Jaw
It's OVER 5,000!
How much of the deferred Kazmir money is counted in that $107M?
Discussion of Braves 2018 Offseason plans
- Thread starter Horsehide Harry
- Start date
How much of the deferred Kazmir money is counted in that $107M?
So I guess we can all look forward to you being wrong yet again next year.
Southcack77
Well-known member
Well, you just tell me what my prediction was and tell me how I did a year from now. I will look forward to finding out (what I predicted).
It could be. It could be a purposeful decision based on realities that have nothing to do with available funds though.
I'm not sure "terrible sign" is exactly fair. It was inevitable that payroll would come down based on the realities of the market the Braves play in. The writing was on the wall as soon as the Suntrust sell out streak ended at 2 games and it became clear they wouldn't draw the numbers they anticipated.
Could they have done anything about it? I'm not sure any course of action could have realistically led to a higher payroll right now once they decided to rebuild. They probably need ~2.8M fans to support a $130M+ payroll, and there was simply no way that was going to happen in 2018 after they tore down the roster a few years ago. The Johns thought they were smart enough to rebuild in 3 years, but reality said otherwise.
We wouldn't be upset about a $110M+ payroll this year if they didn't mis-project attendance and had a $125M payroll last year. A payroll of $110M+ is still a nice bump of ~20% from the Turner Field days, which is fairly significant.
I won't go so far as to say it's "a terrible sign", but I certainly wouldn't say I expected it to do so (by any stretch) either.
I don't think anyone can make that determination until we see what they do NEXT winter since none of us are privy to "the plan" and are honestly just guessing - whether those guesses seem to make some sense right now (or not).
If you consider that there wasn't one single soul (including those with the brightest of bright outlooks) that believed there was the slightest chance the Braves could unload Kemp without eating at least half his contract, it's not much of a stretch to imagine the plan completely changed on the fly when that opportunity arose. Most of us have always doubted that the organization would ever be big players on the free-agent market as long as corporate ownership is in place. If you consider the 2018 Kemp and Gonzalez salaries a "wash" (not exactly, but close enough for this exercise), AA "added" a $10 million salary in McCarthy and a $16 million salary in Kazmir. That was somewhere I don't think anyone imagined the money that was paid Garcia/Dickey/Colon was going to be used in 2018.
In essence, AA's spent $6 million less on starting Pitchers this year than Coppy spent last year - even though you can make the argument that it was time to throw Gohara, Newcomb, Fried, Sims, (and to a lesser extent Wisler and Blair) to the wolves rather than use those resources that way. Wright, Soroka, Allard, Anderson, and others are going to start breathing down their necks as early as midseason, so it's time to find out who you want to keep instead of tucking that many of them away at Gwinnett and/or Mississippi. It's not like things are going to be any less crowded a year from now (unless you trade several young arms) once Touki, Wentz, Wilson, Davidson, and others start climbing the ladder and Weigel hopefully returns to health.
If that $32 million that Garcia/Dickey/Colon made had been spent on Moustakas/Headley/Frazier and Kemp was still in LF rather than the two Pitchers from the Dodgers, no one would be making a big deal about payroll - you'd have expected it to go down because you were using all the young arms in the rotation.
Maybe the plan changed when they saw the opportunity to clear all that money from the 2019 books and they really are going to try to play in the deep end of the pool with Donaldson or someone next winter - or they intend to try to lock Albies and Acuna (and possibly others) up to long deals soon - who knows?
I won't consider it "a terrible sign" until something like that doesn't happen - but if it doesn't, it's no doubt time to start worrying.
Freshmaker
Arbitration Eligible
More from Tim Tucker of the AJC:
The revenue increase has not produced a boost in the Braves’ 2018 major-league player payroll. The payroll will be lower at the start of this season than it was at the start of last season, barring major acquisitions in the next month.
Liberty Media said there were increased costs last season associated with “baseball and ballpark operations and the mixed-use facility.” The player payroll was increased last season from 2016 levels, and concession, parking and security expenses rose, Liberty said.
The company also cited this expense: The Braves recognized a $13 million write-off, mostly in the fourth quarter, of contracts related to international players – a reference to the rule-breaking scandal that cost the team 13 prospects late last year.
In another financial metric, after factoring in non-cash expenses of $67 million for depreciation and amortization and $46 million for stock-based compensation, Liberty Media showed an overall loss of $106 million for the Braves, according to the company’s filing. The company said depreciation and amortization increased because of “property and equipment” for the stadium/mixed-use development and stock compensation increased because of a rise in the value of the Braves franchise and vesting of outstanding awards.
The Braves carried debt of $667 million as of Dec. 31, primarily loans for construction of the stadium, mixed-use development and new spring-training facility, Liberty Media said.
The revenue increase has not produced a boost in the Braves’ 2018 major-league player payroll. The payroll will be lower at the start of this season than it was at the start of last season, barring major acquisitions in the next month.
Liberty Media said there were increased costs last season associated with “baseball and ballpark operations and the mixed-use facility.” The player payroll was increased last season from 2016 levels, and concession, parking and security expenses rose, Liberty said.
