Filibuster

57Brave

57Brave

Well-known member
Surprised no one has weighed in - so I will.

In it's current form it exists (for example) to not raise taxes on the wealthy.
In it's current form it exists to hold the working class at bay (?)
In it's current form it exists to maintain racial and gender status quo
 
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"The filibuster was not a part of the Framers' design of the republic or of the Senate. It was an early 19th century invention. Later it was used, and for a long time, to block advancement on civil rights and to prevent the end of slavery.

In its original conception - in the Roman Republic - Cato the Younger used it, but the Roman system required speaking. That, too, is still required in Ireland, the UK, Austria, New Zealand, and Canada.

The modern use of the filibuster as a constant tool by the minority to prevent consideration of legislation is damaging the American democratic experiment. We cannot have a functional government, let alone a healthy society, if the will of the majority on any question is always subject to the whim of the minority in our national legislature.

Democrats must end, or at least sharply limit, the filibuster if that party is to prevail in 2022 or 2024 and if this country's long and growing list of problems are ever to be solved. I do not think it is too dramatic to say that, eventually, it will come down to either the filibuster or the union."
 
" 22 states have Republicans holding both of their senate seats Based on the 2019 US census estimates, the 20 least populated states in that group....meaning 40 Republican senate votes that can stop any legislation with a filibuster...represent about 22% of the total US population.

The senate is already a non-democratic institution with each state having an equal number of senators. It is one thing to accept that result because it is written into our Constitution...it is quite another to give a small minority even more power due to an outdated senate rule. "
 
I am honestly surprised it made it through the last decade of Mitch controlling the Senate. I do not personally like the idea of seismic shifts based on each election, but definitely wonder if things have become too partisan to continue to have it. It’s the idea of partisanship that is being used to keep it, but in reality the hyper-partisan nature of our politics is just leading to everything being stymied on both sides.
 
Odd that you didn't have these concerns about the filibuster over the past few years, 57.
 
People generally only want the filibuster gone when it prevents their side from doing whatever they want. When their side is in the minority the filibuster becomes a vital part of the Senate that ensures greater consideration and debate.

I like the filibuster. I feel it slows things down and encourages compromise. I think both those things are beneficial no matter who is in office.

I also warn anyone who wants to do away with the filibuster to consider that history teaches us your side will not always be in power. The pendulum swings back and forth. What is an impediment now might be a shield tomorrow.
 
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I'm curious to see anyone chime in on the absolute horse**** afront to democracy that was that POS Moscow Mitch just burying anything he didn't want to be discussed for 8 years. How in the **** is that democracy???
 
yeah, that is odd ?

Have always felt a filibuster should be a " filibuster" regardless who is employing it.
It is an antiquated process
 
No, the alternate version of history thethe lives in where Donald Trump is the savior of humanity and chosen by God to be President.
 
57Brave said:
Surprised no one has weighed in - so I will.

In it's current form it exists (for example) to not raise taxes on the wealthy.
In it's current form it exists to hold the working class at bay (?)
In it's current form it exists to maintain racial and gender status quo
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I hear a lot from Trump supporters "I dont like the stuff he says but I like his policies". The point is if you give your voters what they want they don't give two ****s about anything else. I dont like many of the Democrats policies but kill the filibuster and ram your policies through and make no apologies about it. When the GOP propoganda media machine cries about it shame them about not working for Americans. They should repeatedly point out that Biden got 81 million votes since they absolutely refuse to say it in conservative media. I would also continually low ball Trump vote numbers. Few things will trigger them more than daying Trump got only 55 million votes. I still havent seen any full audits showing Trump got 75 million voted. I need those full deep audits. So deep the poll workers get cavity searches to make sure they arent hiding ballots.
 
Tapate50 said:
Well that furthers the discussion
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His history is well documented on this forum. I hope he received help during his lowest time and still has someone in his life to guide him through these rocky times. I find it better to just completely ignore him as I’m sure many do with me.
 
cajunrevenge said:
I hear a lot from Trump supporters "I dont like the stuff he says but I like his policies". The point is if you give your voters what they want they don't give two ****s about anything else. I dont like many of the Democrats policies but kill the filibuster and ram your policies through and make no apologies about it. When the GOP propoganda media machine cries about it shame them about not working for Americans. They should repeatedly point out that Biden got 81 million votes since they absolutely refuse to say it in conservative media. I would also continually low ball Trump vote numbers. Few things will trigger them more than daying Trump got only 55 million votes. I still havent seen any full audits showing Trump got 75 million voted. I need those full deep audits. So deep the poll workers get cavity searches to make sure they arent hiding ballots.
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And if you do this, what happens the next time Republicans control both houses and the presidency? They'll undo everything the democrats did and then ram through their own laundry list of things. You don't keep the filibuster to appease the party that's not in power, you keep it to protect yourself from being marginalized the next time your party is the minority.
 
The problem with the filibuster isn't its existence, it's how it's used. The filibuster's real use comes in preventing extreme legislation and forcing anything that gets through to be a compromise. It's a fantastic tool that is necessary because of our nonsense two party system. If we had a dozen parties spread across the spectrum then we likely wouldn't need the filibuster as coalition building required to pass legislation would force moderation and compromise. But we have a two party system so requiring 60 senators to agree to bring something to a vote is what we have to ensure compromise.

The problem is the filibuster isn't just used to make the Senate a more deliberative body passing more moderate, well considered legislation. The filibuster has turned into a weapon. Instead of ensuring the minority party has a voice it has become a de facto veto by the minority party.

One of two things needs to happen. Either the parties need to start moving towards the middle and away from the extremes so that you can have people actually come to the bargaining table to hash out legislation again or else we need the parties to shatter into a dozen different parties so the extremes have less voice and capturing moderate party members is necessary to pass legislation.

The worst possible result would be to do away with the filibuster as an escalation of the partisan war. If that's done the results will not be pretty.
 
My favorite part is that the idiot communists claim Cocaine Mitch would do the same, despite it never even being discussed when GOP had full control in 2016 with a supposed dictator as President.

These people are truly stupid and demand unlimited power
 
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striker42 said:
And if you do this, what happens the next time Republicans control both houses and the presidency? They'll undo everything the democrats did and then ram through their own laundry list of things. You don't keep the filibuster to appease the party that's not in power, you keep it to protect yourself from being marginalized the next time your party is the minority.
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I hate both parties with a passion so I dont have any fear about either side ramming things through. I dont like the obstruction by either side.
 
sturg33 said:
My favorite part is that the idiot communists claim Cocaine Mitch would do the same, despite it never even being discussed when GOP had full control in 2016 with a supposed dictator as President.

These people are truly stupid and demand unlimited power
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Republicans just justified trying to overturn an election based solely on the fact that they dont like the results and a Democrat once made an unofficial objection. Republicans have shown precedent means nothing to them. If it's not illegal it's fair game. That's the only standard. Trump spent 4 years making outrageous claims like we would be in a war with North Korea if Obama was President for example.




Besides all that Moscow Mitch is not long for the political world. He only backed Trump 99.5% of the time so that's obviously unacceptable. He will never be majority leader again. If Republicans take the Senate they will elect a new majority leader. And Kentucky Republicans are in the process if changing it so Moscow Mitch can hand pick who takes his spot so I doubt he finishes this term. I guarantee you if Trump wins and Republicans have both houses of Congress they will kill the filibuster regardless of what Democrats do now.
 
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