the be perfectly honest when they told us we were rebuilding I did not see this team being good enough to compete till 2019. That is the time table when the real pitching prospects will be ready. By then Albies and Swanson should start to find it at a ML level. I know this seems like along time to wait, but with guys like Soroka, Fried, Allred, Sims, Newcomb, Riley, Swanson, Albies and possible Maitlan, the 2019 with a realistic look to 2020 as a championship caliber team. So for me trading the likes of Teheran, VIz does not bother me as much as it bothers others.
Compete or punt in 2017?
- Thread starter Enscheff
- Start date
Braves1976
It's OVER 5,000!
Braves would be wise to look into trading for Brett Nicholas from the Rangers. Now that the Rangers have four catchers on their 40-man they might be more willing to deal him. He's also a lefty you can pair with righty Flowers and younger too. If Braves don't trade for him he'll make his name in MLB eventually as he's already been good handling Rangers pitchers in his time up (lowest CERA among Rangers catchers by far, better pitch framer easy than Chirinos who really isn't good in that area, and solid bat too in minors and Majors). Rangers are pretty stacked with a combination of good hitting catchers, plus Wilson the lesser hitter among them is a good pitch framer.
Horsehide Harry
<B>Mr. Free Trade</B>
I have long been sounding the punt 2017 horn. I know all the add a 2 WAR player here, a 2 WAR player there arguments. And some of those scenarios might work out where the Braves approached .500 for 2017.
But, it's not 2017 that matters. A .500 team still doesn't win you ANYTHING. Yes, it's less painful than a 50 win team, but in the end it means nothing...UNLESS, that .500 win team leads to better in 2018 and beyond until they are a true competitor to actually win something.
Adding guys like Freese, Desmond, Prado may, MAY, make enough difference to change the dynamic from 60 or so wins to the high 70's, low 80's. In 2017. But what about 2018, 2019, 2020? Those guys, especially Freese and Prado, are trending down if for no other reason than age. Just as your young talent begins to really trend up, you find yourself with a number of anchor contracts trending down. It's not like there are a big number of relatively young difference makers on the FA market and you can't magically trade for young, talented controllable talent without giving up something they can't afford to give up.
Now, if the Braves see a big, BIG jump in available payroll in the new stadium, it may not make any difference. They buy their way out of the short term effects of short sighted contracts.
But, to me, the clear best path is
1. Trade every valuable veteran given the right return during the 2016 season at the All Star break. You likely can't wait until the offseason because of messaging and the new park. If you trade Teheran now, you can say you are clearing the decks for all the exciting young talent, the foundation of the next dynasty, that fans will see in the new park starting in 2017. Fans, especially casual fans, will forget somewhat given a positive offseason that generates hope. If you wait until the offseason, it will look like a betrayal because the new park takes ownership of the team from a fans perspective as soon as the 2016 is over.
That means trade Freeman, Teheran, Viz, Inciarte, Markakis, Aybar, etc. if IF you get the right return. But don't be stupid about what the right return should be. Every trade doesn't have to be a Miller/Swanson trade. But no trade should be a Wood/Olivera trade.
2. Play big in the 2016 FA market. This appears to be happening.
3. Don't worry about the 2016 record. The worse the better. Unfortunately, it is better to be dead last than it is to be 5th from dead last. It is what it is. Play the rule 5, waivers, etc. for all they are worth.
4. Continue to be open about taking on bad contracts/money IF it brings needed talent in return. This is an effective way to essentially Buy talent. You've cleared all the contracts, even some that were good dollar/value contracts, so use some of the money to buy talent through taking on someone else's mistake.
5. Play carefully in the 2016/2017 FA market. Look for bargains. Keep an eye out for a young controllable guy who will be additive for 3-4 years at least. Stay away from the short term answers UNLESS you intend to trade them. Don't start the clocks of your own 2016 young talent until September.
6. Watch for opportunity in ST. Guys get cut all the time and end up bouncing back when given a chance.
7. Go young in 2017. You promise in the offseason leading up to the season that they will see the exciting young new Braves that will be the foundation of a new dynasty. Let the young guys grow and take their lumps. It will likely lead to another lost season. But it is lost with purpose.
