Ukraine

I say we hit them where it REALLY hurts, let's get our scientists to develop a new blight/fungus that destroys their entire potato crop while at the same time we corner the world market on vodka. Once they sober up enough to figure out what we've done they'll come to their senses!!!
 
Oklahomahawk said:
I say we hit them where it REALLY hurts, let's get our scientists to develop a new blight/fungus that destroys their entire potato crop while at the same time we corner the world market on vodka. Once they sober up enough to figure out what we've done they'll come to their senses!!!
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I have other friends who lived in Moscow and they were really taken back by how prevalent alcoholism was. Course long winters like that would drive many to a few too many.
 
KeithLockhart said:
Hopefully if he gets us out of this without military intervention he will be praised instead of being a coward for not starting ww3
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Praised for not spending american lives to protect and help people that need it and are far worse off? Praised for letting a tyrant be a bully? So the adage about helping the less fortunate ends at our borders?

Do the people that have the opportunity, and the strength, and the might to stop the injustices in the world have a obligation to do so? Does history not tell you

‘All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing’?
 
Krgrecw said:
Praised for not spending american lives to protect and help people that need it and are far worse off? Praised for letting a tyrant be a bully? So the adage about helping the less fortunate ends at our borders?

Do the people that have the opportunity, and the strength, and the might to stop the injustices in the world have a obligation to do so? Does history not tell you
‘All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing’?
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Of course we have the obligation to do so but we're 17 fricking trillion in debt! If you're ok with him raising taxes to pay for it then cool.

Otherwise we don't have money to try and show the world whom has a bigger penis. Why are you so in a hurry to get into a military confrontation? Did Putin poop on your front yard? We spent billions on a wasted war in Iraq we were never going to win. Afghanistan has no clear victory and you wanted us to stay there too.

And the quote you used. He's called Putin and warned of sanctions and other possibilities. Just because he didn't threaten putin with war we don't havr to make a move yet.

And where has your horn been on North Korea and Syria? I've never seen you so emotional about a certain international situation like this. Are you Ukrainian American?
 
i, as of right now, don't think we should be involved in the Ukraine

it has nothing to do with our debt on why or why not though
 
KeithLockhart said:
Of course we have the obligation to do so but we're 17 fricking trillion in debt! If you're ok with him raising taxes to pay for it then cool.

Otherwise we don't have money to try and show the world whom has a bigger penis. Why are you so in a hurry to get into a military confrontation? Did Putin poop on your front yard? We spent billions on a wasted war in Iraq we were never going to win. Afghanistan has no clear victory and you wanted us to stay there too.

And the quote you used. He's called Putin and warned of sanctions and other possibilities. Just because he didn't threaten putin with war we don't havr to make a move yet.

And where has your horn been on North Korea and Syria? I've never seen you so emotional about a certain international situation like this. Are you Ukrainian American?
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North Korea is China's problem. If I knew that I could take out Kim with a bomb I would right now. There's studies that say we'd need over 100,000 soldiers in NK if the regime fell, to keep order and secure Thier weapons. That would be a big undertaking. NK is all talk, they are no threat.

Syria is a sad situation but like the people of Egypt realized 'the devil you know Is better then the devil you don't know'. Is it better to live under Assad than the Islamic Brotherhood? Egypt took a chance then realized they were wrong.

I just believe that you have to buck people when they get out of line. If Putin is challenged he'd back down. He knows he'd lose. Challenge him. It would be easier to end this now, then it would be tomorrow.

If You have a cancerous tumor, the doctors will tell you take care of this before it spreads. It's easier to fight. If you wait long enough the cancer can spread to a point where fighting it will do no good. That's how I look at this situation. Everyday putin will bring more and more forces into the region. Why would you want a bigger battle?
 
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BedellBrave said:
If they hadn't already effectively taken care of Georgia, I would agree with you.

And if we weren't doing things in Moldova (which indicates some concern on our government's part), I would agree with you.

And if Putin hadn't used Russian natural gas as a weapon as openly as he has I would agree with you.
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Georgia might disagree that it has been taken care of.

That the US sees Moldova as strategically important certainly confirms that there is concern about Russia's ambitions, but that alone doesn't prop up your domino theory.

I also might quibble about Russia's natural gas stick being quite so big and scary. Not big enough that Putin can face down the unified opposition of the rest of Europe & the US.

You're talking about Russia absorbing NATO member states here. Sheer brass and natural gas are not going to get it done.
 
I'm not going to say a pox on both Houses, because the uprising in the Ukraine appears to be a genuine "get rid of all of them" movement because the guy/girl on the street doesn't seem to want anything to do with the recently-released Yulia Tymoshenko, who was as crooked as the pro-Russian puppets.

So where does this leave us? Where the f*ck is the EU in all of this? Are they going to be as worthless as ever in trying to solve the problem? Seems sanctions are in order at the very least and that if US oil companies start selling oil to Europe, it would hit Putin where he lives. Problem with that strategy is it likely puts 50 cents a gallon for American drivers.

Heard the crackhead woman from the American Enterprise Institute deriding Obama on Face the Nation. Problem with AEI and a lot of these neocon outfits is that they are stuck in the 1970s.
 
No, Putin won't walk into Poland like the Soviets did in 1939 ... but a plausible scenario could begin with disruption in Lesser Poland. The region is already unhappy about the disparity of domestic and EU investment in the East versus the South/West. Putin could easily sway allegiances with cheap energy shares and infrastructure investments in the border region.
 
50PoundHead said:
I'm not going to say a pox on both Houses, because the uprising in the Ukraine appears to be a genuine "get rid of all of them" movement because the guy/girl on the street doesn't seem to want anything to do with the recently-released Yulia Tymoshenko, who was as crooked as the pro-Russian puppets.
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This is why I worry -- at this point, the Ukraine is going to embrace stability -- period -- and the Russians are the only ones stepping up with an offering ($16 billion).
 
From what I've gathered (and this could all be wrong), Crimea is largely pro-Russian as it is, and wants to be part of Russia by a majority.
There is a lot that goes in to this other than Russia trying to screw Ukraine, but they are certainly trying to do that.
 
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