GDT: 11/3/20, Election Day, Donald J. Trump vs. Joseph R. Biden

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nsacpi said:
Common enemy is a great thing, you're right about that. I think we underestimate how much of what has happened in this country the last three decades is related to the end of the Cold War. In ways both good and bad the Cold War stabilized our politics. We don't have that stabilizing anchor anymore.
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Absolutely. I think it was good for the country in general, not just the politics. Everyone needs a rival. Better that the rival be on the other side of the world than in the next county.
 
Jaw said:
Absolutely. I think it was good for the country in general, not just the politics. Everyone needs a rival. Better that the rival be on the other side of the world than in the next county.
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I think we may move to a similar sort of national consensus about China. I'm hoping to see realistic hawks take charge of China policy in both parties.

The realistic part is recognizing that China is part of our world and that on some issues we can have a constructive relationship with them. The hawk part I think we all get.
 
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Jaw said:
Serious question. Hypothetically we're five years in the future and Democrats have nuked the filibuster, pulled an FDR court packing, added states, abolished the Electoral College, mandated questionable voting practices like universal mail in, third party canvassing, ban Voter ID, etc.,

Will you feel that they've protected the country from the undermining of democracy?
If so, will you feel the same way about all of the moderates who will have enabled it as you do the Grahams and McConnells?
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i said probably not in terms of voting for a Republican someday...the word probably is doing some work there...court packing is a terrible idea...DC statehood is something I support...I think we have the means to make voting both easy and free of fraud...i support both those goals equally...i'm agnostic about the Electoral College...it's quaint...as i get older i like quaint things more...but that's not an argument one way or the other
 
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striker42 said:
I was typing that on my phone and the predictive text brought up "Democrat" instead of "Democratic". I really don't care which term is used.

It's as delusional and informed to think Republicans are all about Trump as it is to think Democrats are. The situation is much more nuanced than that. However, it's hard to deny he was the central figure that American politics on both sides of the aisle orbited around.

With Democrats, Trump provided them an enemy to rally against. No matter their internal disagreements they had opposition to Trump to unite them. Can the far left wing of the party and the establishment wing agree on a path forward? Divisions within the party tend to disappear when there's a president of the other party in office. When the onus of leadership is back on a party, that party's divisions become more pronounced.
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a) thank you
b) Nixon/ Frost interview Nixon said FDR once told him " you always need an enemy"
I question the story but get the idea
c) I have no doubt (D) will move forward together. Recognize a family squabble
 
striker42 said:
I'm interested to see where the Democrat party goes. As much as the Republicans have been built around Trump, the Democrats have too.

Opposition and hatred of Trump unified the Democrat party. They're still fairly fractured as a party as is evideiced by Pelosi barely hanging onto the gavel.

The Democrats will need to figure out what their principles are along side the Republicans.

I think the parties moving into the post Trump era will be good for them.
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Wanted to jump back in one last time before I go back on hiatus, but the message that should come out of this (but likely won't be heard) is that Congress absolutely must become functional again on a bipartisan basis. There have been, and always will be, ideological battles that are appropriate as laws are developed and passed, but we need to get away from the winner-take-all approach where major (and sometimes controversial) legislation only passes when there is one party control of the legislative and executive branches. The temptation for the Democrats will be that now that they have a path to top-to-bottom control to go hog wild, after which they will inevitably face a backlash in 2022 (as they did in 2010 and the Republicans did in 2018). The failure of Congress to assume its rightful role consistently only leads to a power vacuum that the executive branch is always willing to fill with Executive Orders, the administrative rule process, and signing statements.

As a Democrat, I really can't stand Schumer and I wish there were someone else at the helm of the Senate. As Jaw has said, Manchin and Tester (and moderates like Klobuchar and others) can probably blunt whatever Sanders and the Squad scream about and help chart the moderate course that the country really needs in order to catch its breath. It will be interesting to watch the Republicans as well. I don't know who is up in 2022 on their side of the aisle, but it will be interesting to see if there is a Trump effect and a fear of being primaried that will dictate their actions.

So it's going to take both sides here. In the wake of yesterday's tragedy, I was buoyed by the Senate reaction. When Trump supporters like Rand Paul and Tom Cotton can take to the floor and directly rebuke the President, it gives me hope. There will be on-going tussles and those tussles are appropriate, but everyone (and not just those in Congress) need to start putting country ahead of party.
 
nsacpi said:
Common enemy is a great thing, you're right about that. I think we underestimate how much of what has happened in this country the last three decades is related to the end of the Cold War. In ways both good and bad the Cold War stabilized our politics. We don't have that stabilizing anchor anymore.
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Good insight. I agree. Without an external threat it becomes far easier for internal differences to give rise to internal conflict. And the threat of Soviet aggression makes trusting even a leader from another party far easier as you know they agree with you that the Soviets are bad.
 
50PoundHead said:
Wanted to jump back in one last time before I go back on hiatus, but the message that should come out of this (but likely won't be heard) is that Congress absolutely must become functional again on a bipartisan basis. There have been, and always will be, ideological battles that are appropriate as laws are developed and passed, but we need to get away from the winner-take-all approach where major (and sometimes controversial) legislation only passes when there is one party control of the legislative and executive branches. The temptation for the Democrats will be that now that they have a path to top-to-bottom control to go hog wild, after which they will inevitably face a backlash in 2022 (as they did in 2010 and the Republicans did in 2018). The failure of Congress to assume its rightful role consistently only leads to a power vacuum that the executive branch is always willing to fill with Executive Orders, the administrative rule process, and signing statements.

As a Democrat, I really can't stand Schumer and I wish there were someone else at the helm of the Senate. As Jaw has said, Manchin and Tester (and moderates like Klobuchar and others) can probably blunt whatever Sanders and the Squad scream about and help chart the moderate course that the country really needs in order to catch its breath. It will be interesting to watch the Republicans as well. I don't know who is up in 2022 on their side of the aisle, but it will be interesting to see if there is a Trump effect and a fear of being primaried that will dictate their actions.

So it's going to take both sides here. In the wake of yesterday's tragedy, I was buoyed by the Senate reaction. When Trump supporters like Rand Paul and Tom Cotton can take to the floor and directly rebuke the President, it gives me hope. There will be on-going tussles and those tussles are appropriate, but everyone (and not just those in Congress) need to start putting country ahead of party.
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Well said. I get why you don't stick around, but I wish you would. I am hopeful that having to evacuate to the Capitol basement to escape a mob will convince these people to tone it down.
 
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Mo Brooks is some rando crazy who happens to represent the 5th congressional district of Alabama. Like having thethe in Congress.
 
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was wondering who this guy was

wonder what he's like as a neighbor

insanity defense?
 
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Capitol Hill Police were simply overrun in this instance. I like the cop who was throwing haymakers. Maybe a medal for him.
 
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nsacpi said:
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was wondering who this guy was

wonder what he's like as a neighbor

insanity defense?
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Someone on FB told me he was a "professional anarchist" and also seen destroying property at a BLM protest, though he clearly appears to be supporter of the demagogue.
 
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agree with this take

six sigma is too far out there

every day for the past four years, newspapers would have been justified running a front-page headline saying "Enough with the Insanity", but we ended up normalizing it
 
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this is beyond sad...hopefully someday soon we can take down the fences
 
nsacpi said:
agree with this take

six sigma is too far out there

every day for the past four years, newspapers would have been justified running a front-page headline saying "Enough with the Insanity", but we ended up normalizing it
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And every quote by the demagogue should start "The Liar Said: "
 
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