Best trade partner?

[yeezus]

If the Pirates are as smart as everyone thinks, McCutchen will be traded away as soon as Meadows is deemed ready. The prospect return for Cutch could be used to trade for a pitcher like Julio.

this makes sense from a strictly logistical standpoint, but not sure the Pirates are eager to trade a guy like Cutch. Team leader, MVP, homegrown. I don't see them trading him.

 

[Russ2dollas]

Ideally (assuming Julio and Viz are actually available), I'd want to go...

Julio for Gallo straight-up, Vizcaino for Eloy Jimenez and Dylan Cease, and Markakis for Chase Vallot (eating some of Nick's $$$, of course). Go get Desmond or Cespedes to play LF and a veteran SP like Jaime Garcia to plug into the rotation this winter.

CF- Mallex, SS- Swanson, 1B- Freeman, LF- Desmond, 3B- Gallo, C- Flowers, RF- Inciarte, 2B- Albies

ppl keep saying Desmond. Wont he get another qualifying offer this year? We won't give up the first pick of round 2 for Desmond.

 

[Russ2dollas]

I think the pirates would work hard in the offseason to extend McCutchen. If they get that done, then maybe they can deal Meadows or Marte (replace Marte with Meadows).

 

[bravescountry]

If the Pirates are as smart as everyone thinks, McCutchen will be traded away as soon as Meadows is deemed ready. The prospect return for Cutch could be used to trade for a pitcher like Julio.

If they would trade Cutch, I'd be with only 1 year left- and that still is very unlikely. If they're going to trade prospects from a future Cutch trade why wouldn't they just trade Meadows right now for a solid pitcher for the rotation bc they need SP help and then trade Cutch for younger players including another OF'er after 2 years.. your method doesn't sound like a Pirates method, thought us discussing of Pitts trading prospects is also a "non-Pirates" method.

 

[zbhargrove]

How? He can play any OF position with average to above average defense. He has a plus plus bat (capable of hitting .300+), he has a good power bat (capable of hitting hear 20 homeruns in a season), he has speed to steal bases and hit for XBH's... he's a GA boy and would fill a HUGE need in our system/team.

He hasn't shown anywhere near 20 homer potential yet and he's shown decent speed but not that impressive for the minors

 

[clvclv]

ppl keep saying Desmond. Wont he get another qualifying offer this year? We won't give up the first pick of round 2 for Desmond.

Assuming Julio and Vizcaino were traded now, who cares? If we get the #1 pick, J. J. Schwarz is staring us dead in the face - and I don't think I'm going out on much of a limb when I say he's as close to a "lock" as our pick as there is if he's available.

Desmond or Cespedes are just the "ideal" guys in that scenario - if being seriously competitive is the goal. If Markakis is gone, there are multiple LF options available (including Garcia) - Desmond, Cespedes, Bautista, Bruce, Carlos Gomez, Colby Rasmus, Josh Reddick, Michael Saunders, and Mark Trumbo.

I know several folks simply don't believe we're going to spend money on ANY free-agent, but the Liberty/AOL-TW payroll agreement is going to force them to spend money on SOMEBODY. You're replacing Aybar with someone making the minimum. Your other MI will be making the minimum. None of the SPs will be making money. Neither will Mallex or Inciarte. Garcia? Nope. Flowers will be making $3 million. They might spend a little money and bring Beckham back, but why?

I'm sorry that it bothers some people so much, but they're going to have to spend money this winter to meet the minimum salary-level MLB required to allow the deal to go through. There aren't enough roster spots available to keep signing the Bud Norrises and KJs of the world - it really is that simple.

 

[CJ9]

Assuming Julio and Vizcaino were traded now, who cares? If we get the #1 pick, J. J. Schwarz is staring us dead in the face - and I don't think I'm going out on much of a limb when I say he's as close to a "lock" as our pick as there is if he's available.

I'm a Florida fan, and I like the guy, but us taking Schwarz at 1-1 would be a horrendous pick. The power has disappeared this year, and the chances of him catching as a pro have fallen significantly. His stock is nowhere near where it was four months ago.

