Allard's Stuff

To be fair I'm not a big fan of MLB pipeline. I think their rankings suck, but they're fun to look at because of how they set up.
 
Allard is a smart kid. Maybe he is smart enough to pitch better than his stuff. He would be the very first guy I would move in a deal. There are teams that would value him, but more that would not.
 
12:18
Kiley McDaniel: Allard was 90-93 as an amateur and was 92-96 for one inning in the PG All American game in August before the draft. He’s basically been 88-94 every outing of his life except for that one, but he was an athletic 16-year-old with three pitches and feel so, despite not being projectable, some thought he would mature into more velo. The back issue didn’t help, but that was always a bit optimistic. This is about what he is.

12:19
Kiley McDaniel: If you define top of the rotation as #1 or #2 starters like how scouts define those things, there’s about 10 #1’s and like 20 os so #2’s. A system can’t have a bunch of frontline guys when there’s 30 on Earth, so a bunch of mid-rotation, 2.5-3.0 WAR pitchers is as good as you’re going to do.

12:21
Kiley McDaniel: Eric and I are wrong about plenty, but Braves fans seemed catatonic that we didn’t have Allard and Bryse Wilson higher. I hope both succeed but Allard sits 88-92 with solid average stuff and feel and Wilson’s two off-speed pitches are average to a hair above on good days. These sorts of things typically don’t work for even mid-rotation starters. Now, they both could end up being that or even better, but this is why scouts (and generally us) prefer to have more raw stuff, or at least projectability to get that stuff, when we’re projecting impact arms. Both will be productive big leaguers, though, because feel and makeup and competitiveness still matter.
 
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As we've said before, the Braves drafted Allard based on a 1 inning spike in velocity.

Also interesting to note that when he says "solid average stuff" he is talking about non-fastballs, because Allard's fastball is NOT average for the MLB level.
 
Enscheff said:
As we've said before, the Braves drafted Allard based on a 1 inning spike in velocity.

Also interesting to note that when he says "solid average stuff" he is talking about non-fastballs, because Allard's fastball is NOT average for the MLB level.
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Allard has also not had an 88 mph to 94 mph fastball so far in MLB. It's been more 88-89 mph. Plus his change-up and curve hasn't been there much either. That left him throwing a lot of 88 mph fastballs and that turned into a batting practice vs the Nats. That is as bad as I have seen him pitch, you could tell he had nothing going that day.
 
Braves1976 said:
Allard has also not had an 88 mph to 94 mph fastball so far in MLB. It's been more 88-89 mph. Plus his change-up and curve hasn't been there much either. That left him throwing a lot of 88 mph fastballs and that turned into a batting practice vs the Nats. That is as bad as I have seen him pitch, you could tell he had nothing going that day.
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He has nothing any day.

I’ll just be the one to go on record and say that Allard sucks. It’s as simple as that.
 
Braves1976 said:
Allard has also not had an 88 mph to 94 mph fastball so far in MLB. It's been more 88-89 mph. Plus his change-up and curve hasn't been there much either. That left him throwing a lot of 88 mph fastballs and that turned into a batting practice vs the Nats. That is as bad as I have seen him pitch, you could tell he had nothing going that day.
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Based on what I've read on twitter from minor league baseball followers, that is not what Allard is averaging this year in the minors. He's averaging 90-91 and topping at 93 and that does not cut it today without Cliff Lee like control. He's either going to need that or to figure something else out.

It's not a hot take to say this version of Allard won't succeed, it is to say he can't figure something else out to succeed. But if he keeps throwing 90-91, without that amazing command (not normal great command), I can safely say he won't be a long term major leaguer.
 
TheBravos said:
Allard is a smart kid. Maybe he is smart enough to pitch better than his stuff. He would be the very first guy I would move in a deal. There are teams that would value him, but more that would not.
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Some club with immediate rotation needs, not a whole lot of money, and preferably deep fences. Could be a team rebuilding and willing to take a flyer or a payroll flush team just looking for some cheap starts at the back end and not much of a system.

Wouldn't think anyone would be paying a lot for it though.

I just am not sure the Braves will be the club with the patience to give him his opportunity unless things start going well soon or bigger stuff options all get injured or crap out.
 
GeorgiaGirl said:
Based on what I've read on twitter from minor league baseball followers, that is not what Allard is averaging this year in the minors. He's averaging 90-91 and topping at 93 and that does not cut it today without Cliff Lee like control. He's either going to need that or to figure something else out.

It's not a hot take to say this version of Allard won't succeed, it is to say he can't figure something else out to succeed. But if he keeps throwing 90-91, without that amazing command (not normal great command), I can safely say he won't be a long term major leaguer.
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It might be more accurate to say you can't be Cliff Lee without great command.

There are more guys who have stable major league careers throwing 90-91 then there are guys with great command.

Velocity is important. It's not the only factor. Or necessarily the most important.

But its unclear whether Allard has any of the other things that would make him successful. I sure don't know. Two stints is hardly the decider on that one. I would vote against and I've suggested he should be shopped all along. But it's not an impossible story.
 
Southcack77 said:
It might be more accurate to say you can't be Cliff Lee without great command.

There are more guys who have stable major league careers throwing 90-91 then there are guys with great command.

Velocity is important. It's not the only factor. Or necessarily the most important.

But its unclear whether Allard has any of the other things that would make him successful. I sure don't know. Two stints is hardly the decider on that one. I would vote against and I've suggested he should be shopped all along. But it's not an impossible story.
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I feel like the guys throwing 90-91 that are successful have already been through the wars and understand what to do at that velo to succeed. Not a guy that is just coming up with that velo or the K rate he had in AAA.
 
Allard needs to go to a rebuilding team that can let him take his lumps like the Royals did with Davies. I wonder how much his Fb would improve coming out of the pen.
 
GeorgiaGirl said:
I feel like the guys throwing 90-91 that are successful have already been through the wars and understand what to do at that velo to succeed. Not a guy that is just coming up with that velo or the K rate he had in AAA.
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And you would be correct. Guys succeeding now at 90-91 came up throwing much harder and were then naturally selected over time for their their skill to succeed as their stuff declined.

Pitchers don't come up throwing 90 and succeed.
 
Enscheff said:
And you would be correct. Guys succeeding now at 90-91 came up throwing much harder and were then naturally selected over time for their their skill to succeed as their stuff declined.

Pitchers don't come up throwing 90 and succeed.
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My only hope was mueller was doing the same thing last year. Offseason at driveline and he’s up a few mph.
allard s fb is slow and straight....thtats awful

Can anyone scrap the fastball? Can he throw a cutter just to get some movement and pitch backwards?
 
Allard needs to call up Neikro and learn that knuckle ball. He's not making it as a starter in the majors with that fastball. Even if he added a MPH or 2, it's still incredibly straight.
 
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