The Coronavirus, not the beer

thethe said:
Please present them and we can discuss to show where you are going wrong like we did with the Bangladesh mask "study".
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i'm still waiting for the poster who shared the link to the "rebuttal" of the Bangladesh study to respond to my invitation to share his thoughts on both the study and the response after he had a chance to read both...having read both, I will offer the view the study is a very fine addition to what is already a mountain of evidence on the efficacy of masks...and the "rebuttal" is a steaming pile of ****

as for efficacy of vaccines in reducing infections i'll re-post something I shared yesterday

[tw]1442514463366602752[/tw]

if fewer people get infected after the vaccines, there are fewer opportunities to pass on the infection to someone else...it is that simple
 
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nsacpi said:
i'm still waiting for the poster who shared the link to the "rebuttal" of the Bangladesh study to respond to my invitation to share his thoughts on both the study and the response after he had a chance to read both...having read both, I will offer the view the study is a very fine addition to what is already a mountain of evidence on the efficacy of masks...and the "rebuttal" is a steaming pile of ****

as for efficacy of vaccines in reducing infections i'll re-post something I shared yesterday

[tw]1442514463366602752[/tw]

if fewer people get infected after the vaccines, there are fewer opportunities to pass on the infection to someone else...it is that simple
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We performed a nationwide retrospective cohort study to estimate vaccine effectiveness against PCR-confirmed SARS-CoV-2 infections among adolescent Israel residents 12–15 years of age who had received the second vaccine dose during July 1–24, 2021.

So we are looking at a period right after children who were vaccinated versus a population that probably held natural immunity and those that had no immunity for longer periods of time.

How would this study look after 3 months of being vaccinated?
 
And then of course this study does what every study does and completely exclude those that had natural immunity so it looks better for the vaccinated people.
 
thethe said:


So we are looking at a period right after children who were vaccinated versus a population that probably held natural immunity and those that had no immunity for longer periods of time.

How would this study look after 3 months of being vaccinated?
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It could be that things will look different after 3 months. The study looks at 4 weeks and found over 90% efficacy, consistent with a number of other studies, some of which look at a time period longer than 4 weeks.
 
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nsacpi said:
It could be that things will look different after 3 months. The study looks at 4 weeks and found over 90% efficacy, consistent with a number of other studies.
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I'm not sure anyone here has stated that the vaccines don't have high levels of efficacy in the periods immediately following.

Maybe I'm wrong but I know I have certainly not been one to have made that claim.

But you don't need to wonder if would look different. We KNOW that the vaccine has waning efficacy following the 2/4/6 month intervals. That is not in debate at all.
 
[tw]1442887551832911886[/tw]

Another study looking a longer period of time. While efficacy wanes over time, the Pfizer still has 70% efficacy at 20 weeks. Getting vaccinated helps protect people and those they interact with. Whether at 4 weeks or 20 weeks. And likely well beyond 20 weeks. And if we all need to get a booster every 6 months, it is a small thing to do on behalf of those we interact with.
 
thethe said:
I'm not sure anyone here has stated that the vaccines don't have high levels of efficacy in the periods immediately following.

Maybe I'm wrong but I know I have certainly not been one to have made that claim.

But you don't need to wonder if would look different. We KNOW that the vaccine has waning efficacy following the 2/4/6 month intervals. That is not in debate at all.
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1) Efficacy wanes

2) Efficacy is still significant 6 months out

3) Getting vaccinated (even getting a booster every six months) is something we should all do on behalf of the people we interact with
 
nsacpi said:
[tw]1442887551832911886[/tw]

Another study looking a longer period of time. While efficacy wanes over time, the Pfizer still has 70% efficacy at 20 weeks. Getting vaccinated helps protect people and those they interact with. Whether at 4 weeks or 20 weeks. And likely well beyond 20 weeks. And if we all need to get a booster every 6 months, it is a small thing to do on behalf of those we interact with.
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So what is the solution then?

Does a person who is just vaccinated get more freedom than someone who was vaccinated 6 months ago?

And that chart is only showing symptomatic infection. Leaves a massive component of spread out of the equation don't you think?
 
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nsacpi said:
FAYqlCVVkAI5FvL
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Love the 20+ week interval as the study probably is limited to 20-24 weeks due to the timing of when it was done.

