nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
Not an unproven talent
2015 2.64 FIP 0.9 WAR 48 IP
2016 3.46 FIP 0.8 WAR 77 IP
2017 2.47 FIP 2.2 WAR 75 IP
2018 2.43 FIP 2.1 WAR 70 IP
2019 2.02 FIP 1.6 WAR 42 IP
2019 Trade Deadline Thread:
- Thread starter Southcack77
- Start date
Not an unproven talent
2015 2.64 FIP 0.9 WAR 48 IP
2016 3.46 FIP 0.8 WAR 77 IP
2017 2.47 FIP 2.2 WAR 75 IP
2018 2.43 FIP 2.1 WAR 70 IP
2019 2.02 FIP 1.6 WAR 42 IP
bravesfanMatt
Steve Harvey'd
Yeah seems like a solid reliever. I sometimes live in a Braves bubble and don’t know much about outside players. Like this grouper or salmon. Maybe it is trout guy. A lot folks talk about him but he sounds like a fish to me.
MadduxFanII
Swallowed by Mark Bowman
I confess I'm not entirely sure if I'm interpreting this right, so if I'm wrong I'll kindly ask you all not to jump up and down on me too harshly. But looking at Fangraph, they have Pache's Steamer projection at .253/.292/.393. Assuming that's an MLB projection, updated based on his AA performance so far, the idea of calling him up to play center is...mildly intriguing? If you trust the most adulatory reports on his defense and think he can come up and immediately enter the discussion for best defensive center fielder in baseball, that's at least an idea you have to consider, depending on your internal evaluations of Inciarte.
I remember we talked about it a bit not too long ago when you were discussing your concerns about Riley’s bat and I was discussing my concerns about Ender’s health.
I’d probably lean towards Pache being better than both. Pache’s D has been rated better than Ender’s by some sources and based on what we’ve seen so far this year he can’t be worse with the bat. Riley probably has the best bat of the 3 overall but it’s not real good atm and the defense isn’t great either (although props to him for making it passable). If we’re not gonna go trade for someone I say give him a call. Nothing ventured nothing gained. Worst case we’re back where we started.
Southcack77
Well-known member
Personally, I'm not sure what Pache brings to the table that you aren't getting out of Ender. Asking him to jump from AA to the Majors and then exceed that expectation in a playoff push and the playoffs given his past track record is a little bit of a reach.
Might as well go with the existing option.
CyYoung31
Shift Leader
This.
Yeah. If we are gonna trade Ender for pitching (which I'm not sold on), then I'd rather Riley continue black holing in the 8th spot in LF.
Absolutely. I'm not sure anyone has honestly suggested drastically overpaying for the available options - and been serious about it anyway. The problem around here is that any suggestion that doesn't line up perfectly with the charts gets people shouted down so fast they can't explain themselves.
A lot of it comes down to where you (ultimately AA) feels about where the team is, and what he thinks their chances are regardless of what the charts say. Those charts should absolutely be an important part of his thought process, but eventually he's going to have to be the one responsible for either improving the team or take the heat for blindly following them by passing.
Most fans can handle overpaying slightly with some of the more marginal guys because they're understandably excited about having a chance, and they rightfully think that could be a much better chance if a piece or two are added. If that can be accomplished by including a secondary piece from further down the list, most of us can stomach that.
UNCBlue012
Well-known member
Yup. The honest fact of the matter is that this board will meltdown if Pache/Waters/Anderson is traded, even if it's for good value. AA has to do what he believes is best for the team.
bravesfanMatt
Steve Harvey'd
Count me out on Pache being called up. Twit is way to stupid to deploy him right anyway. The Braves have 4 guys in the top 20 in plate appearances (3 in top 10). Other good teams like dodgers, yanks and stros don’t have 1 in the top 20. The fact that twit is to stupid to understand occasional rest (even to young guys). Then he is too stupid to deploy a good prospect properly to actual receive value for starting his clock early. No thanks with the moron running the ship.
The Pache idea would be predicated on Ender not being a useful MLB player, and the Braves needing a competent CFer on the roster.
To the point above, though, if Snitker isn't going to play him much, or if he's not really much of an improvement over Riley right away, I would rather he continue to get consistent PAs in AA and continue to improve his game while waiting to start his clock until into next year.
If it was an Acuna-like prospect or we had a huge hole, then absolutely, call him up. But as a sub/bench guy, or somebody who may or may not be better than our current options, I'd prefer to stay the course.
Agreed. Similar thoughts with how Riley is being used now as the short side of a platoon. I think I would rather see Duvall play that role with Riley getting consistent PAs in AAA.
I'm not particularly confident Pache can be better offensively, and I'd rather not risk stunting Pache's growth by putting the pressure of a pennant race on him.
Absolutely. I've been clamoring for Duvall for awhile now. He's done all that's been asked of him in AAA and we know he's a good defender, unlike Riley. Let Riley play every day in AAA and bring him back up in Sept.
Southcack77
Well-known member
I get that.
I just think I'd rather spend a small prospect on someone like Lagares if the need for a defensive CF came up. Not sure if he's healthy yet or his contract situation, but that's the kind of backup I'd look for.
I'm not convinced Pache could hack it offensively and I'm not sure it would really be worth starting his clock to let him be a defensive replacement/backup.
I do like the idea of using Duvall better.
Southcack77
Well-known member
I thought swapping him and Riley made sense a while back. I get why it hasn't happened, but seems like it is about time.
They seem intent on squeezing MLB value out of Riley no matter what it does to his service time or overall development.
It seems odd they would give Duvall $3M and then refuse to use him as an MLB bench player in favor of a young guy who clearly needs consistent PAs to help him improve. There must be something in the MiLB data we can't see that suggests Duvall isn't going to cut it at the MLB level, even as a platoon bat.
rico43
<B>Director of Minor League Reports</B>
Thank you. I was about to agree with people who say I'm stupid for saying Riley can work it out better in AAA.
