Braves sign Gavin Floyd 1 yr 4M + incentives

[Julio3000]

This feels like Raul Mondesi

Kinda musky, with elements hair relaxer and tarnished gold jewelry? Oh, you said FEELS.

 

[PawPawMaxwell]

I have no dog in this current fight. However, if I had a vote with the FO brains my suggested route would be trade JUpton to the RedSox for Lackey and then jump in on the Choo sweepstakes. Undoubtedly there is enough money for those deals.

Then if Heyward becomes impossible to extend we have a very good vet pitcher for 2 years, a LH hitting Ofer to replace Heyward and at the same time leadoff.

Viola!!!!!!!!! End of my off season and in 2 days everyone on this forum will be back to earth angst free.

 

[NYCBrave]

It's not doom and gloom, it's fact. The Braves have great regular seasons and then don't get it done in the postseason. I know this board hates criticism but until the Braves get it done in October they deserve it. Unless of course you believe winning a World Series just isn't that impressive of an accomplishment. That's pretty much the argument most of you are making. Why even make trades or sign FA's, just use your farm system to build the best regular season team you can, afterall winning in the playoffs isn't that big of a deal. You just have to hope you get lucky.

As far as what I think should be done? I think you need to find players who thrive in big game situations. A guy like David Ortiz or Derek Jeter who have proven they can get big hits with the season on the line. I'd like to see a team built around high OBP guys and speed. That way you can manufacture runs when you are going against great pitching. I don't think a team with high K rates that relies on the homerun is the way to win in October. As far as pitching goes, I think you need power arms, you need starters that have the ability to miss bats. Now granted it's hard to build the perfect roster but those are the ingredients I believe will give you the best chance of winning in October.

Again I never said this isn't a good team but it is a team that hasn't shown the ability to win in October yet and until they do they deserve criticism. You can choose to give them a free pass if you choose too but I'm tired of patting them on the back for having a great regular season and then not showing up when games matter the most. It's great that they can beat the Phillies, Marlins, and Mets. I want them to win when it matters the most.

One last point on regular season records. We don't have an balanced schedule anymore so you can't really use regular season records as an indicator of who the best teams are. Also regular season injuries come into play as to why a team may not play their best during the year but then all of a sudden get hot at the end of the season and into the playoffs. Now on the flip side injuries can hurt you in the postseason as well. I have no problem acknowledging that. Honestly all your posts look very familiar because I've written much of the same stuff before. These look like my posts from years past, I even made a similar argument this past year but I'm tired of making excuses for this organizations post season failures. I'm ready for some results.

Of course that's just my opinion, take it for what it's worth.

To your point, I've always felt this had to do with our organizational philosophy. There never seems to be any sense of urgency and it's like a mom and pop, good old boys organization from the way I see it.

 

[yeezus]

I have no dog in this current fight. However, if I had a vote with the FO brains my suggested route would be trade JUpton to the RedSox for Lackey and then jump in on the Choo sweepstakes. Undoubtedly there is enough money for those deals.

Then if Heyward becomes impossible to extend we have a very good vet pitcher for 2 years, a LH hitting Ofer to replace Heyward and at the same time leadoff.

Viola!!!!!!!!! End of my off season and in 2 days everyone on this forum will be back to earth angst free.

Justin Upton for John Lackey?
I wish I didn't just read that.

 

[nsacpi]

Choo would have been a very good trade acquisition for one year last off-season. And he ended up being exactly that for the Reds in 2013.

However, at age 31 and with Scott Boras as an agent, I do not think he would be a good signing this off-season.

There have been some good points made in this discussion by people I disagree with. The point about high OBP (see above about Choo) and fewer strikeouts is a good one imo. Interestingly, in La Stella we might have someone who could provide exactly that.

I also think the point about mid-season acquisitons (from the Mike Devereux faction) is very good. Wren kept some money in reserve last year and tried to get Lohse. Didn't happen but I liked that he had that flexibility. I think it would be a good think to preserve a similar amount of flexibility for the 2014 season.

 

[The Tariff King]

No one is saying they wouldn't like to have Price, in a vacuum. But the price of prospects to get him would be high, and then he'd walk unless we gave him a crap ton of money. The Rays are OK with dealing him.
I badly wish we could get Price without sacrificing our farm and young guys, but that won't happen. This team can win with progress from a few of our own guys.

I personally think Wren's reluctance to pull the trigger on that Price deal has to do with Gattis.