Leaving a huge part out but I know this is going to result in an endless cycle of boosters and if you don't get those boosters you will no longer have the same freedoms.
 
thethe said:
Leaves a massive component of spread out of the equation don't you think?
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i assume you are referring to people who are asymptomatic but contagious

i think this is something to be taken seriously

that's why i don't think we should have the attitude that the vaccine solves everything with respect to covid...we should also have a lot of testing and definitely need to make at home testing kits easier to get...the more frequently you test the better your chances of reducing spread by asymptomatic people
 
nsacpi said:
i assume you are referring to people who are asymptomatic but contagious

i think this is something to be taken seriously

that's why i don't think we should have the attitude that the vaccine solves everything with respect to covid...we should also have a lot of testing and definitely need to make at home testing kits easier to get...the more frequently you test the better your chances of reducing spread by asymptomatic people
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That is what I'm saying since the assumption should be that since the vaccine does have efficacy that it would restrict asymptomatic infections. Again, this is a good thing.

However, when looking at the numbers on how the vaccines actually prevent spread its cherry picking the data at best...dishonest at worst.
 
A North Carolina-based hospital system announced Monday that roughly 175 unvaccinated employees were fired for failing to comply with the organization’s mandatory coronavirus vaccination policy, the latest in a series of health-care dismissals over coronavirus immunization.

Novant Health said last week that 375 unvaccinated workers — across 15 hospitals and 800 clinics — had been suspended for not getting immunized. Unvaccinated employees were given five days to comply.

Novant Health spokeswoman Megan Rivers tweeted Monday that almost 200 of the suspended workers, including those who had submitted approved exemptions, received their first dose by Friday. The hospital confirmed that the rest of the suspended employees who did not comply were fired, although the exact number of those dismissed was not specified.

Rivers told The Washington Post that more than 99 percent of the system’s roughly 35,000 employees have followed the mandatory vaccination program. She said in a statement that Novant Health was “thrilled” those who chose to be vaccinated have given patients and visitors “better protection against COVID-19 regardless of where they are in our health system.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/heal...witter&utm_campaign=wp_main&utm_medium=social

more than 99%...not bad...hopefully the holdouts reconsider and get their jobs back

we have our ways um incentives
 
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nsacpi said:
A North Carolina-based hospital system announced Monday that roughly 175 unvaccinated employees were fired for failing to comply with the organization’s mandatory coronavirus vaccination policy, the latest in a series of health-care dismissals over coronavirus immunization.

Novant Health said last week that 375 unvaccinated workers — across 15 hospitals and 800 clinics — had been suspended for not getting immunized. Unvaccinated employees were given five days to comply.

Novant Health spokeswoman Megan Rivers tweeted Monday that almost 200 of the suspended workers, including those who had submitted approved exemptions, received their first dose by Friday. The hospital confirmed that the rest of the suspended employees who did not comply were fired, although the exact number of those dismissed was not specified.

Rivers told The Washington Post that more than 99 percent of the system’s roughly 35,000 employees have followed the mandatory vaccination program. She said in a statement that Novant Health was “thrilled” those who chose to be vaccinated have given patients and visitors “better protection against COVID-19 regardless of where they are in our health system.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/heal...witter&utm_campaign=wp_main&utm_medium=social

more than 99%...not bad...hopefully the holdouts reconsider

we have our ways um incentives
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Coercion is not an incentive

The precedent you are setting for a future President Trump is quite dangerous
 
Novant Health introduced its mandatory policy on July 22, saying that employees were given until Sept. 15 to comply and get vaccinated.

“We agree with the North Carolina Healthcare Association, the Infectious Diseases Society of America, and many other health care systems in the region that a mandatory vaccine program is in the best interest of public health,” the health system said in a news release. “Simply put, it is essential to ensure the safety of our patients, team members and communities.”
 
sturg33 said:
Coercion is not an incentive
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two sides of the same coin

is a fine oppression or an incentive

it is all semantics

the fired workers can go find a job at a hospital in a pro-covid part of the country where they will be free to spread their germs to the community...they made a choice...i'm guessing all the folks around here who are big on individual responsibility and taking ownership of the consequences of our choices suddenly aren't gonna be so big on that
 
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sturg33 said:
You are arguing that taking an unnecessary drug is a crime
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this one gets filed under hyperbole too

no one is being charged with a crime...just some folks with a pro-covid point of view being fired from their jobs at a hospital...they seem to have a rather entitled view of what they can do in a hospital setting...my guess is that even at this late date they could reclaim their jobs if they would come to their senses
 
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