Braves‘ offseason quietly criticized throughout the industry

57Brave said:
After last September I like the idea of re-grouping. They've (Cox-Surh) have wanted Markakis a long time. Letting go of JHey and JUp aren't that bigga deals.
Not sure who people think they were going to get for either. Both will cost a bundle to keep and their contributions were -- well, look at last September.

I think of the runners left on base and hot n cold offensive production from these two corner outfielders outweigh a few diving catches
Click to expand...

I can only assume this was sarcasm.
 
I think Hart is just trying to making ammends for the inability to put together a formiable pitching staff, especially one with an legit ace, for those mid 90's Cleveland teams which were loaded with offense but cobbled together pitching staffs.

Hopefully Hart soon can inner his Cleveland self and start assembling and putting together some offensive players to compliment a now pitching rich organization. We don't need to be that good (mid 90's Cleveland offense) but we need to get some semblence of talent to surround Freeman going forward.

But as of right now, we're right where I expected us to be in the process of reloading (as far as trades and taking on some high risk/high reward deals)...but there is much more work, and I assure you Hart & JC is only getting started. It's gonna be a fun ride and see how it all shakes out and materializes in the end.
 
Millwood1Hitter said:
I think Hart is just trying to making ammends for the inability to put together a formiable pitching staff, especially one with an legit ace, for those mid 90's Cleveland teams which were loaded with offense but cobbled together pitching staffs.

Hopefully Hart soon can inner his Cleveland self and start assembling and putting together some offensive players to compliment a now pitching rich organization. We don't need to be that good (mid 90's Cleveland offense) but we need to get some semblence of talent to surround Freeman going forward.

But as of right now, we're right where I expected us to be in the process of reloading (as far as trades and taking on some high risk/high reward deals)...but there is much more work, and I assure you Hart & JC is only getting started. It's gonna be a fun ride and see how it all shakes out and materializes in the end.
Click to expand...

I don't really see them as pitching rich either. They seem to be a collection of reclamation projects deemed necessary due to a pitching barren farm system.

Tehran
Woods
Miller
etc
etc

with blank spaces in front of Kimbrel

could work out - but, Braves were not dealing from a position of strength in any of these deals
 
nsacpi said:
The other point worth making is that we are in a pitching rich and hitter scarce era. The idea that you can't have too much pitching doesn't fit with the times.
Click to expand...

Absolutely. The whole idea of "you can never have too much pitching" has no basis in this reality. Pitching is important without a doubt. But, someone has to get on base, drive runs in and score.

We are a long way from the "Chicks did the long ball" era. People want to project out what the pitching will be in 2017 (even though injury is much more likely). What about the starting 8? Right now, it looks like Freeman at 1B, CB at catcher, Peraza at 2B, Simmons at SS and a 35 yo Markakis in RF with the rest up for grabs.

And the whole idea of trading for what you need from your pitching depth doesn't work either in a pitching era. It's simple supply and demand. Scarcity determines value. Lots of pitching, less valuable. Scarce hitting, more valuable.

Hart was a great GM in the late 80's and 90's when pitching was scarce and hitting was plentiful. He's conducting this offseason like it still was the 90's.
 
57Brave said:
I think we learned what the DBacks knew.
Click to expand...

barf-o.gif
 
So, here's a how thread ideas come. Wait until something pops up on MLBTR, then do a copy & paste job.
 
Clearly the Braves didn't think we were resigning JUp or Heyward and that we weren't a playoff team. We have argued that point, but we don't know for sure. Hart has said he didn't think we were in the national's league.

If next year doesn't matter (not making playoffs) then a year of JUp or Heyward is out of the equation. So then Hart is evaluating a compensation pick vs Miller/Jenkins (I like Miller/Jenkins by a long shot) and Freid et al (I think I like Freid). I also don't know how the draft rules play into it (ie if you have 3 comp picks plus our first rounder does it mess up our pool or bonus, etc).

I think the Braves expect Graham to make it back to us. They may be wrong.

Really wish we could have had one of those Padres top guys. Even if we had to pay JUp to play for them. It appears we are not doing anything with the money.

Markakis I will never understand. Even if he's great this year, I just don't see how he fits in 17 and 18.
 
Jay212033 said:
I think I may be the only Braves fan that has really liked this entire offseason. The Braves trades one year of Upton and Heyward for multiple years of young good talent while saving a ton of money to go after big name FA before going into the new stadium in 2017. I'm one of the few that actually like the Markakis signing, he hits for a good average, walks, doesn't strikeout and plays good enough defense for RF. His production at the plate should be better than Heyward's so the only real difference is going to be the defense but those metrics are a bit overrated imo. Honestly if the Braves could trade for a guy like Ben Zobrist, put him in LF and leave Gattis at C this team could actually be highly competitive.

