Maybe of our understanding of today. But I doubt those who are into advanced stats would still be promoting UZR if something better comes along down the line. The problem with traditionalists is they hold onto their traditions despite overwhelming evidence against it.
GDT 4/5 - Colon @ deGrom
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Maybe of our understanding of today. But I doubt those who are into advanced stats would still be promoting UZR if something better comes along down the line. The problem with traditionalists is they hold onto their traditions despite overwhelming evidence against it.
msstate7
Well-known member
He just mad cause KEMvP gonna get 1.0 WAR. Enscheff knows he'll have a don Sutton quote as a signature come October
And the samermetricians continually move the goalposts so they are never wrong.
In 15 years all these stats will be obsolete.
RBI has been obsolete for 70 years. The great Branch Rickey knew this in his day. Sadly it took two generations for everyone else to catch up.
It's called altering your opinion to match data, rather than altering data to match your opinion.
"If the baseball world is to accept this new system of analyzing the game—and eventually it will—it must first give up preconceived ideas. I had to. The formula outrages certain standard that experienced baseball people have sworn by all their lives. Runs batted in? A misleading figure. Strikeouts? I always rated them highly as a determining force in pitching. I do now. But new facts convince me that I have overrated their importance in so far as game importance is concerned. Even batting average must be reexamined." - Branch Rickey 1954....simply the GOAT as far as baseball minds go
Agreed but let's not pretend you are universally correct when in 15 years you'll be wrong.
Yes...a misleading figure but not a worthless stat which is war you are saying. Every stat tells us something that can be useful in the right context.
Have I ever said I am universally correct? I have changed my opinion on things throughout my time here and on scout the last 15+ years. The one thing I will say is that I am open to new ideas and learning new things. I am not stuck in the past on what clearly doesn't work.
What is this useful context? What can RBI possibly tell us how good a hitter is?
Agreed but I don't forget the past as there is still truth there.
Ive never once said it tells us how good a hitter is. It's a result metric that tells us what a player produced in the past.
But what he is producing is based on the work of other players. It's about circumstance. What is useful about this information? It's not predictive. It doesn't help team building. What actual purpose does it have?
I've said this whole time. It's not predictive.
Of course. So what is useful about RBI. What truth can we learn from it that actually tells us anything?
Southcack77
Well-known member
He was .280/.330/.855 in Atlanta, which is ok. SD at least used to play as an extreme pitcher's park and maybe he didn't want to be there? I'm not a huge fan of the Kemp deal or of Kemp's value to contract, but I'm willing to consider the possibility he isn't going to be worthless in Atlanta.
And some folks have used his WAR to say that he isn't going to be any good. We'll see.
Southcack77
Well-known member
Well the problem is that Kemp was either better after he got to Atlanta, he was hotter, or he was luckier. Because his numbers were a good bit better than what he did San Diego. Like many Braves his second half was a lot better than a pretty bad first half.
You're starting to talk about a really good hitter to better the numbers Kemp put up after he got in Atlanta.
The major difference between what he did in SD and ATL was he walked more in ATL for whatever reason. Hopefully that continues and he's closer to his career mark in that area. If that happens we should have a good offensive player.
Southcack77
Well-known member
Yes. If you do not respect the saber movement then you aren't completely grasping the sport.
On the other hand, Sutton might know something about the interaction between pitcher and batter with runners on that you can't pick up out of a stat column.
