Fredi nominated for Manager of the Year Finalist

sturg33 said:
1. Gracia was getting hit HARD

2. Garcia gave up two home runs to Carl freaking Crawford

3. For all I know - Medlen shuts them down and we win easily
Click to expand...

1- He gave up 2 runs.

2- Crawford is a pretty good player.

3- Medlen got ROCKED vs them, you have no idea if he pitches better than 0-1 run ball vs them.

4- Garcia wasnt the reason we lost, he pitched well.
 
Dalyn said:
What argument have you supplied? You disregard the millions of examples people give, and then you Heyward the discussion.
Click to expand...

I never said hes a great or horrible manager, i think hes inbetween.

Fact: every fanbase thinks their manager sucks, both the Cards and Red Sox did.
 
Dalyn said:
No one is blaming everything that goes wrong on the manager. That is an exaggeration. And I was fine with Fredi when he first came here...before I had a chance to watch him on a regular basis. There is always some asinine obsession with him. First it was bunts. Then it was Schafer leading off. Then it was Simmons leading off. Then it was pulling pitchers as soon as someone got on base after the fifth inning. Then it was Gattis anchoring the lineup. It is always something. You don't see that with many managers, at least not the ones who stick around with one team long. And that is completely disregarding his otherwise bad in-game managing.
Click to expand...

I've yet to see you give him credit for anything other than "possibly being good behind the scenes"

Garcia is a move that ended up working. We would have had Medlen coming back on full rest and yet people are bashing him for that move as well. So it's gotten so bad that people are bashing him for moves that actually work.

As far as your list of complaints. I do think he bunts too much but it's not always a bad play....that's something you have to consider. Putting a man in scoring position isn't an awful situation to be in. We didn't have a ideal leadoff man so he experimented until he found one. Heyward wasn't an obvious choice. If we would have resigned Bourn he would have been put in the leadoff spot from day one. This offense struggled to find consistency so he was forced to play musical chairs and put people in position to be successful. Gattis had stretches where he carried the team. Nothing wrong with him anchoring the lineup for short stretches. If our high paid players were consistent he wouldn't have had to do it.
 
Heyward said:
Fact: Every fanbase bitches about their manager and thinks they can do better.

This is a pointless argument, Fredi can never win with you guys.
Click to expand...

"fredi can never win with you guys."
"you guys blame fredi for everything."
the hyperbole does not help your argument. it's not that fredi "can never win" with me, i have just seen him make a lot of very questionable moves and decisions throughout the season and post-season. that's not to say every move he makes is bad, but there was a lot of stupid and "by the book" moves, even when "the book" is stupid itself.

i believe we win that game that carpenter lost if kimbrel is used instead. agree or disagree? fredi didn't ruin our whole season. he didn't single-handedly lose in the playoffs - we have ALL stated that there are plenty of reasons. but that doesn't mean he gets no blame.

see, i think fredi can do no wrong with you guys. there is very little objectivity. one person who defended him couldn't think of one bad thing he's done. really??? even the best at what they do make mistakes, but one supporter couldn't name ONE problem? come on.
 
yeezus said:
"fredi can never win with you guys."
"you guys blame fredi for everything."
the hyperbole does not help your argument. it's not that fredi "can never win" with me, i have just seen him make a lot of very questionable moves and decisions throughout the season and post-season. that's not to say every move he makes is bad, but there was a lot of stupid and "by the book" moves, even when "the book" is stupid itself.

i believe we win that game that carpenter lost if kimbrel is used instead. agree or disagree? fredi didn't ruin our whole season. he didn't single-handedly lose in the playoffs - we have ALL stated that there are plenty of reasons. but that doesn't mean he gets no blame.

see, i think fredi can do no wrong with you guys. there is very little objectivity. one person who defended him couldn't think of one bad thing he's done. really??? even the best at what they do make mistakes, but one supporter couldn't name ONE problem? come on.
Click to expand...

Not sure we win that game if Carp doesnt pitch for one...

Puig is on 2nd, a passed ball, and flyball ties the game.

There were NO outs at the time.

I said before if they were gonna bring him in, use him for 2 innings.
 
Again why not put the blame where it belongs and that's at Carpenter's door step? I've yet to see anyone get on his case and accuse him of ruining our season. It's been all about Fredi for not using Kimbrel. Carpenter had been very successful as a setup man, why not trust him to do his job? What's the big deal? It's not like we had someone out there with a 5 ERA trying to bridge the gap. We had a very good pen and Fredi trusted it.
 
I don't mean to keep exhausting that particular instance, but it seemed to me like a very obvious time to use your best guy for 2 innings. It was the absolute perfect time to do so.

1. One run lead
2. Two of the Dodger's hottest hitters coming to the plate
3. Carpenter got smacked for HR in the 8th just a few days prior
4. Off day the day before, Kimbrel not overused
5. Elimination game; if you win, you go home and have a favorable matchup
6. Kimbrel asked for the ball for 2 innings

Instead, we left our best reliever in the pen "because it wasn't a save situation" and never got an opportunity at a save because...our best guy was left in the pen. I'm sorry, it's really hard for me to get over that and look past it. It was a huge, huge mistake and did not give us our best chance to win the game.