Lineup:
Markakis - RF(L)
Zobrist - LF(S)
Freeman - 1B(L)
Gattis - C(R)
Johnson(R)/Peterson(L) - 3B
Upton - CF(R)
Callaspo - 2B(S)
Simmons - SS(R)

Not the worst lineup ever but one that could be highly productive and score more runs.
Click to expand...

Well, congrats, you made our defense worse. If we moved for Zobrist the better option is to dump Johnson for whatever we can get and go with

RF - Markakis
2B - Zobrist
1B - Freeman
LF - Gattis
3B - Peterson/Callaspo
CF - Bossman
SS - Simmons
C - Bethancourt.

Callaspo at 2B would be a tragedy. Even if you keep ti that way though, no way od you put Zobrist, who's been a fantastic RF thouhg with individual season sampling issues in LF over Markakis who's been well below average.
 
Moncada is the only way to "save" the offseason from a PR standpoint. Obviously the results will dictate over time.

Moncada would get fans excited about something. Hopefully we get him and hopefully he's not a BJ, KK, Uggla, Lowe.......basically a braves FA signing.
 
NYC is spot on, if we went for it, Justin/Jason walk for nothing, Hart looks like an idiot.

Now, the deals arent great at all, no one disputes that but if Hart knows neither will re-up, why keep both for a slim shot to make the playoffs?

Jason deal is alright.

Justin deal is more of a depth move, and might have not let them take a stab at Manny if it didnt happen.

Markakis deal is a bit of a head scratcher but they need someone to play RF :)
 
Russ2dollas said:
Moncada is the only way to "save" the offseason from a PR standpoint. Obviously the results will dictate over time.

Moncada would get fans excited about something. Hopefully we get him and hopefully he's not a BJ, KK, Uggla, Lowe.......basically a braves FA signing.
Click to expand...

It seems the Braves LOVE Moncada, whether they outbid the rich markets for him.

Well i'll believe that when i see it.
 
Legit criticism. Only caveat is I think that those who criticize the off-season the heaviest think we could have contended in 2015. Maybe we could have. I'm in the camp that thinks we would have been hard pressed to do so, but I think the opposing view can't be dismissed out of hand. I thought we would get more for J. Upton than we did. Curious to see how La Stella does, but I think Vizcaino and the bonus slot money is a pretty good haul for him. The Markakis deal is a total head-scratcher to me. He's a good player, but I wouldn't have gone over three years for him.
 
I have been pretty critical but never thought there was a chance to compete in 2015. In fact, I have been saying for at least 4 years that the Braves were badly constructed and needed to rebuild/retool. The problem with rebuilding is that if you mention the word everyone assumes that you mean fire sale or something worse.

I think we are in a bigger bind now because the Braves tried to limp along to success without rebuilding.

I really don't have an issue with the Cub, Card or Yank trades. I do think Hart completely misplayed his hand on Upton - then panic set in and he jumped at what most likely will be a bad deal. The Markakis deal makes NO sense, no matter how you slice it. At his best he's below league average, but he's injured. Why sign a guy like that to big money and years when he makes no real difference in the team for likely his entire contract at best and could easily become an albatross like Uggla, Upton and Johnson. It would have been much better to throw a small contract at Ichiro and put him in RF everyday and say "go chase 3,000." At least it would give fans something to look forward to.

I also have big concerns that Gattis is still here. I think the odds are good that if he's still here at the end of the 2015 season he will have almost no value, since I think the odds are good that he is an injury waiting to happen.

Overall, my biggest beef is that the Braves are doing a kinda-sorta-half rebuild-half not lets hope the fans don't notice rebuild and that is not efficient.
 
Heyward said:
It seems the Braves LOVE Moncada, whether they outbid the rich markets for him.

Well i'll believe that when i see it.
Click to expand...

Where are you getting that the Braves love him?
Not saying you're wrong, just haven't gotten that impression.
 
yeezus said:
Where are you getting that the Braves love him?
Not saying you're wrong, just haven't gotten that impression.
Click to expand...

bowman, and others Braves writers have said the Braves scouts have been all over Moncada (no homo)

Nothing crazy official but it seems they really like him but i'll believe them out bid the NY/Phi/LA markets of the world when i see it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top