If we bring in 2 SP what do they do with prospects

yeezus said:
I'm not convinced Betts will be a 9.6 WAR player every year, or that Bradley and Pedroia can keep up that level of production, and Papi is gone. The team and their offense will remain good, but like 5 guys had potential career years, all at the same time (and all remained healthy). That doesn't happen very often.
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All I'm saying is that Betts' minor league numbers suggest he may still have room to grow offensively and that it shouldn't be seen as abnormal. Obviously it's very unlikely he gets much better, but he could absolutely a least maintain that level of production. His HR numbers increased, but his BB rate was not where it was in the minors, and his BABIP could actually improve as well. Fangraphs had him at 7.8 WAR this year; I don't think that's a number that will be difficult for him to maintain, honestly.

Pedroia had a year that was in line with what he's always put up. He had a down year in 2014, and this represents a bit of a peak in the 2012-2016 stretch (and he's 33, so obviously he may start winding down at any point), but it was certainly not a career year.

Bradley's numbers overall are very close to what he did last year over half a season and don't stand out as strange given his minor league track record. He also may even have room to grow more still.

Bogaerts, as I mentioned, probably still has room to grow offensively. Benintendi is just getting started. Moncada hasn't really gotten started yet.

I will be extremely surprised if 10 years out, we look back and realize 2016 was a career year for Betts, Bogaerts, and Bradley. It wasn't a career year for Pedroia. And they'll be adding Benintendi and Moncada even as they lose Ortiz and Pedroia ages. I'm just saying, I won't be surprised at all if they have a similar offense again very soon. They're built to hit.
 
I see no reason to think Boston will be going anywhere anytime soon. Much like the Cubs, they are built on young talent. Their biggest concern will be starting pitching. Kopech is really the only pitching prospect that is close, other than Brian Johnson who I am not sold on.. And I think Kopech is going to be a lights out closer honestly.
 
yeezus said:
I'm not convinced Betts will be a 9.6 WAR player every year, or that Bradley and Pedroia can keep up that level of production, and Papi is gone. The team and their offense will remain good, but like 5 guys had potential career years, all at the same time (and all remained healthy). That doesn't happen very often.
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Betts could very well be what we expected Heyward to be. And if that's the case then yes he's going to be insanely good every year.
 
smootness said:
All I'm saying is that Betts' minor league numbers suggest he may still have room to grow offensively and that it shouldn't be seen as abnormal. Obviously it's very unlikely he gets much better, but he could absolutely a least maintain that level of production. His HR numbers increased, but his BB rate was not where it was in the minors, and his BABIP could actually improve as well. Fangraphs had him at 7.8 WAR this year; I don't think that's a number that will be difficult for him to maintain, honestly.

Pedroia had a year that was in line with what he's always put up. He had a down year in 2014, and this represents a bit of a peak in the 2012-2016 stretch (and he's 33, so obviously he may start winding down at any point), but it was certainly not a career year.

Bradley's numbers overall are very close to what he did last year over half a season and don't stand out as strange given his minor league track record. He also may even have room to grow more still.

Bogaerts, as I mentioned, probably still has room to grow offensively. Benintendi is just getting started. Moncada hasn't really gotten started yet.

I will be extremely surprised if 10 years out, we look back and realize 2016 was a career year for Betts, Bogaerts, and Bradley. It wasn't a career year for Pedroia. And they'll be adding Benintendi and Moncada even as they lose Ortiz and Pedroia ages. I'm just saying, I won't be surprised at all if they have a similar offense again very soon. They're built to hit.
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They have to hope everyone has amazing years at the same time again, and replace Ortiz's 1.100 OPS. Also, all must remain healthy again. Their team offensive WAR was insanely higher than anyone else's. It's very unlikely everything clicks for them at the same time again.
 
bravesfanMatt said:
I see no reason to think Boston will be going anywhere anytime soon. Much like the Cubs, they are built on young talent. Their biggest concern will be starting pitching. Kopech is really the only pitching prospect that is close, other than Brian Johnson who I am not sold on.. And I think Kopech is going to be a lights out closer honestly.
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I didn't say they are going anywhere; I said their offense won't be this historically good again for a long time.
 
thewupk said:
Betts could very well be what we expected Heyward to be. And if that's the case then yes he's going to be insanely good every year.
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He will be very good every year. I don't see every player of theirs having career years every year from here on out. Some guys will get hurt. Some one player or two will have more down years. I don't expect any team to hit .282 as a team with a .461 slg% anytime soon. Everything clicked for them offensively this year.

They will continue to be a very good offense moving forward. But they don't be this level of historically good for a while. It just doesn't happen that every key players stays healthy and has a career year at the same time. I'll place bets on it.
 
yeezus said:
He will be very good every year. I don't see every player of theirs having career years every year from here on out. Some guys will get hurt. Some one player or two will have more down years. I don't expect any team to hit .282 as a team with a .461 slg% anytime soon. Everything clicked for them offensively this year.

They will continue to be a very good offense moving forward. But they don't be this level of historically good for a while. It just doesn't happen that every key players stays healthy and has a career year at the same time. I'll place bets on it.
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I agree with that as a whole. But Betts with his skill set could challenge Trout as best player in the AL if his offense improves any from what he did this year. And at 24 that's a possibility.
 
thewupk said:
I agree with that as a whole. But Betts with his skill set could challenge Trout as best player in the AL if his offense improves any from what he did this year. And at 24 that's a possibility.
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Yup, agreed. He's great.
 
