Grilli Close To Being Moved???
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Horsehide Harry
<B>Mr. Free Trade</B>
There is negative value in winning games at the ML level UNLESS you are all in to contend. The rules are now stacked in a way to benefit the teams with the worst record as far as talent acquisition goes. Everything from the first year draft, to rule 5, to waiver claims, to international signing pools, everything is weighted to those with the worst record.
So, yes, winning can be a negative if winning means pushing you out of bad territory into just "mediocre."
If you are committed to rebuilding it should be a race (temporarily) to the bottom.
jpx7
Very Flirtatious, but Doubts What Love Is.
But it would sit very well with the Braves' core "me" demographic.
Horsehide Harry
<B>Mr. Free Trade</B>
Yes missing best hitter but getting unlikely production from 4 scrap heap guys.
yeezus
It's OVER 5,000!
this is not the NBA. you cannot and should not tank in the MLB. this is a terrible mindset for baseball, and doesn't really work.
and again, grilli can potentially help next year when we could easily be contenders.
Who have all been productive players in their caerers.
yeezus
It's OVER 5,000!
THIS HAPPENS ALL THE TIME WITH A LOT OF TEAMS.
why do random contributions constantly get discarded? they happen all. the. time.
You don't always have to sell. The thing that made the Braves great in the 90's and early 2000's is they were winning and still produced top farm systems each year.
I have confidence the current regime will do the same. The system was in a bad position and needed a radical rehaul. That has been completed. Now its up to the scouts in place to keep it as strong as it is now.
I have confidence the current regime will do the same. The system was in a bad position and needed a radical rehaul. That has been completed. Now its up to the scouts in place to keep it as strong as it is now.
yeezus
It's OVER 5,000!
i hate that argument, as well. this happens a lot.
Look what PIT is getting out of Francisco freaking Cervelli. Guess we should erase it!
Jason Hammel has been a stud. Take it away! Doesn't count.
Brock Holt in Boston. Shouldn't count.
Mitch Moreland in Texas.
Should I go on? Or can we accept there are random fluctuations with players from year-to-year, and a resurgence here and there isn't uncommon?
Russ2dollas
10 yr, $185 million Extension
who do ppl think we could get that would be worth Grilli from Dodgers and Jays?
^^^
This.
I really like Grilli as well, but look at it this way.
If you can get Austin Barnes for him, you've set yourself up cheaply behind the plate for the next 5-6 years. I know lots of people have given up on Bethancourt and I'm in the minority, but he's reacted and performed like his demotion FINALLY got his attention. Let the two of them duke it out to start next spring and you've got a great tandem for awhile.
Turn around and offer to extend Johnson for two years with the money you save with Grilli's contract gone and the money coming off the books when you don't re-sign Pierzynski and you've still got an inexpensive veteran Closer that can mentor the kids until one of them is ready to take the job. When that happens, you've still got a great deal in Johnson that you can spin off for another prospect.
Horsehide Harry
<B>Mr. Free Trade</B>
It is what it is. I don't make the rules. I'm not saying Hart should be on the phone telling Freddie to tank games or tie the players shoes together. I am saying that when rebuilding you make the best long term personnel moves for the betterment of the team without regard to record. IF you lose games because of those moves that is a short term pain but a long term gain.
You don't not make a move so you can be 81-81 vs 73-89, not if you're smart.
And the whole idea of hurting the feelings or confidence of the players is just BS. Short term they will bitch and complain but long term they will win or be gone.
Horsehide Harry
<B>Mr. Free Trade</B>
Again, you don't scrap your rebuilding plan on such a small chance of winning. Not if you're smart. thethe wants to see what Freemen will bring in hopes of continuing to contend because he's a good hitter. I countered that with there is an equal or better chance that one or four of those guys who are having years at are likely unsustainable for them at their ages will fall back to earth.
Yeah, you're right. I obviously have a lot invested in the 2015 Braves and want them to win as much as possible. A top 100 prospect would be a great return.
jpx7
Very Flirtatious, but Doubts What Love Is.
You're really arguing against a straw-man here. Nobody's asserting those numbers "don't count," or that said production "didn't happen." The point is that these "fluke years," seemingly-random resurgences, or sudden large leaps in performance-level are harder to bank on: you never know if they'll last a full season—or just, say, through June or July—when the historical evidence points to the player being a worse contributor than he is at the moment. So it's not discounting or discarding production heretofore, or at a given juncture, during the season; it's healthy, informed skepticism as to whether it can be reasonably expected to continue.
Winning ahead of schedule does not destroy the rebuilding plan. The farm is as strong as its been in a decade. They just brought a good deal of talent from theinternational and domestic draft. It has been reported they are all but guaranteed to sign the best international prospect in 15 years.
The scouting department in place has a lot of the same people that kept the farm strong while the team was winning 95 games every season. You don't need to tank like the Astros to be good.
jpx7
Very Flirtatious, but Doubts What Love Is.
What was the team playing with their best hitter?
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