It's Soroka Time

thewupk said:
Because next week you may be wondering why Soroka got sent back to AAA.
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I know exactly why Soroka will be optioned.

But who is to say we wouldn't have gotten a pitching prospect that would demand a spot in the rotation now? I mean the argument is just unnecessary. Lets just enjoy the fact that Soroka is up and we finally get to see him against major league hitters.
 
thethe said:
I know exactly why Soroka will be optioned.

But who is to say we wouldn't have gotten a pitching prospect that would demand a spot in the rotation now? I mean the argument is just unnecessary. Lets just enjoy the fact that Soroka is up and we finally get to see him against major league hitters.
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who isn't enjoying that?
 
thethe said:
I know exactly why Soroka will be optioned.

But who is to say we wouldn't have gotten a pitching prospect that would demand a spot in the rotation now? I mean the argument is just unnecessary. Lets just enjoy the fact that Soroka is up and we finally get to see him against major league hitters.
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What's more annoying...

1. A topic meandering naturally for 10 posts, or

2. Someone complaining about it for 10 posts?

I vote #2.
 
thewupk said:
who isn't enjoying that?
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This is my last post on this.

There are probably 10 threads in just the first 2 pages of the forum that have involved discussion on the decision to not trade Teheran at the start of the rebuild. There is absolutely no need to devolve a thread about Sorokas callup into that discussion.
 
I don't think we are trading Julion. Up until this last start, where clearly he wasn't right physically, he had shown signs of righting himself. The two starts before that against the Phillies and Mets were just outstanding.
 
Would be interesting to see Culberson DFAd.

Go to a 6 man rotation when Gohara is ready - Julio, Folty, McCarthy, Newcomb, Soroka, Gohara to help manage Gohara and Soroka's innings and go to a 7 man pen of Vizcaino, Minter, Ramirez, Carle, Winkler, Fried, and Ramirez when he gets back (keep Moylan around until then). Make Camargo the everyday 3B and keep Flaherty/Bautista around to fill-in for him when he gives Ozzie and/or Dansby a blow.
 
jpx7 said:
I was for it at the time; but, in hindsight, unless they were dealing him to AZ, I doubt Hart/Copt would’ve extracted good value for him in a trade anyways.

Given the Kemp deal, I’d like to think Anthopoulos is the man to clear his salary if he deems it useful to do so.
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I didn’t get the sense that anyone really thought he was particularly valuable and the offers were underwhelming.

It’s only now that I think...I’d rather have a low leverage bullpen arm than pay Teheran 11 million next year.
 
Enscheff said:
That was the consensus of his upside, completely ignoring the risk inherent with keeping a pitcher for 3 noncompetitive seasons.

There was no good argument for keeping Teheran. It was a terrible decision the moment it happened, not because he is no longer very good. We didn't even need hindsight in this case.

It is simply poor asset management to waste a pitcher's value and carry the risk of injury/decline when a team is guaranteed to lose. Keeping Freeman wasn't optimal, but it was defensible because he is a position player less likely to see his value go to zero...and luckily the Braves have realized the best case scenario with him.
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I thought it was good thing, always and everywhere, to move Tehera ——especially early in rebuild.

But I was more particular xilarly referring to the deadline and winter after his rebound where they actively shopped him.

I did think that didn’t happen because no one really wanted him much and the Braves were looking for too good a return.

I thought that it wasn’t the worst thing.

Now I find myself wishing Atlanta didn’t owe him 12m.
 
Southcack77 said:
I thought it was good thing, always and everywhere, to move Tehera ——especially early in rebuild.

But I was more particular xilarly referring to the deadline and winter after his rebound where they actively shopped him.

I did think that didn’t happen because no one really wanted him much and the Braves were looking for too good a return.

I thought that it wasn’t the worst thing.

Now I find myself wishing Atlanta didn’t owe him 12m.
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The issue was the Braves thought he was a TOR pitcher (he wasn’t) and wanted a trade package commensurate with that kind of pitcher. They also incorrectly concluded that he could anchor the 2017+ pitching staff.

They could have gotten fair value for Julio. The problem is the Braves over valued him at the time.

We are seeing the results now.
 
Enscheff said:
The issue was the Braves thought he was a TOR pitcher (he wasn’t) and wanted a trade package commensurate with that kind of pitcher. They also incorrectly concluded that he could anchor the 2017+ pitching staff.

They could have gotten fair value for Julio. The problem is the Braves over valued him at the time.

We are seeing the results now.
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They wanted what they got for Miller. The problem was nobody viewed Julio the way the Dbacks viewed Miller.
 
Julio should have been traded AT THAT time correct. Makes little sense to trade him away no matter what little perceived value he has now. It's Soroka time, not what could have been time. AA will get it sorted out soon I'm imagining. JT may yet be traded but I'm not expecting much in return.
 
Enscheff said:
Back to Soroka...

The actual results of this start are virtually inconsequential. I will be looking in earnest for a few things:

1. A Grade 60+ SI, meaning ~94 MPH through 80+ pitches with 8"-9" of arm side run and less than 6" of rise.
2. A Grade 50+ breaking ball.
3. Flashes of a Grade 50+ CH.
4. No stretches of 4-5 consecutive pitches where he completely loses control.
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How do you know the speed, side run, and rise for a 60+ slider? What are the numbers for a 45 or 50 slider?

I ask in earnestness.
 
Deester11 said:
Julio should have been traded AT THAT time correct. Makes little sense to trade him away no matter what little perceived value he has now. It's Soroka time, not what could have been time. AA will get it sorted out soon I'm imagining. JT may yet be traded but I'm not expecting much in return.
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Going into the offseason, if that 12 M meant a huge upgrade in LF... id be all over letting him go for a middling return.
 
SJ24 said:
How do you know the speed, side run, and rise for a 60+ slider? What are the numbers for a 45 or 50 slider?

I ask in earnestness.
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These grades are from 2017 data, but I assume it holds well enough until there is more 2018 pitch data.

Grade vSL X Z
80 91.5 8.1 -5
70 89.2 6.3 -2.6
60 86.9 4.4 -0.5
50 84.6 2.5 1.6
40 82.3 0.6 3.6
30 79.9 0 5.7
20 77.7 0 7

Horizontal movement (X) is the most important for a slider, while velocity is the least important. Vertical movement (Z) falls somewhere in between.
 
Enscheff said:
These grades are from 2017 data, but I assume it holds well enough until there is more 2018 pitch data.

Grade vSL X Z
80 91.5 8.1 -5
70 89.2 6.3 -2.6
60 86.9 4.4 -0.5
50 84.6 2.5 1.6
40 82.3 0.6 3.6
30 79.9 0 5.7
20 77.7 0 7

Horizontal movement (X) is the most important for a slider, while velocity is the least important. Vertical movement (Z) falls somewhere in between.
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Weird. So 85 with horizontal movement is better than 90 with less horizontal movement?

ETA... which of those 3 are most important on fastball? Velocity?
 
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