Floyds a solid back end of the rotation starter. The problem is that we either needed a TOR or a reliable innings eater for the 5th spot. A healthy Floyd is that but given that he's not due back until May or June and coming off TJ surgery nobody can be overly confident we get any use from him. Again, a healthy Floyd is a decent pitcher and I'm fine with the move but definitely wish we would have been more aggressive for an impact SP. I get it that we have great young talent that should continue to improve but losing McCann and Hudson while adding Floyd means we are definitely in worse shape.
Braves sign Gavin Floyd 1 yr 4M + incentives
- Thread starter CrimsonCowboy
- Start date
50PoundHead
Hessmania Forever
Precisely.
I think your comments are pretty close to, if not exactly, what Wren is thinking.
zitothebrave
Connoisseur of Minors
What impact SP were even on the market?
Ricky Nolasco? Ubaldo Jimenez? Santana? Burnett? Garza? Kazmir?
The ERA+ of those guys last 3 seasons and last season.
Jimenez 90/113
Nolasco 91/101
Santana 101/127
Burnett 97/107
Garza 110/106
Kazmir 93 (only really pitched in 2013)
Only Santana and Garza have a higher or equal 3 year total.
None of those guys are impact starters except Jimenez who's a big risk.
Ricky Nolasco? Ubaldo Jimenez? Santana? Burnett? Garza? Kazmir?
The ERA+ of those guys last 3 seasons and last season.
Jimenez 90/113
Nolasco 91/101
Santana 101/127
Burnett 97/107
Garza 110/106
Kazmir 93 (only really pitched in 2013)
Only Santana and Garza have a higher or equal 3 year total.
None of those guys are impact starters except Jimenez who's a big risk.
As I said....if not an impact pitcher then a reliable innings eater. I am NOT saying this is a bad signing but if we were planning on going this route my point is I would rather have someone not missing 2 months of the year and coming back from Tommy John.
Heyward
<B>Voted Worst Poster <br>'13, '14, '15 (Co-Winner
I'm sure most "would of" (would've or would have) liked Kendrick.
It's not JUST the fact Wren didn't fix 2B (the biggest hole on the roster), but the way he has fixed ALL areas of need.
The Braves needed to add a piece in 4 areas: 2B, LHed BP, rotation, and bench bat. All the fixes have been injured players that are no more than additional question marks added to the roster. None of the areas of need were actually fixed, they were only maybe fixed if everything worked out when the guy was finally healthy.
Why go into the season with so many roster spots guaranteed to be problematic?
This offseason has been a complete and utter failure so far in my opinion. It is clear Wren severely miscalculated the cost of adding talent this offseason and is now falling back on plans D and E in all cases.
Heyward
<B>Voted Worst Poster <br>'13, '14, '15 (Co-Winner
We dont have alot of payroll flexibility.
So im not sure why you think we were going to make a lot of moves.
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
In what way would "correctly" estimating the cost of adding talent have made a difference?
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
Actually Wren had quite a bit of payroll flexibility. The Braves have a number of players who could have been moved to create payroll space. Freeman, Heyward, Kimbrel, Medlen, Minor, Justin Upton, Chris Johnson. I'm glad Wren chose not to exercise any of those options.
He could probably have moved Uggla by bundling him with some top prospects like Sims, Bethancourt, Graham, etc. I'm glad he didn't take that road either.
MadduxFanII
Swallowed by Mark Bowman
Wren has talked a lot about the "sticker shock" he's witnessed at the price of pitching and generally mediocre free agents (you may now insert your snarky comments about BJ Upton and Derek Lowe). The impression I've gotten is that the Braves don't love the idea of going into spring training with a Minor-Teheran-Medlen-Beachy-Wood rotation; that's an extraordinarily young group, Beachy's a serious injury risk and there's not much depth beyond Hale.
But they don't hate the idea so much that they're willing to shell out huge dollars or shred a re-building farm system just to avoid it. In a perfect world, they'd pick up Lohse or Samardzija at a reasonable price, slot the new guy into the fourth spot, and let Beachy, Wood and Hale battle for the final rotation spot while the losers serve as insurance. It's not a perfect world, however, so you get Gavin Floyd instead.
As for Floyd...eh, I'm willing to give the Braves the benefit of the doubt here. Roger McDowell and company have more than earned that, and Floyd was a reasonable enough pitcher when healthy.
