Official Offseason Thread
- Thread starter Hudson2
- Start date
Once again the Braves are set to be a playoff contender but not a real threat to go far in the playoffs AKA the Oakland A’s of the south.
Until they decide to spend profit either by free agency or via trading in the prospects they’ve assembled then I don’t see why people are disappointed or upset.
AA pretty clearly knows he has a base playoff contender regardless of who he adds as long as he has Acuna/Albies and all the other kids under control and in their prime and wants to keep the flexibility to make moves during the season with no long term aging players.Its the smart thing to do and also the way you appease the fan base without truly putting your chips all in.
While a big part of me would love to see us go for it and acquire KB or NA, a true game changing superstar to go along with Acuna and middle of the order bat, I don’t think the Braves will ever make that type of move as long as we have the current ownership.
Right now our bottom line looks good and the battery is starting to make a little more so they won’t cut into the profits by adding any long term contract.
Right or wrong It’s the Liberty way so may as well just enjoy the ride and the inevitable letdown in October.
Hopefully the bullpen makes up for the loss of JD somewhat and one of the young pitchers joins Soroka and Fried as being long term pieces on the cheap.
Until they decide to spend profit either by free agency or via trading in the prospects they’ve assembled then I don’t see why people are disappointed or upset.
AA pretty clearly knows he has a base playoff contender regardless of who he adds as long as he has Acuna/Albies and all the other kids under control and in their prime and wants to keep the flexibility to make moves during the season with no long term aging players.Its the smart thing to do and also the way you appease the fan base without truly putting your chips all in.
While a big part of me would love to see us go for it and acquire KB or NA, a true game changing superstar to go along with Acuna and middle of the order bat, I don’t think the Braves will ever make that type of move as long as we have the current ownership.
Right now our bottom line looks good and the battery is starting to make a little more so they won’t cut into the profits by adding any long term contract.
Right or wrong It’s the Liberty way so may as well just enjoy the ride and the inevitable letdown in October.
Hopefully the bullpen makes up for the loss of JD somewhat and one of the young pitchers joins Soroka and Fried as being long term pieces on the cheap.
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
I think AA is going to add a big bat. But more likely at the trade deadline.
Hudson2
Well-known member
I think the pressure is on to add one before ST. If he waited till the deadline and we were far out bc of the offense he’d be on the hot seat.
tululush
New member
I was about to post this exact same message.
Between knowing the team, as it's currently constructed, isn't as good as it was last year, the fact that everyone on social media is blasting the Braves, and the fact that it's much more difficult to find an impact, middle of the order power bat at the deadline vs a reliever, I think he has to, and will make a move before the season. At least I hope. But then again I was pretty confident that he was going to sign JD and we pretty much sat with our hands in our lap and did absolutely nothing except go through the motions a day or two before he signed with the Twins.
rico43
<B>Director of Minor League Reports</B>
There was no reasonable way to match the deal for Donaldson (which supposedly includes a fifth year player option).
Not wanted to be accused of agreeing with Shanks, he says if Win Now is any kind of goal, then the thing to do is trade for Arenado, even if it includes Pache or Waters, and Anderson or Wright, and Riley. But I would make them take Inciarte as well to provide more a payroll balance. Arenado can opt out after two years, but can he realistically expect to make more than the the $35 M per that he is currently getting?
Not wanted to be accused of agreeing with Shanks, he says if Win Now is any kind of goal, then the thing to do is trade for Arenado, even if it includes Pache or Waters, and Anderson or Wright, and Riley. But I would make them take Inciarte as well to provide more a payroll balance. Arenado can opt out after two years, but can he realistically expect to make more than the the $35 M per that he is currently getting?
tululush
New member
Agreed. We weren't and shouldn't have matched the deal that Minnesota gave JD. But that doesn't sound like that was the problem. JD said we didn't make an offer until the day before and our offer wasn't even in the same stratosphere. Based on what he said when he signed with us last year, how he spoke highly of us throughout the year, and his comments in his most recent interview, he would have taken pretty much any deal we offered that wasn't a total slap in the face. When he said he was giving us the last opportunity in negotiations, and continued to talk about how the Braves were his team he idolized growing up and how much it meant to him to put on our jersey, I'm fairly certain he was going to say yes to anything reasonable we put in front of him. 3/70, which is 23 million a year, plus a fourth year option around 20 million or a 5-10 million buyout would have gotten him signed. At the worst that deal is 3/80 which isn't going to kill us. But what's done is done.
I know nobody on this board likes Shanks, including myself, but he's pretty much spot on. If we want to win now, give up that package and make Colorado eat as much money as we can. They'd be dumb not to take that package and pay us in the process. The problem is I'm pretty sure with the way AA has been slow playing our roster for the last few years, giving out 1-2 year deals in length each off-season, and locking up our studs to cheap deals, he's not going to blow his load to win now. He'd rather slow play, win 90ish games every year, get us to the playoffs and then roll the dice once we're there. Unless we get a new owner who significantly increases our payroll we're not ever going to make any big splashes in free agency or take on any massive contracts via trade. Just won't happen.
