Political Correctness

Jaw said:
I will never understand why people who claim to want everyone to be treated equally continually make an issue of race. Again, if you want racial discrimination to end, you need to quit discriminating on the basis of race.

Having said all that, I think Boyega's reply should have been something like "There weren't many whites in the Black Panthers organization. You dumb***."
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In a perfect world this wouldn't be necessary. However, we don't live in a perfect world, and until we do I will support taking critical looks to increase diversity in areas where there historically hasn't been much.
 
mqt said:
Then if you'll excuse me, I'll continue thinking that it's a good thing for young people to be able to see someone that looks like them be a ****ing super hero.
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Super hero? That's not patronizing at all.

"Look here, I'm going to let you fantasize about being something that you literally can't ever be!"

How about President of the United States?
 
You know, I'm not a fan of superhero media. I never really got into it when I was a kid, and that's probably the reason that it doesn't push my buttons now. As an adult, I am leery of investing too much energy into the trasformative power of a single individual (side-eyes at Barack Obama and Bernie Sanders)...but [MENTION=266]Hawk[/MENTION], **** that sentiment, entirely. What mqt wrote was reasonable and well-intentioned.

I'm the parent of two brown kids. I know this is dicey territory, and I'm sensitive to the idea that I could and should feel this way, regardless of that status...on the other hand, having had the particular experiences that I have--including having a state official tell me "oh, it looks like she'll be light-skinned...you're lucky" upon seeing the my daughter, I've got at least a tiny modicum of insight here (it went well beyond that, in truth). So this kind of thing surely matters to me and matters to my kids, and to others who look like them.

Your assumed posture of superiority--"it's patronizing"-- really strikes a sour note. The appearance of pop-culture superheroes and princesses DO matter to my kids, and I know that because they tell me so.
 
Julio3000 said:
You know, I'm not a fan of superhero media. I never really got into it when I was a kid, and that's probably the reason that it doesn't push my buttons now. As an adult, I am leery of investing too much energy into the trasformative power of a single individual (side-eyes at Barack Obama and Bernie Sanders)...but [MENTION=266]Hawk[/MENTION], **** that sentiment, entirely. What mqt wrote was reasonable and well-intentioned.

I'm the parent of two brown kids. I know this is dicey territory, and I'm sensitive to the idea that I could and should feel this way, regardless of that status...on the other hand, having had the particular experiences that I have--including having a state official tell me "oh, it looks like she'll be light-skinned...you're lucky" upon seeing the my daughter, I've got at least a tiny modicum of insight here (it went well beyond that, in truth). So this kind of thing surely matters to me and matters to my kids, and to others who look like them.

Your assumed posture of superiority--"it's patronizing"-- really strikes a sour note. The appearance of pop-culture superheroes and princesses DO matter to my kids, and I know that because they tell me so.
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Yes, I'm aware of your family situation. You wrote about it eloquently following the Heyward trade (re: role models) and I've never forgotten it.

My sentiment is not that we shouldn't strive to assure equal racial representation in the mass media. My belief is simply that your thinking (and mqt's) is, frankly, hella dated. Minority groups (especially African Americans) are incredibly well-represented in the entertainment industry. If anything, Asian Americans are the ones with a bone to pick in this realm. You simply aren't watching much TV or going to the movies very often if you believe that the 'appearance' of pop cultural entertainment icons hasn't been significantly and unambiguously considered/respected.
 
Hawk said:
Super hero? That's not patronizing at all.

"Look here, I'm going to let you fantasize about being something that you literally can't ever be!"

How about President of the United States?
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Kids don't know that. Kids see superheroes saving the day and want to be just like them. I don't feel like I'm wrong in patronizing my son when he plays as Spider-Man or Batman. I think the world is a slightly better place when kids of all ethnicities can feel more included.
 
I'd like to know where you perceive the shortcomings to exist. I'd also like to know what 'professional stereotypes' are being actively pushed on viewers.
 
Hawk said:
My sentiment is not that we shouldn't strive to assure equal racial representation in the mass media. My belief is simply that your thinking (and mqt's) is, frankly, hella dated. Minority groups (especially African Americans) are incredibly well-represented in the entertainment industry. If anything, Asian Americans are the ones with a bone to pick in this realm. You simply aren't watching much TV or going to the movies very often if you believe that the 'appearance' of pop cultural entertainment icons hasn't been significantly and unambiguously considered/respected.
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You're not wrong (especially regarding the continuing under-representation and/or under-complicated representation of East and South Asians in US media), but this again strikes me as similar in tone to the We took out the third verse; what else do you expect? mindset—essentially saying, "Things are better, so quit complaining." It's fine and good and useful to recognize and celebrate what progress has been made to redress racialized ills; but it shouldn't be used as a cudgel to stymie or silence continued discourse regarding what there nonetheless remains to do.
 
mqt said:
Kids don't know that. Kids see superheroes saving the day and want to be just like them. I don't feel like I'm wrong in patronizing my son when he plays as Spider-Man or Batman. I think the world is a slightly better place when kids of all ethnicities can feel more included.
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Okay, that's fine, and I don't disagree, but I think the onus is on you to demonstrate where these ethnic groups are being out and out excluded.

And, as a matter of technicality, I don't think kids idolize Bruce Wayne or Peter Parker ... they idolize the superhero, which, atleast in terms of action figures, cartoons, and costumes, is a pretty 'color' neutral figure.
 
For the record I think a black Batman would be awesome and I'm surprised a black Jim West happened before Batman did (I guess we got Blade instead).
 
jpx7 said:
You're not wrong (especially regarding the continuing under-representation and/or under-complicated representation of East and South Asians in US media), but this again strikes me as similar in tone to the We took out the third verse; what else do you expect? mindset—essentially saying, "Things are better, so quit complaining." It's fine and good and useful to recognize and celebrate what progress has been made to redress racialized ills; but it shouldn't be used as a cudgel to stymie or silence continued discourse regarding what there nonetheless remains to do.
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I honestly don't see where you could remotely derive 'cudgeling' and "quit complaining" out of my comments on this issue. Things are better. I can say that and still advocate for continued maturity in the industry and in terms of how society broadly perceives its heroes/stars.
 
jpx7 said:
You're not wrong (especially regarding the continuing under-representation and/or under-complicated representation of East and South Asians in US media), but this again strikes me as similar in tone to the We took out the third verse; what else do you expect? mindset—essentially saying, "Things are better, so quit complaining." It's fine and good and useful to recognize and celebrate what progress has been made to redress racialized ills; but it shouldn't be used as a cudgel to stymie or silence continued discourse regarding what there nonetheless remains to do.
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Yeah, pretty much just this.
 
Hawk said:
I honestly don't see where you could remotely derive 'cudgeling' and "quit complaining" out of my comments on this issue. Things are better. I can say that and still advocate for continued maturity in the industry and in terms of how society broadly perceives its heroes/stars.
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To borrow another pop-culture trope, I don't see where you could not.
 
Nah, your response to mqt was straight bull****. I appreciate your clarifications, but dang, dude...it seems pretty obvious.
 
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