Jeff Wren Fires Back at Shanks

Shanks liked to portray himself as having top shelf access to the organization. If this were true, wouldn't it stand to reason that somebody in The Big City would've wanted to hire him away from that podunk town?
 
Frank Wren being a jerk ect was the story in his time in baltimore too. Which was my problem when he replaced JS initially. There was that issue he had with Cal Ripken i think?
 
GovClintonTyree said:
That's exactly right. And you know, absent the little insider spin we all get and that makes us feel like we've got a real window to what's going on, it's about as easy to take the same facts and reach way different conclusions.

I don't have any problem imagining that some of Frank's mannerisms were those of an asshole. It's a whole lot easier to put that narrative out there when the guy has been deposed.

I think that the alleged incompetence of the farm is overstated, I think he made some incredibly shrewd deals, and I think he did a hell of a job cleaning up the place after the last tenant smeared **** on the walls and took a dump in the middle of the living room. Schuerholz, the other end of the Shanks pitch/catch butt**** pipeline.

Frank won. He could have (probably would have) had burn it down meetings just like the Johns did.

Truthfully, where I think we got some spectacular contributions were from the scout we hired away from San Diego and the guy from New York who got us an unusually fruitful prospect return. getting the guys we got from SD, and getting Banuelos for trash from NY, those were nice deals. But hey, Frank found a lot of value, too. His problem was when he had a pocket full of money.
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Well said, Gov.
 
thethe said:
We are not following those organizations as closely. We do not not know who said what in the Braves organization. It could be a low level scout that has mouthed off to Bill or it could be JS himself. This idea that we have any clue who said what is ridiculous. All we know is that clearly someone within the Braves organization is giving Bill this information.

Apparently someone even like Keith Law can get this info though so Wren had to inspire some strong feelings against him. The scouting community is large and small at the same time. People talk and journalists will listen.
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Then how do you know this happens with every organization?
 
Shanks knows some of the old school guys like Clark, Bridges. Everyone else has either retired or moved to other organizations. Kind of surprised Wren wasted the breath. Bill doesn't have the kind of readership anyone should give a real **** about.
 
Perfect Cell said:
Frank Wren being a jerk ect was the story in his time in baltimore too. Which was my problem when he replaced JS initially. There was that issue he had with Cal Ripken i think?
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He wasn't fired for being a jerk. He was fired for one bad signing, and for leaving Cal Ripken behind for being late to a flight.
 
GovClintonTyree said:
That's exactly right. And you know, absent the little insider spin we all get and that makes us feel like we've got a real window to what's going on, it's about as easy to take the same facts and reach way different conclusions.

I don't have any problem imagining that some of Frank's mannerisms were those of an asshole. It's a whole lot easier to put that narrative out there when the guy has been deposed.

I think that the alleged incompetence of the farm is overstated, I think he made some incredibly shrewd deals, and I think he did a hell of a job cleaning up the place after the last tenant smeared **** on the walls and took a dump in the middle of the living room. Schuerholz, the other end of the Shanks pitch/catch butt**** pipeline.

Frank won. He could have (probably would have) had burn it down meetings just like the Johns did.

Truthfully, where I think we got some spectacular contributions were from the scout we hired away from San Diego and the guy from New York who got us an unusually fruitful prospect return. getting the guys we got from SD, and getting Banuelos for trash from NY, those were nice deals. But hey, Frank found a lot of value, too. His problem was when he had a pocket full of money.
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Yeah, this.

I'm more than willing to give the current regime credit for what they do going forward. So far, there's a lot to like. The hires they made in the scouting department seem to have borne fruit already, and regardless of how one feels about the narrative of some of those folks being alienated by Wren, it's good to have them back.

That doesn't change the fact that JS flailed in his last couple of years running the club, and seemed bitter and outmoded as big chief. Liking the direction of the club =/= buying into the sanctimonious "Braves Way" circle jerk that happened last fall. So, I wish them the best going forward, but I'm not buying the zero-sum Wren-as-Satan narrative.

As for Shanks, his main bit when he had good sources in the org seemed to be breathlessly hyping prospects, then explaining to us which of them had makeup issues after they got dealt or failed. I wouldn't expect that to change. He's irrelevant, but I don't mind seeing him get called on his bull**** publicly, whoever is the source.
 
