Baseball America Top 100 Released

Super said:
Pache could definitely end up a better hitter than Inciarte, but it's far from a sure, or even a probable, thing. I think if people thought Ender could hit the way he has, he wouldn't have been a Rule 5 guy. Now, just because people missed on him doesn't mean Pache can't hit better than that. But Ender's not-terrible offense has probably been a surprise to some teams.
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Contact and exit velocity are key IMO.
 
thewupk said:
We know you think every prospect will be an all-star but that's not always the case. Pache's ceiling is hitting better than Ender and being a Bourn type player in his prime. His most likely outcome is hitting less than Ender and being a good role player while he's cheap.
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Well, I'll offer an opinion just as others do, but I would be surprised if Pache doesn't become more than a role player. Somewhere along the way which is probably a philosophy in the many organizations, the hitting emphasis for Pache has been to hit line drives and get on base, utilize his speed and learn the nuisances of hitting at his advantage in the count. That has served him well at this point and at his age.

Watching him is better than stat scouting because you hear and see the instruction he has been given. NOW, I will say that he had very little drive (13 doubles and 8 triples in 460+ abs) the many times I saw him and he was content with line drives. That is at least better than the let it rip philosophy but I expect more gap power going forward. The most HR'S Ender hit on the minors was 2 until the year before his debut when he got 6 I think.

So if the hitting plane changes just slightly to give him lift you measure his defense. I'm not admittedly a great metrics guy but if Pache approaches what Ender did defensively, one or the other becomes a great trade chip. I am high on Pache's defense as he would give you a gem almost every other game. There hasn't been a scout or analyst not rave about his defense right now as is.

Ok. Long story short, I don't see him as a bit player. I think if I'm the Marlins, he's a must in a deal for Yelich if we aren't including Acuña. He may never hit for double digit power but I suspect he will get close as he gets stronger.
 
thethe said:
All star is dependent on comparative performance so it's impossible to say. I do think he will beat out Ender by a few points in wRC+.
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Actually getting voted into the game is dependent on other factors but the term all-star generally refers to 4+ WAR guys.
 
Deester11 said:
Well, I'll offer an opinion just as others do, but I would be surprised if Pache doesn't become more than a role player. Somewhere along the way which is probably a philosophy in the many organizations, the hitting emphasis for Pache has been to hit line drives and get on base, utilize his speed and learn the nuisances of hitting at his advantage in the count. That has served him well at this point and at his age.

Watching him is better than stat scouting because you hear and see the instruction he has been given. NOW, I will say that he had very little drive (13 doubles and 8 triples in 460+ abs) the many times I saw him and he was content with line drives. That is at least better than the let it rip philosophy but I expect more gap power going forward. The most HR'S Ender hit on the minors was 2 until the year before his debut when he got 6 I think.

So if the hitting plane changes just slightly to give him lift you measure his defense. I'm not admittedly a great metrics guy but if Pache approaches what Ender did defensively, one or the other becomes a great trade chip. I am high on Pache's defense as he would give you a gem almost every other game. There hasn't been a scout or analyst not rave about his defense right now as is.

Ok. Long story short, I don't see him as a bit player. I think if I'm the Marlins, he's a must in a deal for Yelich if we aren't including Acuña. He may never hit for double digit power but I suspect he will get close as he gets stronger.
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Yeah. The long and short for Pache is that if he hits he's going to be really good. How likely is that? I have no idea.
 
thethe said:
I think you guys are under seeing pache offensive potential. I think he will hit better than ender
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You understand how big that word is, right???

Acuna has HOF "potential" - I'm relatively sure that if he turns into 80% of what Andruw was, everyone else will be beyond thrilled for years (and apparently Andruw isn't close to being a HOFer in the voters' eyes).

Potential is a bigger word than supercalifragilisticexpialidocius.
 
thewupk said:
Yeah. The long and short for Pache is that if he hits he's going to be really good. How likely is that? I have no idea.
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Just ask Kiley.

Pache will be Pillar, at the very least. That's an 85-90 wRC+ bat with premium CF defense.

