116th Congress

You may be right about semantics but that's the thing about you and me. We can discuss something and agree or disagree the conversation remains civil. Wouldn't you agree? Try telling the hard line right folks you're in favor of letting the government stick its nose into the business world, for any reason except to funnel them some more corporate welfare and see how civil THEY are. .
 
Oklahomahawk said:
You may be right about semantics but that's the thing about you and me. We can discuss something and agree or disagree the conversation remains civil. Wouldn't you agree? Try telling the hard line right folks you're in favor of letting the government stick its nose into the business world, for any reason except to funnel them some more corporate welfare and see how civil THEY are. .
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I'm always open to civil discourse with anyone - even ideologues. What we are seeing now is what I liken to the downfall of the US education. When I was in high school there was a celebration for those of us that were high achievers due to hard work or natural IQ. My classes were enriching and exciting within a public school system. Now, as you know probably better than most, more attention is paid to those underachievers and individuals that don't care whereby the achievers are overlooked and left malnourished (within an academic paradigm).

What we see now in politics is a catering to those that choose not to succeed for lack of motivation or acceptance of victim hood. Its a toxic environment and purposely put in place to advance the 'need' for government.
 
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thethe said:
I'm always open to civil discourse with anyone - even ideologues. What we are seeing now is what I liken to the downfall of the US education. When I was in high school there was a celebration for those of us that were high achievers due to hard work or natural IQ. My classes were enriching and exciting within a public school system. Now, as you know probably better than most, more attention is paid to those underachievers and individuals that don't care whereby the achievers are overlooked and left malnourished (within an academic paradigm).

What we see now in politics is a catering to those that choose not succeed for lack of motivation or acceptance of victim hood. Its a toxic environment and purposely put in place to advance the 'need' for government.
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I am in my 26th year in education. I could tell you stories...

I can also tell you it works both ways. There are just as many snowflakes on the right as there are on the left. They just don't see it that way.
 
I disagree with your last point but there are definitely purists on the right that just can't see the danger of an unchecked system and what its doing the majority of the country. I know he is not for everyone but Tucker Carlson really nails the point. The destruction of the family unit due to dual incomes and 'female empowerment' (yeah yeah call me a bigot) is a rot that that is destroying the country from the inside.
 
thethe said:
I disagree with your last point but there are definitely purists on the right that just can't see the danger of an unchecked system and what its doing the majority of the country. I know he is not for everyone but Tucker Carlson really nails the point. The destruction of the family unit due to dual incomes and 'female empowerment' (yeah yeah call me a bigot) is a rot that that is destroying the country from the inside.
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I don't think we can nail it down to any one point but I agree the extra pressures put on the family unit are responsible for many of today's national woes. Look at some of white folks too who don't like the fact that now they have competition for jobs, positions, promotions, opportunities, etc., when a generation ago they could have them just for having a pulse and you'll have another bunch of snowflakes, in this case redneck snowflakes. There is no ONE cause or one solution. A LOT of it does go back to your idea (which you know I agree with you on) about some individuals and some corporations literally strangling out the competition and eventually that competition winds up being real human beings, with families, dreams and aspirations, all of which get crushed when they find themselves out of work and out of hope through no fault of their own.

I am a BIG believer in cause and effect being traceable to most of our problems as a nation and a people. Look at the state of the corporate world 150 years ago. Factories and other businesses made millions while they kept their workers, actual human beings, about 1/64 of an inch from starvation and thought of themselves as some sort of good Christian moral heroes for it. Nobody who attacks that sort of thing is going to go unscathed including you once you tell your theories to the wrong person. It's also important to realize that even people you might disagree with on 90% of everything they say still may be right about the other 10%. Hell, Karl Marx was even right about some things even though he was a thoroughly insufferable SOB about 90% of the time. Is it right to overlook or dismiss him on those few things he's right about just because you think he's an ahole about most everything else?

