So seriously....

T

TheBravos

Boras' Client
Wilson, Touki and Wright have dominated. What if Gohora and Fried go on a tear also?? What if Weigel comes back strong?

Without injury and “if” they continue their path...what are we going to do??

Yes, I know we will have to trade some. I’m beginning to think it’s the guys in our current starting rotation that might need to be traded.

Think about it. Our guys in the minors have had more success than most of our starters did.

I honestly feel better about Wilson, Touki , Wright long term than our current starters. We could literally turn over our whole rotation and have FIVE high end arms. I know we won’t go with that little experience. Wisdom says you need a vet our two....but dang.

Do we really want to trade a guy with great stuff, who has dominated in the minors simply because we don’t have a spot for him? He could be better than any of our starters long term right now.

The current pace AA has promoted pitchers is intriguing. I thought because we have so many options, AA would go very slowly and stretch windows out. He seems to be doing the opposite.

Is the plan to have some of these guys in the bullpen to start the year? If so ...just like Gohora and Fried....I really HATE them screwing a starter around and getting them out of whack. Especially a guy like Touki who seems to have figured it out.

I like Folty and Newk, but many think they could just as well be over achieving instead of figuring things out. Julio needs to be gone. Sanchez has been great, but who knows what he’s doing next year. Gausman might figure it out but chances are he is nothing more than average. McCarthy will be gone. I don’t feel great about Allard (who is yet another guy who is ready).

There are so many. AA seems to be rushing many of them. I just want to know what he’s thinking. He seems to be making things even more difficult, but I know he doesn’t do anything without a ton of thought. I just hope we don’t trade our BEST pitchers in the bunch because they were younger and we decided to go with experience.
 
some of them will be in the pen by September...I'd especially like to see Touki and Gohara called up
 
Oh a list of our pitching prospects. Haven’t seen one of those in a week or so.

The odds of all of those prospects panning out is next to zero. It’s a good problem to have, having that many arms available. But there were still people on here saying we should have gone after Archer at the deadline.
 
Skeeter31 said:
Oh a list of our pitching prospects. Haven’t seen one of those in a week or so.

The odds of all of those prospects panning out is next to zero. It’s a good problem to have, having that many arms available. But there were still people on here saying we should have gone after Archer at the deadline.
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I didn’t want Archer, well unless he was decently cheap. Definitely not at the price he ended up being.

We keep saying they won’t pan out, but so far none have fallen off. Sure Gohora has his concerns etc, but all of the big names have have progressed and appear to be ahead of schedule or on schedule to make the majors. I definitely would have not thought all these guys would have made it. I thought some would stall out, some would progress very slowly and some would be injured. Weigel is the only one that had a major injury and even he had blasted his way to AAA and was a few weeks from a call up. No one will be surprised if he comes back dealing by the end of 2019.

So keep saying “they all won’t pan out”. I mean...I keep thinking that also. Here we are though, with a ton of options and not ONE big name prospect flaming out.

If I had to bet...I would pick Allard to fail. I would also think Gohora is risky but has massive upside and is an easy bullpen guy at worst. Outside of that...who is looking shaky? Soroka’s shoulder?

Tell me who is looking like a fail. To me, if you have dominated all the way to AAA, there is a very good chance you will at least make it in MLB. Right now...we have twice the pitchers as we do spots to even “see” if they have the right stuff.
 
Tapate50 said:
Well that and they fall off. Remember the Beachy, JJ, Hanson, Medlen years?
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That is true, but we have rushed all these guys to AAA. You can’t just keep them there two years. All these guys were in the rotation and were given a chance.

That is definitely a worse case scenario.

I just don’t want to trade these guys before they are even given a chance, just because there is no spot to even give them a chance.i don’t have a answer for that though. I guess just have them all in the bullpen for experience.
 
Probably pumping up some value of some similarly talented pitchers prior to winter trades. Hoping we sell high on a few like Anderson/Wilson rather than sell low on Gohara/Soroka. Not that I want particular names traded, just hate selling deflated value.

And to be fair Gohara/Wentz/Allard/Soroka have all lost value this year. That’s just been mitigated by the increase in value of Touki, Wilson, and Anderson.

Curious to see what happens with Teheran. We have way to many internal options to keep him next year. Wonder if we pay some of his salary to a pitching needy team like Seattle.
 
Oklahomabrave said:
Probably pumping up some value of some similarly talented pitchers prior to winter trades. Hoping we sell high on a few like Anderson/Wilson rather than sell low on Gohara/Soroka. Not that I want particular names traded, just hate selling deflated value.