From who?
Absolutely no reason he would be on the hotseat from McGuirk or ownership. He wouldn't be overspending, and we'd still have our young core with all our prospects.
tululush
New member
If we don't sign someone and we fall out of the race, there will be some major hell to pay. He won't be fired or be on the hot seat by management, but the fans would be up his ass. I think AA is a great gm, but he sure did misstep last off-season by misjudging the market on starting pitching. Thankfully we were fortunate enough to be able to sign Keuchel. And now this off-season if we don't sign a big bat to protect Freddie, he'll have misjudged the market again by spending more money in the bullpen than we theoretically needed. I love having a deep pen, but not if the choice was having a third closer vs a clean up hitter. And that's not me advocating a JD signing. I truly believe that decision was made due to age, regardless of how much cash we have laying around. My comment has to do with having the ability or not having the ability to sign someone that is young, in his prime, and fills a need for us (Ozuna or Castellanos). If we have the cash, either should be signed.
Improvements are improvements - doesn't matter that they're not hitting behind Freddie Freeman. Those pen upgrades will be huge over 162 games - Luke Jackson was closing games at one point, he's now the 5th best reliever (at best) in the pen behind Melancon, Smith, Martin, and Greene, and if they're healthy and have their *hit together you can argue that you'd even rather use O'Day and Minter at times. That's a monster upgrade since this time last year.
With Markakis another year older, you can also argue that there will be some improvement from his position since there's probably no way AA allows Snitker to get away with playing him so much against lefties.
Team option - relatively sure NOBODY was giving him a player option for a fifth year..
JD already had 4/92 guaranteed. You think him giving up potentially 20 million is reasonable?
Hudson2
Well-known member
From the fans and media no doubt. We are in our contention window. You can’t lose the production you got from JD and just not replace it or come close. He may still get a bat but times ticking down and after he neglected the rotation and bp last offseason who knows if he’ll get another bat or not.
Hudson2
Well-known member
So Markakis position will be better huh? Duval spent the majority of the season in AAA last year bc they had no faith in him. He got hot when he came up so maybe he snapped out of his funk. I’ve said since the end of last season the Braves need 2 bats to be serious WS contenders, one at 3b and a legit COF. We’ll see how it all plays out.
tululush
New member
The deal I outlined in my scenario was 3/80. Yes, I do think he would have given up 12 million to re-sign with us.
And to take it a step further, it’s a safe bet he could have re-entered the market and gotten 12 million from someone after his deal with us concluded. So 3/80 from us and then 1/12 from someone is exactly the same as 4/92 from Minnesota.
tululush
New member
At best we get a power bat at either 3B or cOF and platoon the other. At worst we platoon both with Markakis getting the majority of abs bc he bas “the pictures.” Realistically...ugh I don’t know anymore. But I don’t see two more impact bats coming, sadly.
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
Agreed. Two impact bats are unlikely. But one is. We will have some choices at the deadline. AA needs to carefully evaluate things. Which do we need more? Some to play third or OF. A lefty or righty hitter. Of course price and terms will come into play.
Anything that keeps Markakis from playing against lefties will be an improvement, yes - ask the numbers guys. He had a .653 OPS against them last season. Here's something to help you with context for that number - Riley's OPS against RHPs in 2019 was .676, meaning he hit them better than Markakis hit LHPs. Ender even had a .701 OPS against LHPs last season.
Markakis shouldn't even be allowed on the bus to games if a LHP is pitching that day.
Apparently AA has to threaten to fire Snitker to get that through his head - he likely does that between now and April if he hasn't already.
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Unless there's a monster Seager/Haniger deal in the works, this has likely been the case the whole time.
At some point in time, folks have to take AA at his word (to a point) even when he's speaking GM-Speak. I don't think he's lying to anyone when he has said money wasn't the issue and that McGuirk hasn't said no to anything. Chances are, he looked at the more important numbers surrounding tacking on that 4th (or 5th) year to sign Donaldson - his age, injury history, and expected decline (particularly since there's no guarantee the Braves could use him as a DH in a couple years) - and he simply decided there will be better places to spend that money because there's a better chance for a Riley bounceback/trade for someone and/or improvement from other places (Waters/Pache replacing Markakis/Ender) than there is that Donaldson makes it through 4 more seasons.
AA understands the numbers as well or better than anyone here does - it's highly unlikely that he substantially misjudged the Donaldson market OR that he signed Smith with money that would've left him unable to sign Josh. It's much more likely that he simply looked at the situation after consulting the numbers without emotion and decided that kind of contract wasn't a good idea. Folks here do that all the time when saying it's a bad idea to extend Freeman now, I see little reason to think AA didn't simply look at the Donaldson situation the same way they do.