We have nothing to worry about. He's at least a 3 win player...no worries! The future is bright!
 
clvclv said:
You understand how big that word is, right???

Acuna has HOF "potential" - I'm relatively sure that if he turns into 80% of what Andruw was, everyone else will be beyond thrilled for years (and apparently Andruw isn't close to being a HOFer in the voters' eyes).

Potential is a bigger word than supercalifragilisticexpialidocius.
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How easily you forget. Andruw got dogged by the fanbase for not being Willie Mays. Even Chipper got it in his early to mid 30's when he first started to break down and people thought he we was overpaid. Luckily he found another level towards the end. And let's not even bring up Heyward and peoples expectations for him. Braves fans have a problem with #1 overall prospects and their perception of what they should be compared to what they are actually doing for the team.
 
Enscheff said:
Just ask Kiley.

Pache will be Pillar, at the very least. That's an 85-90 wRC+ bat with premium CF defense.

We have nothing to worry about. He's at least a 3 win player...no worries! The future is bright!
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Yeah. I think Pillar is a good comp for Pache but not his floor.
 
thewupk said:
How easily you forget. Andruw got dogged by the fanbase for not being Willie Mays. Even Chipper got it in his early to mid 30's when he first started to break down and people thought he we was overpaid. Luckily he found another level towards the end. And let's not even bring up Heyward and peoples expectations for him. Braves fans have a problem with #1 overall prospects and their perception of what they should be compared to what they are actually doing for the team.
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I honestly believe that some people will be calling Acuna a disappointment even if he is a consistent 5 win player. Its crazy to think that our fanbase would be disappointed with 30 WAR over his first 6 seasons, but I bet they would be. If he doesn't hit some approximation of Mike Trout, many fans will call him a disappointment
 
BeanieAntics said:
I honestly believe that some people will be calling Acuna a disappointment even if he is a consistent 5 win player. Its crazy to think that our fanbase would be disappointed with 30 WAR over his first 6 seasons, but I bet they would be. If he doesn't hit some approximation of Mike Trout, many fans will call him a disappointment
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Trout might be overboard. But if Acuna doesn't hit like Freeman and have plus defense there will be a certain section of the fanbase calling him a disappointment and overhyped.
 
thewupk said:
I'm curious if the Nats fans think Harper has been a disappointment or not besides that 1 season? Someone should ask gilesfan.
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there prob are some. but he's also just 25 and has a 9.5 WAR season under his belt. But i'm sure some are disappointed that he hasn't been Trout.
 
BeanieAntics said:
I honestly believe that some people will be calling Acuna a disappointment even if he is a consistent 5 win player. Its crazy to think that our fanbase would be disappointed with 30 WAR over his first 6 seasons, but I bet they would be. If he doesn't hit some approximation of Mike Trout, many fans will call him a disappointment
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When Acuna comes up and struggles with MLB sequencing (meaning swinging at breaking balls away) while posting an OPS that might not crack the .800s...there will be complaints.

It is absolutely imperative the Braves give up a few weeks/months of .750 OPS Acuna in 2018 for a full year of .900 OPS Acuna in 2024.
 
thewupk said:
How easily you forget. Andruw got dogged by the fanbase for not being Willie Mays. Even Chipper got it in his early to mid 30's when he first started to break down and people thought he we was overpaid. Luckily he found another level towards the end. And let's not even bring up Heyward and peoples expectations for him. Braves fans have a problem with #1 overall prospects and their perception of what they should be compared to what they are actually doing for the team.
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Gawd this is so true.
 
Enscheff said:
When Acuna comes up and struggles with MLB sequencing (meaning swinging at breaking balls away) while posting an OPS that might not crack the .800s...there will be complaints.

It is absolutely imperative the Braves give up a few weeks/months of .750 OPS Acuna in 2018 for a full year of .900 OPS Acuna in 2024.
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It sure seems like that's the direction they are going, based on all you read. Or more specifically, "there is reason to believe" that this is the track AA is planning to take. Some casual fans may not understand the wisdom, but that shouldn't be much of a problem, especially given how little time you really have to leave someone down to gain that year (like the Cubbies did with Bryant).
 
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