How can anyone not believe in evolution?

BedellBrave said:
Does salt breathe?

An infinite regress isn't going to solve your problem. That's like saying that if I go back far enough I'll come up with some sort of inanimate object that all of a sudden animates itself.

In other words Z, "poof" - And that's okay!
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What evidence do you have of something just poofing. How do you know that it wasn't done another way? What if a rock evolved into a bacteria? Can you prove that cannot happen?
 
zitothebrave said:
What evidence do you have of something just poofing. How do you know that it wasn't done another way? What if a rock evolved into a bacteria? Can you prove that cannot happen?
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When the rock changes to a bacteria - that's "poof." When salt begins breathing, that's "poof." When a pre-biotic molecule becomes a living, replicating biotic molecule, that's "poof." A moment before no life; a moment after, life. That's all I'm saying. Again, I don't see what's gained ridiculing the idea as you did.
 
Gary82 said:
Just because your mind can't understand how something can be living, let alone having self awareness, doesn't mean there is a creator, nor is it evidence that there is/was a creator. I can't understand it either, but I think in time we will figure it out.

We're all star dust, man. Like whoa.
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And that is a faith statement. A dogma, if you will.
 
BedellBrave said:
When the rock changes to a bacteria - that's "poof." When salt begins breathing, that's "poof." When a pre-biotic molecule becomes a living, replicating biotic molecule, that's "poof." A moment before no life; a moment after, life. That's all I'm saying. Again, I don't see what's gained ridiculing the idea as you did.
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You have a different definition of poof. Change over time isn't poof. Poof is something from nothing. It's the idea of magic creating or destroying something from or into nothing. A magician disappearing then reappearing. Not a magician walking from one side of the room to the other. A molecular change over billions of years isn't poof to me. Of course you may have a different definition than me I don't know. What I do know is your attack has failed because your whole basis of attacking my statement was on something you cannot prove or disprove so you moved the goal posts. When my statement was about humans not being there then magically they were there.
 
zitothebrave said:
You have a different definition of poof. Change over time isn't poof. Poof is something from nothing. It's the idea of magic creating or destroying something from or into nothing. A magician disappearing then reappearing. Not a magician walking from one side of the room to the other. A molecular change over billions of years isn't poof to me. Of course you may have a different definition than me I don't know. What I do know is your attack has failed because your whole basis of attacking my statement was on something you cannot prove or disprove so you moved the goal posts. When my statement was about humans not being there then magically they were there.
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First, it's not an "attack." Don't think of it as such. I think we are talking past one another. But I don't think you will concede that there was a moment in time when there wasn't life and a moment later there was. That isn't a controversial statement. Not sure why you think it is.
 
zitothebrave said:
Everything is faith if you look at faith in the loosest way possible.
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Sometimes you don't even have to have the loosest possible definition, you just recognize whether a statement is one that conforms to scientific method or goes beyond it. We all go beyond it. Sometimes we just don't realize that we do and when that lack of awareness is coupled with a poo-pooing of "faith" it can be annoying.
 
BedellBrave said:
First, it's not an "attack." Don't think of it as such. I think we are talking past one another. But I don't think you will concede that there was a moment in time when there wasn't life and a moment later there was. That isn't a controversial statement. Not sure why you think it is.
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Basically some think there is no power out there to create life from non life and evolution has a part of it. Science cannot prove or never will prove when life or consciousness began out of nothing.

Big Bang was rock and gasses and where did IT came from? Carbon is part of life, but how can life and consciousness come from carbon?
 
BedellBrave said:
First, it's not an "attack." Don't think of it as such. I think we are talking past one another. But I don't think you will concede that there was a moment in time when there wasn't life and a moment later there was. That isn't a controversial statement. Not sure why you think it is.
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But that's hardly comparable to what I was talking about and you know that. You're just being contrarian for some reason. Probably cause I said creation myth and you don't like that.
 
zitothebrave said:
But that's hardly comparable to what I was talking about and you know that. You're just being contrarian for some reason. Probably cause I said creation myth and you don't like that.
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But it is. You just don't like that it is. By the way, when any Christian creationist speaks of the creation of living humans they don't talk of creation ex nihilo. That's obviously not the message of Genesis. The creation of matter? Yes, ex nihilo - out of nothing. The creation of living humans? No, fashioned, formed, brought into existence from matter - I'd even say energized matter.

I'd say that's the case with all living things. Others might not.

The word "myth" doesn't bother me - depending on your definition.
 
BedellBrave said:
Sometimes you don't even have to have the loosest possible definition, you just recognize whether a statement is one that conforms to scientific method or goes beyond it. We all go beyond it. Sometimes we just don't realize that we do and when that lack of awareness is coupled with a poo-pooing of "faith" it can be annoying.
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I don't think faith is a bad thing. I think without faith we're largely not human. Whether it's faith in a god(s), faith in your fellow man, or faith that maybe today things will be different. Without faith we wouldn't be rooting for the Braves or any other sports team. Hell at the simplest faith gets us up and gets our butts out the door instead of us just giving up and dying. You can argue that it's a primal nature that's built into us and I'd agree it's part of what made us evolve to be THE apex predator and dominate the globe in a way no other creature has done it. We bend nature to our will (sometimes to entirely disastrous results) but we're great for a reason and I think what you describe as faith (and it is the definition) is a big reason for that.
 
AerchAngel said:
Basically some think there is no power out there to create life from non life and evolution has a part of it. Science cannot prove or never will prove when life or consciousness began out of nothing.

Big Bang was rock and gasses and where did IT came from? Carbon is part of life, but how can life and consciousness come from carbon?
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Yes, and there's really only two answers - either matter is eternal (which in a sense is no answer) or there is a non-material Creator with the power of being.
 
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