I think Wren is uncertain how Gattis will adjust to the league's adjusting to him in his second year. Will Gattis turn into Francoeur and swing at everything under the sun and not take pitches, or will he be solid?

Wood is replaced by Price. We know at this point what we can get out of Medlen and Minor. We don't know what we'll get with a full season of Wood. Price eliminates that, and I'd rather bank on Julio for a full season over Wood even though Wood was really good his few starts.

I think Wren has decided if Gattis isn't going to be anywhere close to the defensive catcher McCann was (Gattis was pretty godo at framing like McCann, but defensively can he do it full time and handle the pitching staff), then he's going to need him to put up 15-20 bombs. If he doesn't feel that confident in Gattis, then that's why he has to keep Bethancourt. Bethancourt at least from reputation can end up being a really good defensive catcher. Maybe a Henry Blanco? Or a Yadier when he first came in and couldn't hit worth a lick but developed into a hitter?

Of course, if we were still a Top 10 payroll team, I think Wren doesnt' even think twice about it and goes for the win now.

 

[yeezus]

Yeah, dammit, wish we got Choo! We would have went on a serious run with him, just like the Reds!

 

[yeezus]

I personally think Wren's reluctance to pull the trigger on that Price deal has to do with Gattis.

I think Wren is uncertain how Gattis will adjust to the league's adjusting to him in his second year. Will Gattis turn into Francoeur and swing at everything under the sun and not take pitches, or will he be solid?

Wood is replaced by Price. We know at this point what we can get out of Medlen and Minor. We don't know what we'll get with a full season of Wood. Price eliminates that, and I'd rather bank on Julio for a full season over Wood even though Wood was really good his few starts.

I think Wren has decided if Gattis isn't going to be anywhere close to the defensive catcher McCann was (Gattis was pretty godo at framing like McCann, but defensively can he do it full time and handle the pitching staff), then he's going to need him to put up 15-20 bombs. If he doesn't feel that confident in Gattis, then that's why he has to keep Bethancourt. Bethancourt at least from reputation can end up being a really good defensive catcher. Maybe a Henry Blanco? Or a Yadier when he first came in and couldn't hit worth a lick but developed into a hitter?

Of course, if we were still a Top 10 payroll team, I think Wren doesnt' even think twice about it and goes for the win now.

I don't think it's the main reason, but definitely something he thought about, and something that a good GM takes in to consideration. I think there are a lot of reasons.

 

[nsacpi]

I personally think Wren's reluctance to pull the trigger on that Price deal has to do with Gattis.

I think Wren is uncertain how Gattis will adjust to the league's adjusting to him in his second year. Will Gattis turn into Francoeur and swing at everything under the sun and not take pitches, or will he be solid?

Wood is replaced by Price. We know at this point what we can get out of Medlen and Minor. We don't know what we'll get with a full season of Wood. Price eliminates that, and I'd rather bank on Julio for a full season over Wood even though Wood was really good his few starts.

I think Wren has decided if Gattis isn't going to be anywhere close to the defensive catcher McCann was (Gattis was pretty godo at framing like McCann, but defensively can he do it full time and handle the pitching staff), then he's going to need him to put up 15-20 bombs. If he doesn't feel that confident in Gattis, then that's why he has to keep Bethancourt. Bethancourt at least from reputation can end up being a really good defensive catcher. Maybe a Henry Blanco? Or a Yadier when he first came in and couldn't hit worth a lick but developed into a hitter?

Of course, if we were still a Top 10 payroll team, I think Wren doesnt' even think twice about it and goes for the win now.

There is more uncertainty about guys like Gattis and Wood. But no player is a sure thing. That is especially true of pitchers. So-called aces go into decline or get injured regularly. Just from recent seasons, we've seen that happen with guys like Halladay, Lincecum, Josh Johnson, Sabatthia. Price is far from a sure thing. Look at Matt Harvey. Went from starting the All-Star game to out for all of 2014.

 

[Enscheff]

The Rays may not have been to the World Series with Price as a starter, but I'd take Price starting Game 7 or Game 1 for my team over Minor, Medlen, Teheran, Wood. Beachy is the one guy on our staff I'd throw against a Kershaw and feel comfortable. Oh and maybe Freddy Garcia.

I actually would've preferred signing Freddy to a minor league deal instead of Floyd for 4 million.

Since 2010, the Rays have been to the postseason as many times as us (3 times) with Price leading their rotation.

