Around Baseball 2015 Edition

thethe said:
Goldy is amazing. No discernable home/road splits. Seems to get better every year. I think they are both a level above Trout but Trout makes it up by being a great baserunner an ok fielder.

We haven't seen what Harper is doing though since Bonds.
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Really? What has Goldschmidt done to warrant that? His 2015 season in which he has a 400 BABIP? People really need to look at that when discussing a players current season in terms of them repeating that. The last 4 years Trout has had WRC+'s of 167, 176, 167, and 172. So no there is nothing for Trout to make up. When Goldy or Harper for that matter have that level of sustained offense then we can talk. Sometimes people get too worked up over what a player does over a few months. Especially when it's fueled by things that aren't likely to continue.

As I said when this convo cropped up a month or so ago. Trout and Miggy are the best hitters in baseball. They have been for quite some time. When/if Goldy and Trout get on their level then we can revisit this. But it takes a lot longer than a half a season for me to say that they are both on a level about Trout. To me that's just absurd, especially for Goldy.
 
thethe said:
I get that we Braves fans can't stand Harper but we really need to acknowledge what we are seeing here.

This is the Lebron James of baseball.
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Being a Braves fan has nothing to do with it. When the Braves are supposed to be good again Harper won't be in our division. Harper is doing things he's never done before. That has to continue before anything like that is thrown around. And if you want to get techinical about it Trout is actually the Lebron of baseball. He does EVERYTHING well while Harper is just a really good hitter.
 
gilesfan said:
Isnt he 21 or 22? Of course hes doing something hes never done before, what would you expect?
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Yeah. Like his walk rate doubling and his ISO being over .300. BABIP 50 points higher than his career average. I guess these are things you and thethe expected to happen and expect to continue.
 
thewupk said:
Really? What has Goldschmidt done to warrant that? His 2015 season in which he has a 400 BABIP? People really need to look at that when discussing a players current season in terms of them repeating that. The last 4 years Trout has had WRC+'s of 167, 176, 167, and 172. So no there is nothing for Trout to make up. When Goldy or Harper for that matter have that level of sustained offense then we can talk. Sometimes people get too worked up over what a player does over a few months. Especially when it's fueled by things that aren't likely to continue.

As I said when this convo cropped up a month or so ago. Trout and Miggy are the best hitters in baseball. They have been for quite some time. When/if Goldy and Trout get on their level then we can revisit this. But it takes a lot longer than a half a season for me to say that they are both on a level about Trout. To me that's just absurd, especially for Goldy.
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Those guys are better hitters than Trout. The past doesn't always dictate the future. Especially with players before or enterring their prime.
 
thewupk said:
Being a Braves fan has nothing to do with it. When the Braves are supposed to be good again Harper won't be in our division. Harper is doing things he's never done before. That has to continue before anything like that is thrown around. And if you want to get techinical about it Trout is actually the Lebron of baseball. He does EVERYTHING well while Harper is just a really good hitter.
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Has Trout been good fielder the last two seasons?
 
thethe said:
At the pace that Harper is going at now Cabrera has never done that for a season.

Sure, Harper needs to do it but the whole point of this discussion is that I think Harper is that special of a hitter.
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He's done it for more than 3 months. I thin you are acting a little premature, again. You have a history of doing this with almost every player. You blow SS's out of the water all the time.
 
thewupk said:
He's done it for more than 3 months. I thin you are acting a little premature, again. You have a history of doing this with almost every player. You blow SS's out of the water all the time.
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I said that I thought Harper was the best hitter in baseball a couple of years ago. His performance this year is only making my beliefs stronger. I think you are too devoted to prior stats. You have to see the whole picture in certain situations.
 
thethe said:
Those guys are better hitters than Trout. The past doesn't always dictate the future. Especially with players before or enterring their prime.
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Goldy has been better than Trout for 3 months. And he had a 400 BABIP to help him get there. So no I don't think he is a better hitter than Trout.
 
thethe said:
I said that I thought Harper was the best hitter in baseball a couple of years ago. His performance this year is only making my beliefs stronger. I think you are too devoted to prior stats. You have to see the whole picture in certain situations.
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Yeah I see Harper doubling his walk rate and starting to ISO SLG 300. Neither I think are sustainable. I think you are to devoted to a player and can't see that the chances of him repeating this for several years is really low.

You did the same thing when Frenchy came up and claimed him to be an MVP player. You are the SS king.
 
Sweet i made a terrible mistake 10 years ago when I didn't fully embrace the role statistics play in baseball. That's ok if you want to keep using that against me. You will be wrong in this instance. Harper will be the best player in baseball for the next 10 years.
 
Harper's having an insane year but alot of it isnt sustainable.

LeBron does everything well, Harper is mainly just a ridiculous hitter, so i dont get that comparison.

Hopefullly he signs with the Yankees when he's a FA though.
 
thethe said:
Sweet i made a terrible mistake 10 years ago when I didn't fully embrace the role statistics play in baseball. That's ok if you want to keep using that against me. You will be wrong in this instance. Harper will be the best player in baseball for the next 10 years.
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See I still don't think you fully embrace statistics or you would see what Harper is doing (and Goly) as anomalies and not likely to continue.
 
thewupk said:
Being a Braves fan has nothing to do with it. When the Braves are supposed to be good again Harper won't be in our division. Harper is doing things he's never done before. That has to continue before anything like that is thrown around. And if you want to get techinical about it Trout is actually the Lebron of baseball. He does EVERYTHING well while Harper is just a really good hitter.
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You dont think we'll contend until 2019 or whenever Harpers a FA?
 
thewupk said:
See I still don't think you fully embrace statistics or you would see what Harper is doing (and Goly) as anomalies and not likely to continue.
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You believe what Harpers is doing is a fluke because he hasn't done it before. Kid is 22. Of course he hasn't done it before.

Goldy I could get behind a bit more. But, playing in Arizona will typcially lead to higher BABIPs because of the turf.
 
thethe said:
You believe what Harpers is doing is a fluke because he hasn't done it before. Kid is 22. Of course he hasn't done it before.

Goldy I could get behind a bit more. But, playing in Arizona will typcially lead to higher BABIPs because of the turf.
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I think he can't do it because players generally start walking and slugging 1.5 times what they have previously. Even when they are that young. Walk rates near 20% and ISO SLG over 300 are things that just don't happen. I don't see Harper as some once in a generation hitter.
 
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