The company also cited this expense: The Braves recognized a $13 million write-off, mostly in the fourth quarter, of contracts related to international players – a reference to the rule-breaking scandal that cost the team 13 prospects late last year.
In another financial metric, after factoring in non-cash expenses of $67 million for depreciation and amortization and $46 million for stock-based compensation, Liberty Media showed an overall loss of $106 million for the Braves, according to the company’s filing. The company said depreciation and amortization increased because of “property and equipment” for the stadium/mixed-use development and stock compensation increased because of a rise in the value of the Braves franchise and vesting of outstanding awards.
The Braves carried debt of $667 million as of Dec. 31, primarily loans for construction of the stadium, mixed-use development and new spring-training facility, Liberty Media said.
Freshmaker
Arbitration Eligible
So, they're running a bit of a profit now as opposed to losing money the year before
Southcack77
Well-known member
To be fair they basically did eat oat of kemp’s Salary except they are doing so in 2018 ... unless for some reason they aren’t paying Kazmir’s deferred money, which makes very little sense not to do.
Jaw
It's OVER 5,000!
That's 13 million in unexpected player payroll after last season had already ended. Why wouldn't Liberty just tell McGuirk to pull that money from this year's payroll budget to fund it?
salmagundy
Boras' Client
Sun 3/4 MLBTR posted this about the Braves decline in payroll for '18.
Though the Braves enjoyed a 47 percent increase in revenues from 2016 to 2017 thanks to the opening of SunTrust Park, the team projects to have a smaller payroll next season than it did in 2017, Tim Tucker of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution writes. The Braves had long intended to time the opening of their new stadium to coincide with the end of their rebuilding plan, though this offseason been a very quiet one for the team, save for a big payroll-shuffling trade with the Dodgers. Of course, Atlanta’s plans were entirely upended by the shocking departures of both former GM John Coppolella and former president of baseball operations John Hart, so perhaps it isn’t surprising that the franchise held back on any aggressive moves. New general manager Alex Anthopoulos even stated in December that he would likely take “a more cautious approach” in his first year running the front office.
Though the Braves enjoyed a 47 percent increase in revenues from 2016 to 2017 thanks to the opening of SunTrust Park, the team projects to have a smaller payroll next season than it did in 2017, Tim Tucker of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution writes. The Braves had long intended to time the opening of their new stadium to coincide with the end of their rebuilding plan, though this offseason been a very quiet one for the team, save for a big payroll-shuffling trade with the Dodgers. Of course, Atlanta’s plans were entirely upended by the shocking departures of both former GM John Coppolella and former president of baseball operations John Hart, so perhaps it isn’t surprising that the franchise held back on any aggressive moves. New general manager Alex Anthopoulos even stated in December that he would likely take “a more cautious approach” in his first year running the front office.
GeorgiaGirl
NL Rookie of the Year
AA usually likes to be very aggressive, bordering on crazy, so it's fine he's not made huge moves but it could backfire on him that he's done nothing.
msstate7
Well-known member
Moose, if the deal is right, would make this team much better
But then you're left with a situation where you inefficiently spent money on a position where your replacement level production is not that much different.
If you're telling me the plan is to sign moose and trade him next year then fine. Seems like the market isn't robust for him now (obviously the pick is an issue ) so I'm just not sure how many offers will be around.
LF is the organizational weakness right now as well as catcher depending on what you think of jackson. Right now we have a potential 2 war guy in camargo and a slightly less than blue chipper in AA. Clogging up that position for 3+ years with a material financial investment just doesn't make sense in my opinion.
The Braves don’t have any money.
If they had the money for a $120M+ payroll, they could have built a WC contender.
They didn’t have that kind of cash, so they decided to punt 2018 and use their resources for 2019.
This whole “they didn’t really want/need any additions” is nothing but folks still keeping their heads in the sand.
If they had the money for a $120M+ payroll, they could have built a WC contender.
They didn’t have that kind of cash, so they decided to punt 2018 and use their resources for 2019.
This whole “they didn’t really want/need any additions” is nothing but folks still keeping their heads in the sand.
I’m ok with what they are doing this year. Could AA have made some big trades...yes. I LOVE that he is taking time to evaluate players and not just trading guys to make a splash.
For as slow as this off-season has been...strap in for this year’s trading deadline and next offseason. AA has never been one to be shy about aggressive moves.
We could put the payroll at 140 mil and are we really going to compete with Houston in 2018....no.
2018 is the perfect year to let young guys get experience and see who can stick. It will give us a higher draft pick which we need because of the international mess.
This team will be better than last years team and our window will begin to open in 2019. I’m cool with that. 2018 was never going to be “our” year.
For as slow as this off-season has been...strap in for this year’s trading deadline and next offseason. AA has never been one to be shy about aggressive moves.
We could put the payroll at 140 mil and are we really going to compete with Houston in 2018....no.
2018 is the perfect year to let young guys get experience and see who can stick. It will give us a higher draft pick which we need because of the international mess.
This team will be better than last years team and our window will begin to open in 2019. I’m cool with that. 2018 was never going to be “our” year.