119th Congress or Red Wave In Adult Land

Anybody want to venture a guess at how much tips statistically go down over the next several months if no tax on tips or OT is in the final bill? I’d wager the net result on OT will be lower too as companies take a closer look at their OT expenses. While I think not taxing OT especially will still ultimately benefit workers more than hurt, I could envision many people getting less OT. If you want to get serious about helping the American worker, I’d eliminate payroll taxes on OT, not on the worker. Make giving OT more affordable for employers and it’ll incentive more wages.

Edited to add: this isn’t a partisan gripe. I’m well aware this was coming regardless, no blaming being done here. Just curious about the potential negative externalities.
 
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Tapate50 said:
I’m asking bc I don’t know-

But like how do other countries do taxes ?
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www.pbs.org

Dreading doing your taxes? Other countries show us there's another way

Filing your taxes in other countries is not a work-intensive process that can take days or weeks; it can be as simple as clicking a confirmation sent online by the government. For his latest book, "A Fine Mess," J.R. Reid went on global quest for a better system. Economics correspondent Paul...
www.pbs.org www.pbs.org


T.R. REID:

I was in the Netherlands on March 31, the day before their taxes are due.

I was with an executive who makes $200,000 a year, two mortgages, a lot of investments. He'd have to fill out 12 forms in America. I said, Michael, how do you pay your taxes? He pops a beer. He goes online. The government's filled in every line. If the numbers look right, he clicks OK. It takes five minutes.

And, in Japan, you get a postcard from the IRS that says, we think you made this much. We withheld this much. We owe you a refund of that much. We will put it in your bank on April 1. It takes one minute, if you think the numbers are right.

And I said to my friend Togo, you know, in America, people spend hours, days filling out these forms. And he said to me, why would anybody want to do that?




  • PAUL SOLMAN:

    And you explained to him nobody does.
  • T.R. REID:

    I said, nobody does, yes.

    And guess what, Paul? We could do that here. The IRS could fill in every line of the return for most American families. They know all the numbers. Have you ever gotten a CP-2000 letter? This is the one that says, on line 48-Q, you entered $4,211.
  • PAUL SOLMAN:

    Oh, yes, yes.
  • T.R. REID:

    But, actually, it should have been $4,681.
  • PAUL SOLMAN:

    Yes. Actually, yes, yes.
  • T.R. REID:

    And I get that every year, and I think, why did I spend hours trying to fill this out, when they knew? And so some members of Congress have suggested that the IRS fill out the forms for us.

    And H&R Block and the tax software companies lobby against it. So here's the deal: You do more work; they make more money.
 
mqt said:
Anybody want to venture a guess at how much tips statistically go down over the next several months if no tax on tips or OT is in the final bill? I’d wager the net result on OT will be lower too as companies take a closer look at their OT expenses. While I think not taxing OT especially will still ultimately benefit workers more than hurt, I could envision many people getting less OT. If you want to get serious about helping the American worker, I’d eliminate payroll taxes on OT, not on the worker. Make giving OT more affordable for employers and it’ll incentive more wages.

Edited to add: this isn’t a partisan gripe. I’m well aware this was coming regardless, no blaming being done here. Just curious about the potential negative externalities.
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On the tips issue, I’ve yet to hear a good justification why this is a good idea (other than it being politically popular…which for an economic policy is usually a big red flag).

Charlie the cook and Willy the waiter both work at a diner and make the same amount of money, Charlie paid primarily in wages, Willy in tips. Anyone have a compelling reason why we should demand Charlie contribute to funding our government while Willy gets to keep all of his money?

Enough with the special interest carve outs that do more to distort and complicate our already ridiculous tax code. If asking people to pay less in taxes, especially relatively lower income people, is a good idea, then lower their taxes. How they’re actually paid shouldn’t be a factor.
 
acesfull86 said:
On the tips issue, I’ve yet to hear a good justification why this is a good idea (other than it being politically popular…which for an economic policy is usually a big red flag).

Charlie the cook and Willy the waiter both work at a diner and make the same amount of money, Charlie paid primarily in wages, Willy in tips. Anyone have a compelling reason why we should demand Charlie contribute to funding our government while Willy gets to keep all of his money?

Enough with the special interest carve outs that do more to distort and complicate our already ridiculous tax code. If asking people to pay less in taxes, especially relatively lower income people, is a good idea, then lower their taxes. How they’re actually paid shouldn’t be a factor.
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As someone in the industry, it's just dumb. It just means everyone is going to want to be front of house even if they have the personality of a wet sock. Also it seems like it's mainly on cash tips.

Also looking at the provision it seems like it stops after 4 years, payroll taxes are still effected.

Leads me to believe that this is a scam to do 2 things.

1. Increase spending to payroll taxes
2. When the taxes lapse, they're going to go after servers for the drop in declared tips.
 
Tapate50 said:
I know right ?

But he’s correct
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No he isn't. Desperation is the number 1 leading cause of recordable crime. Normal people don't think about robbing a bank, or killing someone.

I don't expect people to understand this because it requires critical thinking and apparently that's lost on everyone.
 
Says the guy living in Lilly whitesville

I live in a city that’s 70% black.

It ain’t desperation.

Are people desperate to litter and assault family members and baby mommas too?
 
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