But they don't hate the idea so much that they're willing to shell out huge dollars or shred a re-building farm system just to avoid it. In a perfect world, they'd pick up Lohse or Samardzija at a reasonable price, slot the new guy into the fourth spot, and let Beachy, Wood and Hale battle for the final rotation spot while the losers serve as insurance. It's not a perfect world, however, so you get Gavin Floyd instead.
As for Floyd...eh, I'm willing to give the Braves the benefit of the doubt here. Roger McDowell and company have more than earned that, and Floyd was a reasonable enough pitcher when healthy.
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
That's about right. Last season, they went into spring training with five starters and a spare in Beachy who was supposed to be ready in June.
This season, they are in a very similar situation.
It is worth keeping in mind that teams often give 8 or more starters at least 10 starts over the course a full season. It is a long season. Last season, we saw Hudson, Maholm and Beachy fall by the wayside. We got a bit lucky with Wood's rapid development (which offset a bit of bad luck in the form of injuries to Graham and Gilmartin).
I think when setting your starting pitching depth you want to go eight deep and make a judgment whether you have enough. Our eight top guys now are Medlen, Minor, Beachy, Teheran, Wood, Floyd, Hale and Maya.
Yunesky Maya to me is a very good and underrated signing. One of two minor league signings (the other being Luis Vasquez) who I think are going to help the major league team in 2014.
yeezus
It's OVER 5,000!
Floyd has the potential to be one of the best bargain FA signings this off-season. The guys who have received big contracts, even if they play their best, are only living up to it. If Floyd reaches his 8.5 million, I'm guessing it will be based on a very good season and will end up being a bargain. He's been an extremely solid SP from 2008 on. We got a potentially great bargain, and pitching in our park and with McDowell, he could easily get back the levels he was at prior to TJ.
I'm not down for mortgaging the farm or future. Price would cost a crap ton. Samardjiza apparently would, too. Kendrick would not be let go for a bargain, he would cost a lot, too. I really like this move.
I'm not down for mortgaging the farm or future. Price would cost a crap ton. Samardjiza apparently would, too. Kendrick would not be let go for a bargain, he would cost a lot, too. I really like this move.
IMO adding a 2B was never on our to do list this offseason. We either trade Uggla and let La Stella, Pastornicky, Pena battle it out or go into ST with Uggla and let them all battle it out.
yeezus
It's OVER 5,000!
And I think, given our payroll restrictions and the guys we're going to need to sign in the coming years, this was the smart thing to do. You have to give La Stella a shot at some point. We weren't going to find a major upgrade at 2B without giving up a lot. That's really hard to grasp for some people.
GovClintonTyree
<B>Vencer a Los Doyers</B>
Signed Gavin Floyd?! Suck it Nats!
Just kidding... The upgrade from Loe to Hale is going to be huge.
Wullll...yeah.
I think the Braves are very happy with Minor, Medlen, Teheran, Beachy, Wood - if they all come through and if they're all healthy. And I hope they are and do, in which case Floyd is just insurance. But if one of them falls out of the rotation by 5/31, Floyd goes in. I think it makes sense for us and its a good opportunity to re establish value for the player.
Wood and Beachy were gonna get eight starts each to start the season no matter what, as long as they are physically able.
Going to add a different perspective here. How Beachy will respond will not be known until ST. It's also not set in stone that Wood has a spot in the rotation, bullpen or a ticket to Gwinnett. Next up is the fact that there are always fewer available starts in April. So, with Floyd not available until May, that shouldn't cause any disruptions. This signing also doesn't preclude Wren from still attempting to acquire another starting pitcher.
GovClintonTyree
<B>Vencer a Los Doyers</B>
Signed Gavin Floyd?! Suck it Nats!
Just kidding... The upgrade from Loe to Hale is going to be huge.
Wullll...yeah.
I think the Braves are very happy with Minor, Medlen, Teheran, Beachy, Wood - if they all come through and if they're all healthy. And I hope they are and do, in which case Floyd is just insurance. But if one of them falls out of the rotation by 5/31, Floyd goes in. I think it makes sense for us and its a good opportunity to re establish value for the player.
Wood and Beachy were gonna get eight starts each to start the season no matter what, as long as they are physically able.