Braves acquire Gausman + O'Day from Orioles for Zimmermann, Cumberland, Phillips, JCE

[TheBravos]

Honestly, Archer has a “tad” more upside, but they really are both underperforming pitchers that need a change of scenery.

Both could turn things around, both could just end up doing what they have been doing.

Our gamble is much less. He only has to be average to make it worth what the Braves paid.

Either way....this signals the end of Julio. He will not be with the team next year and it will not surprise me if they put him on waivers this year to see if there is a taker. This trade was made because Julio failed to lock down even the #5 spot.

I still want to punch something thinking about 2016. Dead horse kicked. I feel better.

 

[thewupk]

Honestly, Archer has a “tad” more upside, but they really are both underperforming pitchers that need a change of scenery.

Both could turn things around, both could just end up doing what they have been doing.

Our gamble is much less. He only has to be average to make it worth what the Braves paid.

Either way....this signals the end of Julio. He will not be with the team next year and it will not surprise me if they put him on waivers this year to see if there is a taker. This trade was made because Julio failed to lock down even the #5 spot.

I still want to punch something thinking about 2016. Dead horse kicked. I feel better.

I think Julio stays in 2019. He may be phased at some point during the season but I see Folty/Newk/Gausman/Julio being the man 4 guys with the rest of our young crew in that 5th spot and rotating through the others when they need a break kind of like this year.

 

[Southcack77]

The Braves now have at least legitimate 8 internal options for the fifth rotation spot at some point in 2019 without looking beyond AAA.

Soroka, Gohara, Fried, Allard, Wright, Touki, Weigel, and Wilson.

And that doesn't count organization depth types like Parsons, Mader etc who could conceivably make a spot start for some clubs. Or the Braves' option on McCarthy. Or contemplating any involvement in free agent market at any level. It's a pretty amazing thing.

Whether that, I'm going to call it a "surplus", is dealt for major league players or reinvested into prospects further away, something has to give there.

 

[Tapate50]

The Braves now have at least legitimate 8 internal options for the fifth rotation spot at some point in 2019 without looking beyond AAA.

Soroka, Gohara, Fried, Allard, Wright, Touki, Weigel, and Wilson.

And that doesn't count organization depth types like Parsons, Mader etc who could conceivably make a spot start for some clubs. Or the Braves' option on McCarthy. Or contemplating any involvement in free agent market at any level. It's a pretty amazing thing.

Whether that, I'm going to call it a "surplus", is dealt for major league players or reinvested into prospects further away, something has to give there.

You likely need 8-9 decent options for a year of starting pitching. Now, I wouldn't call it a "surplus" in terms of numbers of players, but I'd definitely call it a surplus of REALLY REALLY talented options.

Most teams can't touch that number of high ceiling pitchers.

 

[nsacpi]

The Braves now have at least legitimate 8 internal options for the fifth rotation spot at some point in 2019 without looking beyond AAA.

Soroka, Gohara, Fried, Allard, Wright, Touki, Weigel, and Wilson.

And that doesn't count organization depth types like Parsons, Mader etc who could conceivably make a spot start for some clubs. Or the Braves' option on McCarthy. Or contemplating any involvement in free agent market at any level. It's a pretty amazing thing.

Whether that, I'm going to call it a "surplus", is dealt for major league players or reinvested into prospects further away, something has to give there.

I think we trade one or more of the surplus pitching for a catcher.

 

[Southcack77]

You likely need 8-9 decent options for a year of starting pitching. Now, I wouldn't call it a "surplus" in terms of numbers of players, but I'd definitely call it a surplus of REALLY REALLY talented options.

Most teams can't touch that number of high ceiling pitchers.

I'm just saying we got 8 guys now at the AAA/MLB level who are legitimate candidates to be the fifth starter in 2019.

Finding a non-contending team that might take Teheran's money and one or two of those guys in exchange for something proven with remaining control might be a good thing for AA to look for this winter.

Or you could see if you could give Teheran away and give two internal options a whirl, I suppose.

 

[Southcack77]

I think we trade one or more of the surplus pitching for a catcher.

We definitely have a catching gap. They could simply elect to bring back Flowers and Suzuki one more time though. Or something similar.

I'm not sure what the trade market looks like otherwise. Realmuto is pretty awesome but pricy. Who else do you have your eye on?

 

[Super]

We definitely have a catching gap. They could simply elect to bring back Flowers and Suzuki one more time though. Or something similar.