And to be fair Gohara/Wentz/Allard/Soroka have all lost value this year. That’s just been mitigated by the increase in value of Touki, Wilson, and Anderson.

Curious to see what happens with Teheran. We have way to many internal options to keep him next year. Wonder if we pay some of his salary to a pitching needy team like Seattle.
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Man, Wilson might just be the guy to not sell. I hope we keep Wilson.
 
Well, I feel like AA has made it pretty clear that this off season/next year's trade deadline is probably going to be the time we start to really become aggressive and shop for top tier additions. If some of those guys go on a tear, the fact that they will be showing success at even higher levels (and already highly ranked prospects) then they will have even more value. It gives these guys so much more exposure to the rest of the league and it can really help build up their hype. It also gives us just a little more time to evaluate which ones could be franchise staples or trade chips.
 
Oklahomabrave said:
Probably pumping up some value of some similarly talented pitchers prior to winter trades. Hoping we sell high on a few like Anderson/Wilson rather than sell low on Gohara/Soroka. Not that I want particular names traded, just hate selling deflated value.

And to be fair Gohara/Wentz/Allard/Soroka have all lost value this year. That’s just been mitigated by the increase in value of Touki, Wilson, and Anderson.

Curious to see what happens with Teheran. We have way to many internal options to keep him next year. Wonder if we pay some of his salary to a pitching needy team like Seattle.
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Selling Anderson would be a huge mistake... he is looking like legit TOR potential.
 
zbhargrove said:
Selling Anderson would be a huge mistake... he is looking like legit TOR potential.
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And that could be totally right...or totally wrong.

I thought we would slow the pace of these guys, so that the guys really killing it in the minors would for the most part get a shot. AA is doing the Coppy thing though. You would think it was still 2016 the way they are rushing these guys. That’s what I do not get.

I was glad for Allard, but he is like the LAST of the big pitchers I want to see get a shot. He is literally the first big name I would sell and it’s not even close. Get past him and man...it’s a bunch of high end arms. Of course they all won’t pan out. I just don’t want to end up trading two #1-#2 types simply because we didn’t even have a spot for them to prove it.
 
TheBravos said:
And that could be totally right...or totally wrong.

I thought we would slow the pace of these guys, so that the guys really killing it in the minors would for the most part get a shot. AA is doing the Coppy thing though. You would think it was still 2016 the way they are rushing these guys. That’s what I do not get.

I was glad for Allard, but he is like the LAST of the big pitchers I want to see get a shot. He is literally the first big name I would sell and it’s not even close. Get past him and man...it’s a bunch of high end arms. Of course they all won’t pan out. I just don’t want to end up trading two #1-#2 types simply because we didn’t even have a spot for them to prove it.
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You can only "slow the pace" of those kids when it makes sense not to promote them, and several of the arms just haven't really given AA any choice. They each were given specific things to work on when camp broke, and once they've shown sufficient enough improvement in those areas you simply have to provide them with a new challenge. With Touki it was the walks. More than likely it was trusting the changeup for Anderson.

As several others pointed out above, there's a good chance several will be gone by this time next season as AA looks to plug other holes - Realmuto and Iglesias come to mind. Just a guess, but I think AA didn't make a play this week for guys on that level because he's using the end of the season to make his final decision on exactly who he's not moving (Soroka, Wright, Touki, and Anderson if it were my choice). That could be the same reason Pache was promoted as well - with Ender under control and Waters having the season he has, you have to at least consider making Pache available as a piece if you get that blockbuster you just can't turn down. Granted that would probably have to be on the deGrom/Bumgarner level, but if that comes up...

Oklahoma mentioned the quickly changing values - you just don't want to be stuck holding all these arms when the injuries come (like they do for everybody) or they start to regress. Push them while they're hot and see what the ones that aren't at the top of your personal list can get you. We missed the chance to sell high on Julio, and I think that's the reason AA went out and got Gausman. Now that he's here, he becomes the "third guy" (along with Folty and Newk of course) that you can match up with anybody else's Top 3 - guys that can be an "Ace" on any given night even if it's not every night. That takes the pressure off for Soroka/Wright/Touki and any of the others you keep over the next two years and allows them to pitch at the bottom of the rotation against much less talented Pitchers on most nights.

I think Julio is somewhere else next year, and at least 3 or 4 of the prospects are as well.
 
I don't think AA is rushing anyone. I think he's trying to accumulate as much data as he can so he can decide on who goes and who stays. The offseason will be interesting.
 
We call that a good problem to have. Barring a trade we will have legendary depth in the rotation to start next year and I am more than okay with that.
 
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