http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/o/ortizru01.shtml
No, I didn't forget anything about Russ Ortiz.
With Freeman signed, who should Wren try too extend next?
- Thread starter Heyward
- Start date
http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/o/ortizru01.shtml
No, I didn't forget anything about Russ Ortiz.
Totally agree. I think both sides are biding their time to see what Heyward can do the next two years. The Braves can't pay someone that kind of money to not play full seasons most of the time and Heyward shouldn't have to settle for less if he can prove he's more like the player from 2010 and 2012 instead of 2011 and 2013 (although I give him pass on that since surgery and getting hit in the face is just bad luck). Hopefully he can play full seasons the next two years and hopefully the Braves can sign him long term.
AUTiger7222
Called Up to the Major Leagues
So
1999 - 3.81 ERA in 207 2/3 IP
2001 - 3.29 ERA in 218 2/3 IP
2002 - 3.61 ERA in 214 1/3 IP
2003 - 3.81 ERA in 212 1/3 IP
aren't good years?
AUTiger7222
Called Up to the Major Leagues
I was not saying Russ Ortiz was on the same level as a Halladay and Carpenter. I was listing examples of pitchers that just suddenly fell off. But I think any pitcher that consistently throws up an ERA below 4 is a good pitcher.
Then Ortiz isn't a good pitcher?
Nor did he fall off the cliff unexpectedly. He was inconsistent due to his number of walks and was a guy that could pitch better than his FIP at times, but everyone would talk about how it would come to bite him at some point.
AUTiger7222
Called Up to the Major Leagues
Ortiz from the start of his career through his last season in Atlanta had exactly an ERA of 4 especially if they're averaging 200 innings pitched a season like Ortiz did. He had 4 years with ERA's under 4. I consider that a good pitcher. What do you consider a good pitcher? And he did fall off a cliff unexpectedly after he went to Arizona.
1998-2004 - 222 G, 212 GS, 4.00 ERA in 1341 2/3 IP, 104 ERA+
2005-2010 - 89 G, 54 GS, 6.64 ERA in 319 2/3 IP, 66 ERA+
You don't consider that falling off a cliff unexpectedly?
You might be the new king of cherry picking and you don't every realize when you do it.
AUTiger7222
Called Up to the Major Leagues
What in the world did I cherry pick here? Is ERA and IP not the two most important stats there are to judge a pitcher by? Oh wait a minute. I forgot. With you the only viable stat there is to judge pitchers is FIP. Anything else is cherry picking according to you.
AUTiger7222
Called Up to the Major Leagues
But again it happened suddenly with both Halladay and Carpenter. That was my point. I never said they nor Minor couldn't still be very good into their late 30s.