8. Draft early, draft well in 2017.
9. Do the maximum you can on the International market in 2017 depending on what the rules are at the time.
10. In the 2017/2018 FA market look for your hole filling Pendelton, Belliard, Bream, Greg Olsen guys. If you can get a Maddux or Bonds guy that will be a veteran cornerstone for the team to lead for the next decade, pull the trigger. You have the money.
11. Enter 2018 with a real outlook for building something great and great that will last.
12. Pick early, pick well in the 2018 draft.
13. Again do your best on the International market depending on constraints.
14. Reap the rewards for years to come.
But, it's not 2017 that matters. A .500 team still doesn't win you ANYTHING. Yes, it's less painful than a 50 win team, but in the end it means nothing...UNLESS, that .500 win team leads to better in 2018 and beyond until they are a true competitor to actually win something.
Adding guys like Freese, Desmond, Prado may, MAY, make enough difference to change the dynamic from 60 or so wins to the high 70's, low 80's. In 2017. But what about 2018, 2019, 2020? Those guys, especially Freese and Prado, are trending down if for no other reason than age. Just as your young talent begins to really trend up, you find yourself with a number of anchor contracts trending down. It's not like there are a big number of relatively young difference makers on the FA market and you can't magically trade for young, talented controllable talent without giving up something they can't afford to give up.
Now, if the Braves see a big, BIG jump in available payroll in the new stadium, it may not make any difference. They buy their way out of the short term effects of short sighted contracts.
But, to me, the clear best path is
1. Trade every valuable veteran given the right return during the 2016 season at the All Star break. You likely can't wait until the offseason because of messaging and the new park. If you trade Teheran now, you can say you are clearing the decks for all the exciting young talent, the foundation of the next dynasty, that fans will see in the new park starting in 2017. Fans, especially casual fans, will forget somewhat given a positive offseason that generates hope. If you wait until the offseason, it will look like a betrayal because the new park takes ownership of the team from a fans perspective as soon as the 2016 is over.
That means trade Freeman, Teheran, Viz, Inciarte, Markakis, Aybar, etc. if IF you get the right return. But don't be stupid about what the right return should be. Every trade doesn't have to be a Miller/Swanson trade. But no trade should be a Wood/Olivera trade.
2. Play big in the 2016 FA market. This appears to be happening.
3. Don't worry about the 2016 record. The worse the better. Unfortunately, it is better to be dead last than it is to be 5th from dead last. It is what it is. Play the rule 5, waivers, etc. for all they are worth.
4. Continue to be open about taking on bad contracts/money IF it brings needed talent in return. This is an effective way to essentially Buy talent. You've cleared all the contracts, even some that were good dollar/value contracts, so use some of the money to buy talent through taking on someone else's mistake.
5. Play carefully in the 2016/2017 FA market. Look for bargains. Keep an eye out for a young controllable guy who will be additive for 3-4 years at least. Stay away from the short term answers UNLESS you intend to trade them. Don't start the clocks of your own 2016 young talent until September.
6. Watch for opportunity in ST. Guys get cut all the time and end up bouncing back when given a chance.
7. Go young in 2017. You promise in the offseason leading up to the season that they will see the exciting young new Braves that will be the foundation of a new dynasty. Let the young guys grow and take their lumps. It will likely lead to another lost season. But it is lost with purpose.
8. Draft early, draft well in 2017.
9. Do the maximum you can on the International market in 2017 depending on what the rules are at the time.
10. In the 2017/2018 FA market look for your hole filling Pendelton, Belliard, Bream, Greg Olsen guys. If you can get a Maddux or Bonds guy that will be a veteran cornerstone for the team to lead for the next decade, pull the trigger. You have the money.
11. Enter 2018 with a real outlook for building something great and great that will last.
12. Pick early, pick well in the 2018 draft.
13. Again do your best on the International market depending on constraints.
14. Reap the rewards for years to come.
bravos4evr
Still Playing the Waiting Game
crush enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of the women