Lucas Sims

[NYCBrave]

I thought Simmons went right away along with Heyward and Upton. Thanks for the correction. Another guy who seemed to learn how to hit after he left Atlanta.

As for getting a pitcher back in most deals, I think Tampa Bay has often done that. Whenever they move a decent pitcher for budget reasons, they seem to get a young arm in return. The difference is they appear to do a better job at developing the pitcher they receive in the deal.

On the other end of the spectrum you have the Yankees. During their very brief rebuild they pulled off some masterful trades. Then as they added pieces in recent years, they always seem to know the right guys to include in trades who never amount to much.

 

[TheBravos]

On the other end of the spectrum you have the Yankees. During their very brief rebuild they pulled off some masterful trades. Then as they added pieces in recent years, they always seem to know the right guys to include in trades who never amount to much.

Yes. If the Yankees or Rays had Kimbrel, Simba, Julio and on and on....can’t imagine what they would have gotten.

We did “ok” drafting during the rebuild. We did horrible with out largest assets (besides Hayward/Miller).

 

[zitothebrave]

Coppy was an unmitigated disaster. We are only in the position we are in now because acuna and Albies were signed under the previous regime

I mean I wouldn't call him a total disaster, but I wouldn't call him good. If I acquired like 20 pitching prospects, 2 of them would pan out.

He managed to make 2 defining trades one was resoundingly positive in both directions, and one resoundingly negative in both directions.

Positive was the Heyward trade that wound up getting us Swanson and Inciarte. I admit, I didn't love the first trade. Miller pitched a career year and he turned it into the value I felt like we should have gotten for Heyward. It was a great trade.

Then he followed that up with double dipping in terrible of the Olivera trade. It was a horrible trade to get him, and a horrible trade to send him away. We acquired Kemp and about 44M in owed salary to him for Olivera who was owed something around 30M

 

[Southcack77]

I mean I wouldn't call him a total disaster, but I wouldn't call him good. If I acquired like 20 pitching prospects, 2 of them would pan out.

He managed to make 2 defining trades one was resoundingly positive in both directions, and one resoundingly negative in both directions.

Positive was the Heyward trade that wound up getting us Swanson and Inciarte. I admit, I didn't love the first trade. Miller pitched a career year and he turned it into the value I felt like we should have gotten for Heyward. It was a great trade.

Then he followed that up with double dipping in terrible of the Olivera trade. It was a horrible trade to get him, and a horrible trade to send him away. We acquired Kemp and about 44M in owed salary to him for Olivera who was owed something around 30M

I don't think the Kemp trade was a mistake at all.

 

[bravesfanMatt]

Coppy was a disaster. Any good he did immediately gets cancelled by him cheating and getting restrictions placed on the team. I lump anyone involved in this group too. The 3 johns. Cox any scouting director involved. Anyone with knowledge of the cheating is a complete disaster in my eyes.

 

[Super]

Of all the Coppolella trades, the only one that I thought didn't make sense was the Simmons deal. He was on a reasonable contract and while there were concerns about his hitting (and still are to some extent), the real kicker is that they took Aybar back because they felt they needed an everyday shortstop. I think Newcomb was a decent piece, but of the three guys coming back, he has the only one that made any kind of sense at all. If they would have taken back another legitimate prospect and then dumpster-dove for a shortstop, the logic falls together a bit better.

i feel like guys in the mold of Hechavarria were probably available around that time. i know they wanted a starting SS back, but i wonder how much value Aybar really had in that trade. to your point tho, basically any prospect would've been preferable.

 

[Super]

Yes. If the Yankees or Rays had Kimbrel, Simba, Julio and on and on....can’t imagine what they would have gotten.

We did “ok” drafting during the rebuild. We did horrible with out largest assets (besides Hayward/Miller).

the BJ Upton contract had to go tho. the team was a mess. it was two bad regimens back to back.

 

[Super]

As for getting a pitcher back in most deals, I think Tampa Bay has often done that. Whenever they move a decent pitcher for budget reasons, they seem to get a young arm in return. The difference is they appear to do a better job at developing the pitcher they receive in the deal.

Tampa Bay seems to target the right "sleeper"-type guys and then yeah, develop them much, much better.

 

[Southcack77]

i feel like guys in the mold of Hechavarria were probably available around that time. i know they wanted a starting SS back, but i wonder how much value Aybar really had in that trade. to your point tho, basically any prospect would've been preferable.

I doubt that Aybar affected the prospect package much.

 

[Super]

I doubt that Aybar affected the prospect package much.

yeah. pretty much what i was getting at. i kinda don't think they chose Aybar over something else.