In hindsight, it's impossible to defend the decision not to use CK. Even before it happened, it was pretty damn hard to defend the decision to not bring him in there. These situations are not black and white. You shouldn't manage as if this was just another routine, regular season 8th inning. It was a huge moment, and I promise you Puig and Uribe were thankful we did not decide to bring him in.

The fact that some here will still defend that decision baffles me. The fact that Fredi defended it afterward and didn't admit his mistake is what really sucks, though. If he had come out and said "Yeah, Kimbrel should have been the move," I wouldn't be as upset, or at least give him credit for recognizing his mistake. Considering he felt it was the right move still, even after seeing the results, tells me he's stubborn to the point of stupid, and that sucks.
 
ChapelHillMatt said:
Again why not put the blame where it belongs and that's at Carpenter's door step? I've yet to see anyone get on his case and accuse him of ruining our season. It's been all about Fredi for not using Kimbrel. Carpenter had been very successful as a setup man, why not trust him to do his job? What's the big deal? It's not like we had someone out there with a 5 ERA trying to bridge the gap. We had a very good pen and Fredi trusted it.
Click to expand...

JUST BECAUSE CARPENTER DIDN'T DO HIS JOB, DOESN'T MEAN THAT FREDI WAS RIGHT IN BRINGING HIM IN.
Yes, Carp did fail us. No one will say otherwise. He also almost failed us and coughed up the lead just a few nights before. An excellent argument AGAINST using him in that spot.

We left our best pitcher on the bench to let Carpenter blow the lead. That doesn't sit well with me.
 
yeezus said:
I don't mean to keep exhausting that particular instance, but it seemed to me like a very obvious time to use your best guy for 2 innings. It was the absolute perfect time to do so.

1. One run lead

2. Two of the Dodger's hottest hitters coming to the plate

3. Carpenter got smacked for HR in the 8th just a few days prior

4. Off day the day before, Kimbrel not overused

5. Elimination game; if you win, you go home and have a favorable matchup

6. Kimbrel asked for the ball for 2 innings

Instead, we left our best reliever in the pen "because it wasn't a save situation" and never got an opportunity at a save because...our best guy was left in the pen. I'm sorry, it's really hard for me to get over that and look past it. It was a huge, huge mistake and did not give us our best chance to win the game.

In hindsight, it's impossible to defend the decision not to use CK. Even before it happened, it was pretty damn hard to defend the decision to not bring him in there. These situations are not black and white. You shouldn't manage as if this was just another routine, regular season 8th inning. It was a huge moment, and I promise you Puig and Uribe were thankful we did not decide to bring him in.

The fact that some here will still defend that decision baffles me. The fact that Fredi defended it afterward and didn't admit his mistake is what really sucks, though. If he had come out and said "Yeah, Kimbrel should have been the move," I wouldn't be as upset, or at least give him credit for recognizing his mistake. Considering he felt it was the right move still, even after seeing the results, tells me he's stubborn to the point of stupid, and that sucks.
Click to expand...

Or he wasn't just going to hose is own player (Carpenter) in front of the media.
 
yeezus said:
I don't mean to keep exhausting that particular instance, but it seemed to me like a very obvious time to use your best guy for 2 innings. It was the absolute perfect time to do so.

1. One run lead
2. Two of the Dodger's hottest hitters coming to the plate
3. Carpenter got smacked for HR in the 8th just a few days prior
4. Off day the day before, Kimbrel not overused
5. Elimination game; if you win, you go home and have a favorable matchup
6. Kimbrel asked for the ball for 2 innings

Instead, we left our best reliever in the pen "because it wasn't a save situation" and never got an opportunity at a save because...our best guy was left in the pen. I'm sorry, it's really hard for me to get over that and look past it. It was a huge, huge mistake and did not give us our best chance to win the game.

In hindsight, it's impossible to defend the decision not to use CK. Even before it happened, it was pretty damn hard to defend the decision to not bring him in there. These situations are not black and white. You shouldn't manage as if this was just another routine, regular season 8th inning. It was a huge moment, and I promise you Puig and Uribe were thankful we did not decide to bring him in.

The fact that some here will still defend that decision baffles me. The fact that Fredi defended it afterward and didn't admit his mistake is what really sucks, though. If he had come out and said "Yeah, Kimbrel should have been the move," I wouldn't be as upset, or at least give him credit for recognizing his mistake. Considering he felt it was the right move still, even after seeing the results, tells me he's stubborn to the point of stupid, and that sucks.
Click to expand...

To be fair, Hanley barely hit the HR out in the 8th, he didnt smack it out.

Was actually a good pitch.
 
Dalyn said:
Don't get fired? Tell that to Mattingly. To Baker (who was one of the finalists). And several others throughout the years. I doubt very seriously that Fredi will be with the Braves in 2015.
Click to expand...

That's only because you want him gone, he will be on the Braves bench in 2015. You forget how bad an in-game manager Cox was. He is a leader and a great talent evaluator but he also rode his bullpen in the ground. Add to that he refused to use speed even when the team had a little. Give Freddi a chance and he will win a championship.
 
VirginiaBrave said:
That's only because you want him gone, he will be on the Braves bench in 2015. You forget how bad an in-game manager Cox was. He is a leader and a great talent evaluator but he also rode his bullpen in the ground. Add to that he refused to use speed even when the team had a little. Give Freddi a chance and he will win a championship.
Click to expand...

I am okay with him being a bench coach in 2015. Sounds good.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top