Another reason I can't stand Bobby Cox!!!!

If BJ of all players doesn't have a week for the ages --- who is Joe Maddon?

He says some cool **** to the press but his in game management isn't that different than Fredi . Players get out of Tampa tout suite. No home town discounts to stay and win under Maddon.

after growing up watching Gene Mauch am very leery of press proclaimed "managerial genius'" . LAst one Braves had ????? Chuck Tanner - remember?
 
CrimsonCowboy said:
So we're going to blame Bobby Cox for Fredi Gonzalez not being fired in favor of hiring Joe Maddon.........................Even though nobody outside Tampa knew Maddon was available until about four hours ago.

Really? Come on now
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Yes and no. We blame Bobby for Fredi not being fired but there is no way he knew Joe Maddon would be available. Plus, had Fredi been fired we may have already hired someone by now. So this thread is irrelevant.
 
57Brave said:
If BJ of all players doesn't have a week for the ages --- who is Joe Maddon?

He says some cool **** to the press but his in game management isn't that different than Fredi . Players get out of Tampa tout suite. No home town discounts to stay and win under Maddon.

after growing up watching Gene Mauch am very leery of press proclaimed "managerial genius'" . LAst one Braves had ????? Chuck Tanner - remember?
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What about Longoria's extremely team friendly contract????
 
There are things all managers do in much the same way. It is why many people can't tell the difference between a good manager, average manager, and a bad manager. It's the few--often very subtle or behind the scenes--things managers do different--or just much better--that separates them. Maddon does those things at a higher level than Fredi, but it is a pointless discussion. The Braves would've never hired him.
 
VirginiaBrave said:
Maddon is nothing special. A manager is only as good as his talent. Some of you just can't let go of the Fredi hate.
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Ok, I'll play your silly game. If a manager is only as good as his talent, why even have one? If you knew anything about coaching at all, you would know that a good manager gets the best out of his players. I can take a average team and coach circles around a lot of coaches with better talent.
 
Dalyn said:
There are things all managers do in much the same way. It is why many people can't tell the difference between a good manager, average manager, and a bad manager. It's the few--often very subtle or behind the scenes--things managers do different--or just much better--that separates them. Maddon does those things at a higher level than Fredi, but it is a pointless discussion. The Braves would've never hired him.
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Well, the difference is that some guys think out of the box while others say "What box?" I've always thought the worst managers are the ones who are obviously managing; simply doing things just to do them, especially with in-game moves. If you hear a rumor that a guy is on the hot seat and then watch his games for the next week and he's putting on the hit & run and visibly moving guys all over the place at every opportunity, the guy is likely toast.

My biggest beef with Gonzalez is his use of the bullpen. I don't think there was much he could have done with the line-up this year. Everybody but Freeman and J. Upton were shuffled all over the batting order and nothing really worked consistently.
 
jason27nc said:
Ok, I'll play your silly game. If a manager is only as good as his talent, why even have one? If you knew anything about coaching at all, you would know that a good manager gets the best out of his players. I can take a average team and coach circles around a lot of coaches with better talent.
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At the big league level it's a little different because even the worst players are pretty good. I think coaching matters a lot more at the non-professional ranks, where a difference in the execution of fundamentals means much, much more.
 
50PoundHead said:
Well, the difference is that some guys think out of the box while others say "What box?" I've always thought the worst managers are the ones who are obviously managing; simply doing things just to do them, especially with in-game moves. If you hear a rumor that a guy is on the hot seat and then watch his games for the next week and he's putting on the hit & run and visibly moving guys all over the place at every opportunity, the guy is likely toast.

My biggest beef with Gonzalez is his use of the bullpen. I don't think there was much he could have done with the line-up this year. Everybody but Freeman and J. Upton were shuffled all over the batting order and nothing really worked consistently.
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There is absolutely something he could've done with the lineup. Not put 1 or 2 of our worst hitters at the top on a consistent basis. That's pretty obvious.
 
Dalyn said:
There is absolutely something he could've done with the lineup. Not put 1 or 2 of our worst hitters at the top on a consistent basis. That's pretty obvious.
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Yeah, but they still would have been somewhere in the line-up killing rallies.
 
jason27nc said:
Ok, I'll play your silly game. If a manager is only as good as his talent, why even have one? If you knew anything about coaching at all, you would know that a good manager gets the best out of his players. I can take a average team and coach circles around a lot of coaches with better talent.
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I know as much as you do, and it boils down to execution something that the Braves simply didn't do in 2014. You don't swing the bat for your players, catch the ball, or pitch it. The Braves talent pool succeeded above expectation in 2013 or maybe the Nats were just a bad team, but no manager I don't care what his name was in 2014 was going to to the playoffs with this team. It was clear early on that losing didn't bother these guys and maybe that falls on Fredi but the guys between the lines had a chance to do something about it. They failed. The big leagues should not be considered a teaching level, These are grown men with at least 15 years of organized ball under their belts It's reasonably clear that because of all organizational change something was not right.
 
Not going to get bent about it. If he had quit right after the season, and we blindly supported Fredi, it would have been irritating.

Not sure Maddon would mesh well with our upper leadership.
 
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