That's a very interesting point...

Who would you rather have? Gamel and Floyd, or Chavez and Garcia?

The correct choice is blantantly obvious to me.

 

[The Tariff King]

There is more uncertainty about guys like Gattis and Wood. But no player is a sure thing. That is especially true of pitchers. So-called aces go into decline or get injured regularly. Just from recent seasons, we've seen that happen with guys like Halladay, Lincecum, Josh Johnson, Sabatthia. Price is far from a sure thing. Look at Matt Harvey.

Halladay didn't really decline so much get old. He was 35 when his decline began... yeah there are exceptions to the rule like a Hudson but even Glavine, Maddux, weren't as pristine. I pesronally think Halladay can still pitch, but he just chose to go out this way.

Lincecum I think was because of his mechanics. I know some people think has natural mechanics, but I just don't see it.

Josh Johnson was a surprise for me.

Sabathia was only a matter of time since he refuses to get the rest of his body in shape besides his left arm.

Harvey was just unfortunate.

Price has been as solid as a rock since he became a starter and there's nothing about his mechanics that scare me. Plus playing for his favorite childhood team might motivate him extra.

 

[The Tariff King]

That's a very interesting point...

Who would you rather have? Gamel and Floyd, or Chavez and Garcia?

The correct choice is blantantly obvious to me.

 

[Julio3000]

Jesse Chavez AND Jesse Garcia?

Where do I sign?

 

[nsacpi]

That's a very interesting point...

Who would you rather have? Gamel and Floyd, or Chavez and Garcia?

The correct choice is blantantly obvious to me.

Chavez would fit into our bench very nicely. I suspect, however, that he has a strong preference for remaining in Arizona.

 

[yeezus]

Chavez would fit into our bench very nicely. I suspect, however, that he has a strong preference for remaining in Arizona.

Impossible. We just didn't want him enough. There's no way he preferred one place to another, and we had to move on.

 

[Heyward]

I have no dog in this current fight. However, if I had a vote with the FO brains my suggested route would be trade JUpton to the RedSox for Lackey and then jump in on the Choo sweepstakes. Undoubtedly there is enough money for those deals.

Then if Heyward becomes impossible to extend we have a very good vet pitcher for 2 years, a LH hitting Ofer to replace Heyward and at the same time leadoff.

Viola!!!!!!!!! End of my off season and in 2 days everyone on this forum will be back to earth angst free.

Heyward for Lackey.

Please tell me you are joking.

I've said before i would trade him because i dont see him re-signing but for Lackey, really, really, really?

 

[skidlee]

We're not gonna spend much in FA on pitchers, just not the Braves morale.

Especially with a lot of younger guys ready in the coming years.

He asked if we would give Floyd a qualifying offer. My comment on next year FA starters has nothing to do with the braves signing anyone of them.

 

[Carp]

Whatever, if people want to be Chicken Littles, I'm done arguing with them. It comes down to believing in our young guys vs. not. I believe Minor, Teheran, and Wood could take huge steps. A healthy Heyward is huge for us. Freeman also continues to get better, and Simmons should also improve. When you have a young team like this, most franchises just run with them. Not many teams have the young, talented team we do. So, I'm ok with seeing how they grow and believing in them.

I don't think anyone expects us to be a bad team. But you are being a homer if you can't see that we lost a lot to FA and have not replaced it really at all. Very doubtful that we will win 96 games again this yr.

 

[Carp]

I'm not saying I don't believe in our guys.

I'm just saying I would believe in David Price more. If we don't get Price, I'm sure Minor-Medlen would again be our Game 1 starter if we get to the playoffs and I'd be 100% behind them.

The more I think about it, the more I wish we would pull the trigger on this trade. Realistically, we have the next two yrs of having Heyward, J-Up, Freeman, and Kimbrell all together. Our chances of winning a WS will never be greater in the near future than what they are right now (ownership change notwithstanding). I would rather shoot for the moon and go all in with Price than go to war with a "good enough" team like we currently have.

 

[yeezus]

I don't think anyone expects us to be a bad team. But you are being a homer if you can't see that we lost a lot to FA and have not replaced it really at all. Very doubtful that we will win 96 games again this yr.

We lost Hudson and Mac. Mac hurts, but the improvement of young players + Gattis can overcome the loss. Hudson's numbers can be replaced by Wood. It's not a guarantee, but it's certainly possible. And all of our pitchers are young and can improve.