The Trump Presidency

can anyone explain why paul manafort should receive a pardon? he clearly committed crimes. why would he be receiving a pardon? are crimes OK if you're rich, white, and trump's friend?
 
the left has lost it mind. ok.
meanwhile, trump fanatics are buying into Qanon, shooting up pizza places, sending bombs to trump's opponents, yelling at people of different races for no other reason than being a different race, shooting up black churches (trying, anyway, before shooting black people in a grocery store), shooting up synagogues. i agree some people have lost their minds.

i would never and have never dated a girl who supported trump. it's a major character flaw to be able to listen to his incoherence and stand behind it. something is intellectually wrong with a person who can do that. i wouldn't touch it.

donald trump rages on twitter, posting memes of his political opponents (plus the renowned good man investigating him) in jail, lies literally constantly (like it's insane how often he lies when speaking), is relentless in trying to stop a very legitimate investigation into himself that has already produced results, props up and defends people like KJU, putin, and the crown prince, and has literally zero grip on any kind of policy.

indeed, some people have lost their minds.
 
nsacpi said:
Within the context of the argument you are trying to advance, this distinction doesn't hold water at a number of levels.
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I'm stunned. It's apparent you, julio, et all hold this opinion whenever an argument doesn't fully agree with yours

nsacpi said:
First, speech or rhetoric is surely a type of action. And one that can be very consequential.
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OK. Sure. When Trump starts saying people shouldn't have rights, etc. I'll start paying a lot more attention. As it stands, he typically says things like "Janet Yellen isn't tall enough to be fed chairman"... that makes him sound like an idiot, sure. But nobody is dying here or losing rights. Can you show me otherwise?



nsacpi said:
Second, we have a president who has backed up his rhetoric with very specific actions and policies. The Muslim travel ban. Seperating children from their parents.
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Sure. I didn't/don't agree with the Muslim ban. I don't agree with separating families. But these aren't actions against Americans are they?

nsacpi said:
Third, I'm not so sure one party to a relationship splitting from the other over Trump (an action) is much different from that party continually haranguing the other instead (which technically I suppose is rhetoric). It seems to me if anything that the former is a more mature and reasonable reaction..
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Um... OK... Trump doesn't affect the lives of these women. He seriously doesn't. And, if you read the article - which I suppose you didn't - the women make it clear that their husbands didn't even support Trump... they just don't hate him enough in their view.

Seriously... how sad is that a woman - who marches about how strong willed and not emotional she is - let's a dude she's never met end her marriage.

nsacpi said:
Finally, while not saying that Trump is as bad as Hitler, it does seem to me at some point it is worth ending relationships over politics. And people of principle did do that during such times. Nazi Germany and the Civil War come to mind. One of the union generals in the Civil War was George Henry Thomas. From Virginia. His family never talked to him again after his choice to stay loyal to the union. They didn't even attend his funeral. I'm sure he was aware of the breach that was likely to occur when he made his choice..
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Whoa, Trump's not as bad as Hitler??? How brave of you to say.

You're right... there's a point where supporting a monster is worth ending a relationship over. Has Trump started rounding up the Jews and killing them? No? Oh.

Has he chained up black people? No? Oh (side note, I remember biden promising us that Romney would!)

Has any American's lives been actually impacted by Trump that is new from our standard? If so, could you point out where?

I mean... I'm old enough to remember when Barack Obama deported more hispanics than any President in our country's history. I'm old enough to remember when Obama signed the National Defense Authorization Act, which allows the US government to detain US citizens without trial or due process. I'm old enough to remember when Obama decided he could, and did, assassinate an American citizen without due process. I've recently learned that Obama's CBP used tear gas on migrants on a monthly basis. I remember when Obama separated migrant children from their families. I remember when Obama didn't bother with a Muslim ban, but instead droned more innocent muslim civilians to death than any president in our history.

But he's a statesman whom we all love, remember? Trump is mean on twitter damnit!!!

nsacpi said:
ymmv
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Does indeed to appear that way
 
Ronald Rump said:
I do find it fascinating that sturg's obsession with the left "losing its mind" was one of the things that drove him away from here on his sabbatical. And now that he's back, he's picked up right where he's left off. It's almost as if that obsession has cultivated into he himself losing his own mind over what he perceives to be people on the left losing their mind.

People still break up from relationships in this day and age due to racist in-laws. So it's not really surprising that a yugely divisive figure such as Trump would cause strain on ordinary everyday relationships. But like the Mueller investigation, sturg probably thinks what Trump has done culturally to our country with his rhetoric and actions is just a big nothing burger that the left is overreacting about.
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I actually took a sabbatical because a member on your board said that I was a rapist who needed to die for suggesting that a man shouldn't be convicted on an uncorroborated 35 year old accusation without further evidence

Somehow that makes me the irrational one?
 
Super said:
the left has lost it mind. ok.
meanwhile, trump fanatics are buying into Qanon, shooting up pizza places, sending bombs to trump's opponents, yelling at people of different races for no other reason than being a different race, shooting up black churches (trying, anyway, before shooting black people in a grocery store), shooting up synagogues. i agree some people have lost their minds.

i would never and have never dated a girl who supported trump. it's a major character flaw to be able to listen to his incoherence and stand behind it. something is intellectually wrong with a person who can do that. i wouldn't touch it.

donald trump rages on twitter, posting memes of his political opponents (plus the renowned good man investigating him) in jail, lies literally constantly (like it's insane how often he lies when speaking), is relentless in trying to stop a very legitimate investigation into himself that has already produced results, props up and defends people like KJU, putin, and the crown prince, and has literally zero grip on any kind of policy.

indeed, some people have lost their minds.
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imagine being this emotional about everything.

i could post a bunch of stories about crazy leftists being crazy - including a dude who shot up a congressional baseball game or several who sent poison packages to republicans or several who harassed people out of public places or... I could point out a lady who is suing a dude for child abuse because he's not supporting their 6 year old's sex change... or i could point out...

We could agree that crazy people are crazy.

But somehow, I don't think you're rational enough to have a reasonable discussion.
 
Julio3000 said:
So this is an issue of government corruption, not specifically related to Trump. Must be just as nice to have such a convenient rhetorical get-out-of-jail free card as it is to have leverage to get a pardon from the president.
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I think Trump has pretty shameful moral character.

One of the best things about him is he has exposed our government corruption by being so bad at hiding it
 
mqt said:
Not getting into the rest of the argument, but allow me to say we shouldn’t have used tear gas on migrants this week or during the Obama Administration.
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As is always the case, that's very easy to say years later... would have liked to seen the outrage we're seeing today when happened then
 
sturg33 said:
As is always the case, that's very easy to say years later... would have liked to seen the outrage we're seeing today when happened then
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I call Bull**** --- you knew no more about the 2013 incident in 2013 than you knew about it the morning of November 25
Sans the aid of RW redddit pages and the cottage industry of all things tax cut
 
57Brave said:
I call Bull**** --- you knew no more about the 2013 incident in 2013 than you knew about it the morning of November 25
Sans the aid of RW redddit pages and the cottage industry of all things tax cut
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You might want to ask yourself why you know so much about this incident, but knew nothing of the hundreds of incidents under the previous President
 
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