I'm not sure what the trade market looks like otherwise. Realmuto is pretty awesome but pricy. Who else do you have your eye on?

I wonder if we could get Plawecki.
I was a big proponent of trying to buy low on him the last couple of years.

 

[nsacpi]

We definitely have a catching gap. They could simply elect to bring back Flowers and Suzuki one more time though. Or something similar.

I'm not sure what the trade market looks like otherwise. Realmuto is pretty awesome but pricy. Who else do you have your eye on?

Reamulto is the logical guy. Posey is from Georgia. Just sayin.

 

[CJ9]

We definitely have a catching gap. They could simply elect to bring back Flowers and Suzuki one more time though. Or something similar.

I'm not sure what the trade market looks like otherwise. Realmuto is pretty awesome but pricy. Who else do you have your eye on?

I'd be in on Grandal this offseason, but the price would likely go higher than I'd be comfortable with. Would be nice to have him and sign Flowers as the backup.

 

[50PoundHead]

Reamulto is the logical guy. Posey is from Georgia. Just sayin.

That means he'll play for free or, better yet, pay the Braves for allowing him to play so close to home.

 

[Southcack77]

Reamulto is the logical guy. Posey is from Georgia. Just sayin.

Not a great fit (Posey) with Freddie Freeman never sitting and no DH just yet.

 

[Enscheff]

Let's not fall into the predictable "Archer isn't really that much better than Gausman" defense mechanism, OK? Archer is a good bit better than Gausman, and he would have improved this team more. The fact Gausman was likely the better value play doesn't change that fact.

Teheran doesn't need to go anywhere. Every single year the Braves will be needing to acquire some $10M veteran arm to round out the rotation. That arm is already on the roster. He has zero trade value, but he can fill out the rotation just fine, especially early in 2019 while young guys percolate in AAA a bit.

 

[GeorgiaGirl]

What I'm most interested in is if the new, more analytically inclined FO sees something they can mold with Gausman, kind of like what we saw with Folty going into the year. If not, even simply leaving the AL East probably will lead to him being more of a 3.5-4 ERA pitcher then what we saw after 2014-2016. Not an ace, no, but a valuable pitcher.

I don't think we see a Jake Arrieta like turn though. I think even if there's something, it'll probably lead to a season where he posts a ERA in between 3 and 3.5.

 

[smootness]

Let's not fall into the predictable "Archer isn't really that much better than Gausman" defense mechanism, OK? Archer is a good bit better than Gausman, and he would have improved this team more. The fact Gausman was likely the better value play doesn't change that fact.

Teheran doesn't need to go anywhere. Every single year the Braves will be needing to acquire some $10M veteran arm to round out the rotation. That arm is already on the roster. He has zero trade value, but he can fill out the rotation just fine, especially early in 2019 while young guys percolate in AAA a bit.

Archer certainly seems better, and FG things he's been decently better over the last 3 years - 9.5 WAR to 6.8. But BR has Gausman in the lead easily - 8.4 to 3.7.

I don't think Gausman is anything special right now...but I think the thing to learn is that Archer may not be, either.

 

[striker42]

It would be awesome if Folty could pick up a splitter from Gausman. If Folty could add a legit major league splitter to his arsenal he could just explode.

 

[Allstar34bd]

Gausman is garbage on MLB 18 The Show! We need to DFA him already and O’Day too! O’day is 34 Velocity

 

[jimsnores]

It would be awesome if Folty could pick up a splitter from Gausman. If Folty could add a legit major league splitter to his arsenal he could just explode.

And his arm might, too. Splitters scare me.

 

[jimsnores]

Archer certainly seems better, and FG things he's been decently better over the last 3 years - 9.5 WAR to 6.8. But BR has Gausman in the lead easily - 8.4 to 3.7.

I don't think Gausman is anything special right now...but I think the thing to learn is that Archer may not be, either.

Why do these two (FG and BR) have such an incredibly different take on WAR for pitchers? A stat that is supposed to add objectivity to evaluation shouldn't lend itself to such disparity.

 

[sturg33]

Why do these two (FG and BR) have such an incredibly different take on WAR for pitchers? A stat that is supposed to add objectivity to evaluation shouldn't lend itself to such disparity.

Pretty sure bWAR looks at what actually happened, whereas fangraphs looks at what should have happened (more predictive)