 

[bravescountry]

He hasn't shown anywhere near 20 homer potential yet and he's shown decent speed but not that impressive for the minors

The Pirates system is known to not develop power early, but develop contact hitting and then power. Marte IS a 20 homerun threat, right? He never hit more than 12 homeruns in a season. And just saying.. Meadows is on pace now for around 20 homeruns, more than 20 steals while batting over .300 .
His stats so far in 155 AB? .310 batting average, 5 homeruns, 13 doubles, 8 triples, 15 BB, 30 K's, and 8 SBs. He's finally fully healthy and completely raking- he would become arguably the best positional prospect in our system if traded for- I think he has a higher ceiling than Swanson..

 

[bravescountry]

I'm a Florida fan, and I like the guy, but us taking Schwarz at 1-1 would be a horrendous pick. The power has disappeared this year, and the chances of him catching as a pro have fallen significantly. His stock is nowhere near where it was four months ago.

I saw his stocks drop as his stats did..
if he were to be the #1 prospect, he'd have to hit better and hit for power a lot better. His walk rate DID go up which was nice to see, so if he maintain his OBP while adding the power and hit tools from his freshman year again, I can see his stocks rising up again quickly.

 

[zbhargrove]

Assuming Julio and Vizcaino were traded now, who cares? If we get the #1 pick, J. J. Schwarz is staring us dead in the face - and I don't think I'm going out on much of a limb when I say he's as close to a "lock" as our pick as there is if he's available.

Desmond or Cespedes are just the "ideal" guys in that scenario - if being seriously competitive is the goal. If Markakis is gone, there are multiple LF options available (including Garcia) - Desmond, Cespedes, Bautista, Bruce, Carlos Gomez, Colby Rasmus, Josh Reddick, Michael Saunders, and Mark Trumbo.

I know several folks simply don't believe we're going to spend money on ANY free-agent, but the Liberty/AOL-TW payroll agreement is going to force them to spend money on SOMEBODY. You're replacing Aybar with someone making the minimum. Your other MI will be making the minimum. None of the SPs will be making money. Neither will Mallex or Inciarte. Garcia? Nope. Flowers will be making $3 million. They might spend a little money and bring Beckham back, but why?

I'm sorry that it bothers some people so much, but they're going to have to spend money this winter to meet the minimum salary-level MLB required to allow the deal to go through. There aren't enough roster spots available to keep signing the Bud Norrises and KJs of the world - it really is that simple.

Schwarz is certainly no lock at number one or even number 5... he's not near the prospect he once was.

 

[clvclv]

I'm a Florida fan, and I like the guy, but us taking Schwarz at 1-1 would be a horrendous pick. The power has disappeared this year, and the chances of him catching as a pro have fallen significantly. His stock is nowhere near where it was four months ago.

On June 13th, 2016, sure.

That's all guessing at this point anyway, and not all that relevant for this thread. I agree, he certainly lost some luster this season - I'm betting (and hoping) he gets it all back. He definitely looked like he was reading about himself and coasting far too much this season.

The point is, if you actually do trade Julio, No one other than Markakis and Freeman will make any money next season, and if Markakis is dealt, the only person currently in the organization that will make more than $4 million in 2016 is Freddie. They have no choice other than to spend some money this winter.

 

[bravos4evr]

Assuming Julio and Vizcaino were traded now, who cares? If we get the #1 pick, J. J. Schwarz is staring us dead in the face - and I don't think I'm going out on much of a limb when I say he's as close to a "lock" as our pick as there is if he's available.

Desmond or Cespedes are just the "ideal" guys in that scenario - if being seriously competitive is the goal. If Markakis is gone, there are multiple LF options available (including Garcia) - Desmond, Cespedes, Bautista, Bruce, Carlos Gomez, Colby Rasmus, Josh Reddick, Michael Saunders, and Mark Trumbo.

I know several folks simply don't believe we're going to spend money on ANY free-agent, but the Liberty/AOL-TW payroll agreement is going to force them to spend money on SOMEBODY. You're replacing Aybar with someone making the minimum. Your other MI will be making the minimum. None of the SPs will be making money. Neither will Mallex or Inciarte. Garcia? Nope. Flowers will be making $3 million. They might spend a little money and bring Beckham back, but why?

I'm sorry that it bothers some people so much, but they're going to have to spend money this winter to meet the minimum salary-level MLB required to allow the deal to go through. There aren't enough roster spots available to keep signing the Bud Norrises and KJs of the world - it really is that simple.

