hammer pitch. They just weren't hall of famers like the guys you listed. Again, that's all way off projection to this point though.
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Anderson absolutely could experience a jump of development and become a legit ace. There have been a lot of aces that weren't seen as having a high ceiling before figuring something out and exploding. However, that kind of development is insanely difficult to project.

And yes, there have been top of the rotation guys that didn't have a plus-plus pitch or insane control. However, they usually have multiple plus pitches paired with plus control and a great understanding of how to pitch. You usually aren't able to point to any real weakness in their game. However, it's far more usual for aces to have some exceptional aspect to their game that they lean on.
 
Tapate50 said:
He's what... 18?

I don't see the point projecting him to anything right now on the high side or low side. He could add MPH. He could add a pitch. Whats the point?

To this point, there is likely no other pitcher from that draft we'd rather have given the results he's shown. That's pretty much all we need to know.

And striker, there are lots of top of the rotation guys that didn't have a hammer pitch. They just weren't hall of famers like the guys you listed. Again, that's all way off projection to this point though.
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^^^
 
striker42 said:
I honestly hope I'm wrong and Anderson becomes a stud. However, I'm still of the belief that he tops out as a number 3 starter. Last night was a great game for him but it's still just one game. Just like his previous start was poor but it was still just one game.

I really hope something clicked and this was a breakout game but it'll take more to make me believe he's more than a middle of the rotation guy long term.
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A legit #3 SP is a stud. Folks need to stop thinking it's a knock on a guy to call him a #3 SP. A legit #3 SP gets paid $100M when he hits the FA market around age 30. A legit #3 SP produces ~3 WAR, and is worth $20M+ per year.

Do you have any idea how exceedingly rare it is for a guy to be tabbed as a TOR prospect? And how even more rare it is to have that guy actually become a TOR pitcher for even 1-2 seasons? And how insanely rare it is for one of those guys to become a longer term TOR pitcher?

Posi-Braves throw the term "TOR starter" around so loosely it has essentially lost all meaning around here. There are probably 3 true TOR prospects in the game right now (Giolito, Reyes, and Kopech), and only 2 if you no longer believe in Giolito.
 
I would be thrilled if Anderson turned into a legit #3 starter.

And TOR prospects are rarely the guys who actually become TOR starters.
 
Enscheff said:
A legit #3 SP is a stud. Folks need to stop thinking it's a knock on a guy to call him a #3 SP. A legit #3 SP gets paid $100M when he hits the FA market around age 30. A legit #3 SP produces ~3 WAR, and is worth $20M+ per year.

Do you have any idea how exceedingly rare it is for a guy to be tabbed as a TOR prospect? And how even more rare it is to have that guy actually become a TOR pitcher for even 1-2 seasons? And how insanely rare it is for one of those guys to become a longer term TOR pitcher?

Posi-Braves throw the term "TOR starter" around so loosely it has essentially lost all meaning around here. There are probably 3 true TOR prospects in the game right now (Giolito, Reyes, and Kopech), and only 2 if you no longer believe in Giolito.
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That's sort of odd since there are 64 #1 and #2 starters in the major leagues. Looks like we have a historic shortage coming in the future.
 
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