I feel like we as a nation have lost the ability to do fractions, as it were. Got stuff to do now. I'll see what you wrote tomorrow. Take care.
 
sturg33 said:
Socialism isn't a new idea is been around for centuries with a 100% failure rate a body count in the hundreds of millions.

Meanwhile, you keep saying nothing has been proposed.

Have you not read the Green New Deal proposal?

The media won't ask her about the details of it... but maybe you should read it, then explain how it's even possible, then explain what.must happen.

I've got news for you... "The rich paying their fair share" ain't gonna cut it
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I’m always curious as to whether the people who push the “socialist body count” are really reflective and honest enough to look at the massive famines and massacres and the scale of deaths in colonial India and China, or in the Belgian Congo, or in 20th Century conflicts in Africa and South/Central America, or at the wars of the 20th Century and ascribe then to capitalism as quickly as they ascribe the deaths under Mao, Stalin, and the Khmer Rouge to socialism.
 
Julio3000 said:
There’s already a Congressional White Caucus. It’s called the Republican Party.
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Like I said, backwards.

It'll be a good day when we can look at someone beyond the color of their skin.

Liberals have taken us back 60 years in idenity politics
 
sturg33 said:
Like I said, backwards.

It'll be a good day when we can look at someone beyond the color of their skin.

Liberals have taken us back 60 years in idenity politics
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I'm thrilled to know you know and understand what it's like to be a minority who doesn't want to be judged for the color of their skin, but still end up getting judged for it when you try to avoid even thinking about race.

Tell me what you've learned from these experiences so we can share our experiences.

Or maybe it's just easier for me to blame liberals?
 
We can either go backwards or we can move forwards.

I'm seeing a celebration of anti semitism and things like "black cacuses"

That is 1950s thinking.
 
sturg33 said:
We can either go backwards or we can move forwards.

I'm seeing a celebration of anti semitism and things like "black cacuses"

That is 1950s thinking.
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Weird, so what do we call all of your political beliefs then, 1700's thinking?

I'm going to apply the same elementary logic to all of your arguments then. It's ok for sturg to want us to move forward past "identity politics" because racism supposedly ended 60 years ago and libs are bringing it back, but it's not ok for those of us who disagree with his politics to want to try and modernize interpretations of the constitution instead of trying to relegate every debate down to what would the founding fathers in 1776 have thought would be the solution to a problem in 2019.
 
Individual-1 said:
Weird, so what do we call all of your political beliefs then, 1700's thinking?

I'm going to apply the same elementary logic to all of your arguments then. It's ok for sturg to want us to move forward past "identity politics" because racism supposedly ended 60 years ago and libs are bringing it back, but it's not ok for those of us who disagree with his politics to want to try and modernize interpretations of the constitution instead of trying to relegate every debate down to what would the founding fathers in 1776 have thought would be the solution to a problem in 2019.
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You are absolutely free to say that believing in individual liberty is 1700s thinking.

You're right, it appears, that nobody wants to take that path forward.

Let's get back to celebrating our new anti-semetic congresswoman!
 
sturg33 said:
You are absolutely free to say that believing in individual liberty is 1700s thinking.

You're right, it appears, that nobody wants to take that path forward.

Let's get back to celebrating our new anti-semetic congresswoman!
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You either care about bigotry/racism/antisemitism or you don't. The left should stop faking it to cause division in the country.
 
nsacpi said:
Interesting opinion piece, with thought-provoking title, about Sweden.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-sweden-overcame-socialism-11547078767
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Don't subscribe, so I can't read the article, but I believe the gist of it is correct. Markets can, but don't always, work and I think one of the problems in the Western European model is that they, like us to a lesser extent, are having trouble transforming their economies. They aren't to, and won't get to, Greece-level issues, but they have generous public benefit structure that will have to be pared back a bit along with a recognition that they have to compete in a global economy. I wonder how many of the market-based reforms are some sort of state capitalism.
 
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