Astros using sign stealing devices during WS run

Man it is a lot worse than corking a bat. This has so many layers, it is organization deep (how could it not be?), and apparently, possibly, involved a World Championship, AND, could have easily been linked to gambling if someone knew.

And for that matter, to speculate, if you did know, how great would the temptation be to try to make a lot of money off of it. Which, if that happened we will likely never know because it could be Black Sox scandal level. Pete Rose would be kid stuff. They would never let us find that out.
 
bravesfanMatt said:
This is like someone scuffing a ball or corking a bat. It was gaming the system to win. Copy lied about finances to gain extra players. He tired to cheat not only the league but players as well.
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This isn’t like gaming the system, it’s explicitly against the rules. “No electronic devices” . This isn’t catching a pitcher tipping pitches.

He was spreading signing bonuses around, and it was said “ this is done by everyone “ as well but it didn’t directly result
In a ring. Also these were Kids that may never play in AA.

This was in the major leagues and led directly to a WS.
 
Tapate50 said:
This isn’t like gaming the system, it’s explicitly against the rules. “No electronic devices” . This isn’t catching a pitcher tipping pitches.

He was spreading signing bonuses around, and it was said “ this is done by everyone “ as well but it didn’t directly result
In a ring. Also these were Kids that may never play in AA.

This was in the major leagues and led directly to a WS.
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The stors were/are Uber talented. That is why they won a ring. And why is use of electronic devices illegal in an age of technology. Seems backwards. Literally any team could prevent this with elementary sign changes or signals. Football has the same issues and no one is calling for life time bans. I know we are all butt hurt over the harsh penalty we got but we can’t look at every other infraction and demand equal punishment.

Coppy fudged the system to the point where he got an entire draft class that should have been restricted. Other teams were focused on the players we got so his cheating had a trickle down effect. He also had allegations of wrong doing in the amateur draft.

I am a “till I die” Braves fan and the punishment we got sucked. But I am not going to make this cheating equal. Yes the stros should be punished. But I am not going to scream and whine when the punishment is paltry in comparison
 
bravesfanMatt said:
The stors were/are Uber talented. That is why they won a ring. And why is use of electronic devices illegal in an age of technology. Seems backwards. Literally any team could prevent this with elementary sign changes or signals. Football has the same issues and no one is calling for life time bans. I know we are all butt hurt over the harsh penalty we got but we can’t look at every other infraction and demand equal punishment.

Coppy fudged the system to the point where he got an entire draft class that should have been restricted. Other teams were focused on the players we got so his cheating had a trickle down effect. He also had allegations of wrong doing in the amateur draft.

I am a “till I die” Braves fan and the punishment we got sucked. But I am not going to make this cheating equal. Yes the stros should be punished. But I am not going to scream and whine when the punishment is paltry in comparison
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I am braves til I die, and I'm not the one comparing the punishments. They really don't have anything to do with one another. Im looking at what came out as a result of the wrongdoing, this is MUCH MUCH worse than what Coppy did. This took knowledge from up and down the organization. Hinch is a prick for opening his mouth about the Yankees being affected by whistling knowing whats going on.

So as a result their home splits were GIGANTIC, and they won a WS. You say they are uber talented, but what do they look like when they DON'T know what pitch is coming? How can that not make you a ton better?

If you are Rob Manfred and you don't drop the hammer here, you are basically saying cheat to win the WS and I can't do anything about it as long as you don't get caught during the season.
 
Tapate50 said:
This isn’t like gaming the system, it’s explicitly against the rules. “No electronic devices” . This isn’t catching a pitcher tipping pitches.

He was spreading signing bonuses around, and it was said “ this is done by everyone “ as well but it didn’t directly result
In a ring. Also these were Kids that may never play in AA.

This was in the major leagues and led directly to a WS.
Click to expand...

I suspect if Coppy had cooperated with the investigation he wouldn't have been banned for life.

That was the only part of the penalty that was particularly harsh, IMO. The rest of it was basically just removing the benefit of the cheating.
 
bravesfanMatt said:
The stors were/are Uber talented. That is why they won a ring. And why is use of electronic devices illegal in an age of technology. Seems backwards. Literally any team could prevent this with elementary sign changes or signals. Football has the same issues and no one is calling for life time bans. I know we are all butt hurt over the harsh penalty we got but we can’t look at every other infraction and demand equal punishment.

Coppy fudged the system to the point where he got an entire draft class that should have been restricted. Other teams were focused on the players we got so his cheating had a trickle down effect. He also had allegations of wrong doing in the amateur draft.

I am a “till I die” Braves fan and the punishment we got sucked. But I am not going to make this cheating equal. Yes the stros should be punished. But I am not going to scream and whine when the punishment is paltry in comparison
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It's difficult to see what the organization punishment should be. The Braves punishment was tailored to the crimes. I'm not sure what the natural penalty is for stealing signs.

Maybe everyone involved in management should have a suspension.
 
Southcack77 said:
It's difficult to see what the organization punishment should be. The Braves punishment was tailored to the crimes. I'm not sure what the natural penalty is for stealing signs.

Maybe everyone involved in management should have a suspension.
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Agreed. There is no correlation of what the cheating provided the astros. You can’t prove that stealing signs won them a World Series. You can’t suspend players since you don’t know who was involved. This will probably be monetary fine and the suspension of coaches for x games. Just can’t see how it goes any further. The Braves you could directly correlate their gains and it was easy to take that away.
 
bravesfanMatt said:
Agreed. There is no correlation of what the cheating provided the astros. You can’t prove that stealing signs won them a World Series. You can’t suspend players since you don’t know who was involved. This will probably be monetary fine and the suspension of coaches for x games. Just can’t see how it goes any further. The Braves you could directly correlate their gains and it was easy to take that away.
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Their KtoBB ratio was like 1\3 of the NEXT lowest team at home. They were THE lowest by a LONG LONG MARGIN.

The numbers are obvious to everyone that looks at it.
 
Tapate50 said:
Their KtoBB ratio was like 1\3 of the NEXT lowest team at home. They were THE lowest by a LONG LONG MARGIN.

The numbers are obvious to everyone that looks at it.
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And Chris Johnson had like a 400 BaBip that one year so he must have been cheating. I know what you are saying but unfortunately it is still circumstantial and can’t be proven. I just hope no one is mad when all they get is a fine and a nasty look. Because I really think that is what will happen.
 
bravesfanMatt said:
And Chris Johnson had like a 400 BaBip that one year so he must have been cheating. I know what you are saying but unfortunately it is still circumstantial and can’t be proven. I just hope no one is mad when all they get is a fine and a nasty look. Because I really think that is what will happen.
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He might have, did a teammate come out and say he did though? I’d say that changes things . Fiers said it happened and he was there.

Is he lying ?
 
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Snowman said:
The pertinent rule wasn't yet in place in 2017 though, was it?
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This is a serious question. Didn't they pass the rule regarding electronic devices for sign stealing last year? If my memory is right on that, there's no way in hell they levy any major punishments trying to apply it retroactively.
 
bravesfanMatt said:
Agreed. There is no correlation of what the cheating provided the astros. You can’t prove that stealing signs won them a World Series. You can’t suspend players since you don’t know who was involved. This will probably be monetary fine and the suspension of coaches for x games. Just can’t see how it goes any further. The Braves you could directly correlate their gains and it was easy to take that away.
Click to expand...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I9up10jsW1c
 
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