The Red Sox are really built for that park and they are going to hit, but if you're throwing Clay Bucholz out there in an elimination game, you've got some issues with your starting pitching. And Clay, lose the wino trim beard you've got going on. Growing a playoff beard is a tradition, providing you can actually grow one.
 
It's hard to claim guys had career years before they even reach their prime. They haven't established what level they are expected to hit at. With Betts, Boagarts, Moncada, Benintnend, they have a really nice young core to work on. Im sure they will sign some DH that can smash. They obviously need Price to figure out how to pitch in the postseason, but they have a plethora of middle of the rotation starters.

Obviously 2016 would be tough to live up to though. But, that team is built for the long haul.
 
yeezus said:
They have to hope everyone has amazing years at the same time again, and replace Ortiz's 1.100 OPS. Also, all must remain healthy again. Their team offensive WAR was insanely higher than anyone else's. It's very unlikely everything clicks for them at the same time again.
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But you're basically just comparing them with other teams and assuming that since they were so much better than everyone else, they are unlikely to do that again.

When you compare these players against themselves, you realize that perhaps this wasn't a year where 'everything clicked'. It may just be that this is how good these players are. If you had great bats at every position, you would naturally be much better than anyone else and it wouldn't be because everything just went right for you. Well, Boston has great bats at a lot of positions.
 
gilesfan said:
It's hard to claim guys had career years before they even reach their prime. They haven't established what level they are expected to hit at. With Betts, Boagarts, Moncada, Benintnend, they have a really nice young core to work on. Im sure they will sign some DH that can smash. They obviously need Price to figure out how to pitch in the postseason, but they have a plethora of middle of the rotation starters.

Obviously 2016 would be tough to live up to though. But, that team is built for the long haul.
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This is basically my point. I don't consider a 24-year-old that is putting up a year basically in line with his minor league track record (and perhaps even not quite at that level) to be putting up a 'career year' that they'll be lucky to hit again.
 
smootness said:
But you're basically just comparing them with other teams and assuming that since they were so much better than everyone else, they are unlikely to do that again.

When you compare these players against themselves, you realize that perhaps this wasn't a year where 'everything clicked'. It may just be that this is how good these players are. If you had great bats at every position, you would naturally be much better than anyone else and it wouldn't be because everything just went right for you. Well, Boston has great bats at a lot of positions.
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Ok, then let's bet on the next time they put up a .282 team BA with a .461 SLG%. Wanna wager that they'll be below both of those the next two seasons?
 
smootness said:
This is basically my point. I don't consider a 24-year-old that is putting up a year basically in line with his minor league track record (and perhaps even not quite at that level) to be putting up a 'career year' that they'll be lucky to hit again.
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"Career year" doesn't mean "will be lucky to hit again." He could settle in right around there, but his peak isn't going to be that much better than that.

Their core players all played 147+ games this season, and the one who was their 2nd best offensive player is gone. They need Betts, Pedroia, Benintendi, Bradley, Bogaerts, Hanley, and Moncada to all stay healthy and have near or at-peak seasons at the same time to match this year. That's simply not likely.
 
50PoundHead said:
The Red Sox are really built for that park and they are going to hit, but if you're throwing Clay Bucholz out there in an elimination game, you've got some issues with your starting pitching. And Clay, lose the wino trim beard you've got going on. Growing a playoff beard is a tradition, providing you can actually grow one.
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Bucholz doesn't look like a wino. He looks like a meth head.
 
thewupk said:
Betts could very well be what we expected Heyward to be. And if that's the case then yes he's going to be insanely good every year.
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Yeah... Jason has had his good moments, but man am I frustrated with the hype and lack-of-production with him. Sucks.
 
yeezus said:
"Career year" doesn't mean "will be lucky to hit again." He could settle in right around there, but his peak isn't going to be that much better than that.

Their core players all played 147+ games this season, and the one who was their 2nd best offensive player is gone. They need Betts, Pedroia, Benintendi, Bradley, Bogaerts, Hanley, and Moncada to all stay healthy and have near or at-peak seasons at the same time to match this year. That's simply not likely.
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'Career year' has pretty much always meant 'the best year the player has ever had,' so that's the definition I was going on. If you just mean a level above which the player is rarely going to hit, I might agree more. But I just don't see the kind of years guys like Betts and Bogaerts put up to be unsustainable for them. I don't see anyone who I feel confident is destined for regression outside of Pedroia eventually, though it may not come for another couple years still. So they need to replace Ortiz, sure, but I think Benintendi and Moncada can do that.
 
Somewhat off topic but:

What does everyone think about a Moncada, Devers, Benintendi, Kopech and Basabe trade with the Angels for Mike Trout? Would the Angels do it? Would the Sox?

I bring it up because the NY media was beating the drum that the Angels should trade Trout back mid-season, and the ideal destination surprise, surprise would be the Yankees. What I heard was essentially the whole Angels need a lot of players, Yankees could send them a lot.

My thoughts were it would be hard for the Angels to trade Trout for anyone under any circumstances. But, I would think the Bosox would be in a much better position to make a trade than the Yanks IF there was a trade to be made.

On one hand Trout is likely a future HoF and Boston is one of the few teams that would have little concern about being able to re-sign him. On the other hand, that's a lot of talent to give up for one guy.
 
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