I expect them to buy at least a catcher and a corner bat this winter. as far as a veteran arm...IDK, they might try a lottery ticket or two, but i don't see them trying to grab any of the, rather mediocre "big names, or anything for the mound. I agree, tho, some $$$ will be spent to grab Weiters/Ramos and probably Reddick

 

[Russ2dollas]

Assuming Julio and Vizcaino were traded now, who cares? If we get the #1 pick, J. J. Schwarz is staring us dead in the face - and I don't think I'm going out on much of a limb when I say he's as close to a "lock" as our pick as there is if he's available.

Desmond or Cespedes are just the "ideal" guys in that scenario - if being seriously competitive is the goal. If Markakis is gone, there are multiple LF options available (including Garcia) - Desmond, Cespedes, Bautista, Bruce, Carlos Gomez, Colby Rasmus, Josh Reddick, Michael Saunders, and Mark Trumbo.

I know several folks simply don't believe we're going to spend money on ANY free-agent, but the Liberty/AOL-TW payroll agreement is going to force them to spend money on SOMEBODY. You're replacing Aybar with someone making the minimum. Your other MI will be making the minimum. None of the SPs will be making money. Neither will Mallex or Inciarte. Garcia? Nope. Flowers will be making $3 million. They might spend a little money and bring Beckham back, but why?

I'm sorry that it bothers some people so much, but they're going to have to spend money this winter to meet the minimum salary-level MLB required to allow the deal to go through. There aren't enough roster spots available to keep signing the Bud Norrises and KJs of the world - it really is that simple.

I didn't say we wouldn't spend money. I said Desmond would have draft pick compensation. If he gets a qualifying offer then we'd have to give up a pick.

 

[clvclv]

I didn't say we wouldn't spend money. I said Desmond would have draft pick compensation. If he gets a qualifying offer then we'd have to give up a pick.

We absolutely would. The thing is, considering how little salary is on the books for next season (with Bourn and Swisher gone), they're going to have to spend money regardless. They can't get to the payroll level that was required by MLB when the sale was approved by signing another handful of Beckhams/KJs/Norrises/etc. for peanuts. That's another reason to blow past the international spending limit this season - if they wind up surrendering a second round pick (and potentially even third round as well) for signing GOOD players, the hope is that those international signings will make up for them.

 

[Russ2dollas]

We absolutely would. The thing is, considering how little salary is on the books for next season (with Bourn and Swisher gone), they're going to have to spend money regardless. They can't get to the payroll level that was required by MLB when the sale was approved by signing another handful of Beckhams/KJs/Norrises/etc. for peanuts. That's another reason to blow past the international spending limit this season - if they wind up surrendering a second round pick (and potentially even third round as well) for signing GOOD players, the hope is that those international signings will make up for them.

I don't think we give up the first pick of round 2.

What is the salary floor required?

If there is a floor, I wonder if we could get creative and sign a mid priced FA and pay them 50% of their salary in year one to front load the deal.

 

[bravesfanMatt]

I don't think we give up the first pick of round 2.

What is the salary floor required?

If there is a floor, I wonder if we could get creative and sign a mid priced FA and pay them 50% of their salary in year one to front load the deal.

I agree, I don't think Ramos moves the needle enough to lose the 1st pick of round 2.. Will the new CBA be in place for this year's FA class, or will that be 2018?

 

[bravos4evr]

We absolutely would. The thing is, considering how little salary is on the books for next season (with Bourn and Swisher gone), they're going to have to spend money regardless. They can't get to the payroll level that was required by MLB when the sale was approved by signing another handful of Beckhams/KJs/Norrises/etc. for peanuts. That's another reason to blow past the international spending limit this season - if they wind up surrendering a second round pick (and potentially even third round as well) for signing GOOD players, the hope is that those international signings will make up for them.

well, I think that depends. If the operational budget was the same or close, I don't think MLB would raise too much of a stink. I think there's a difference between a rebuilding team using similar levels of finances to do different things and an ownership slashing payroll to pocket the funds.

I agree, I don't think Ramos moves the needle enough to lose the 1st pick of round 2.. Will the new CBA be in place for this year's FA class, or will that be 2018?

They negotiate it this offseason so it will take effect as soon as approved. But i reckon that free agent stuff will begin fiscal year 2017