I'm not convinced that even JS buys into his Braves way bull****. But he knows it plays well and let's be honest, it probably worked to convince the general fan base to accept the rebuild. I think it revitalized him in the end. He worked hard to bring Hart in, who despite his impossible job in Texas after the horrible Arod signing, was very well regarded as a great GM, and imo was actually a pretty damn impressive hire. Hart is good at what he does and recognizes young talent. Braves needed a young whipper snapper GM to be ready to go and Hart has a good eye for that and obviously signed on to Copollelalalalalaalal. Wren wasn't terrible at his job, he was decent, but he was essentially in the wrong place at the wrong time. Ticket sales were meh, so a big piece had to go. He just simply wasn't good enough to keep his job. Fredi could have been that big piece but ole Bobby Cox had his back. Tough to just turn away a hall of fame manager who means a hell of a lot to your fan base.
 
One thing Jeff Wren is wrong about is the significance of Bill Shanks. Does any serious fan still read or listen to him? I'm guessing very, very few.
 
Julio3000 said:
Yeah, this.

I'm more than willing to give the current regime credit for what they do going forward. So far, there's a lot to like. The hires they made in the scouting department seem to have borne fruit already, and regardless of how one feels about the narrative of some of those folks being alienated by Wren, it's good to have them back.

That doesn't change the fact that JS flailed in his last couple of years running the club, and seemed bitter and outmoded as big chief. Liking the direction of the club =/= buying into the sanctimonious "Braves Way" circle jerk that happened last fall. So, I wish them the best going forward, but I'm not buying the zero-sum Wren-as-Satan narrative.

As for Shanks, his main bit when he had good sources in the org seemed to be breathlessly hyping prospects, then explaining to us which of them had makeup issues after they got dealt or failed. I wouldn't expect that to change. He's irrelevant, but I don't mind seeing him get called on his bull**** publicly, whoever is the source.
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Circle-jerk. Heh, heh.
 
Knucksie said:
The know-it-all OP was Exhibit A against the paid Premium Content at Scout. It wasn't even worth chatting with him for free.
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I was never a premium content member at scout. :/ In fact i remember when the division happened the place started to go downhill and i posted very infrequently there at all.

Also im not the OP of this thread either.
 
zitothebrave said:
He wasn't fired for being a jerk. He was fired for one bad signing, and for leaving Cal Ripken behind for being late to a flight.
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Leaving Cal Ripken behind was a great example of his jerkness. The fact that he was a jerk in ATl shouldnt suprise anybody.

The issue i see is how nobody cared about his jerkness when he first replaced JS. We care about it now.
 
Perfect Cell said:
Leaving Cal Ripken behind was a great example of his jerkness. The fact that he was a jerk in ATl shouldnt suprise anybody.

The issue i see is how nobody cared about his jerkness when he first replaced JS. We care about it now.
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Wren gradually did more and more damage with scouts leaving the organization. Maybe it should have been stopped sooner but it's not something that is a fireball offense early on until you sit back and take a look at the total damage.
 
Julio3000 said:
Yeah, this.

I'm more than willing to give the current regime credit for what they do going forward. So far, there's a lot to like. The hires they made in the scouting department seem to have borne fruit already, and regardless of how one feels about the narrative of some of those folks being alienated by Wren, it's good to have them back.

That doesn't change the fact that JS flailed in his last couple of years running the club, and seemed bitter and outmoded as big chief. Liking the direction of the club =/= buying into the sanctimonious "Braves Way" circle jerk that happened last fall. So, I wish them the best going forward, but I'm not buying the zero-sum Wren-as-Satan narrative.

As for Shanks, his main bit when he had good sources in the org seemed to be breathlessly hyping prospects, then explaining to us which of them had makeup issues after they got dealt or failed. I wouldn't expect that to change. He's irrelevant, but I don't mind seeing him get called on his bull**** publicly, whoever is the source.
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Some of that puffery was Shanks's own. The org definitely devoted resources to tapping into scouting in Georgia. Obviously, some top notch talent was mined by the Braves and others (Wainwright, McCann, Posey) and we all know those who didn't cut it. In his book and at Scout, he preached the party line that every Braves prospect was great, especially if Georgia born & bred and grew up a Braves fan.
 
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