Official 2017 Trade Deadilne Thread

[clvclv]

there are exceptions but yeah it usually takes a few seasons in the majors before a young pitcher hits his prime...i do think we will need to supplement what we currently have in the system

Really likely comes down to the answer to the question that no one seems to want to answer - are we serious about 2018, or is 2019 the target?

If there are any realistic thoughts of competing in 2018 - the brass most likely will have to be open to rolling the dice with some of the young arms and willing to deal with the consequences. The holes this year are still going to be holes next spring as well - and the biggest one is still likely to be at 3B. Given the lack of return anybody thinks we get for Adams, it's hard to disagree with those willing to keep him and at least let Freeman try it over there for the rest of this season - if the "answer" is currently in our system somewhere, he's at least 2 years away. I liken the current club to the Rockies so far this season - they rolled the dice with all their inexperienced young arms this season, backed them up with an absolutely loaded lineup and really good pen, and it's worked for awhile. Can they keep it going? It looks like they're starting to run out of gas, but maybe it's just a blip. Our "almost ready" guys - Newcomb/Sims/Weigel/Wright/Allard/Soroka - are better than theirs IMO, but is the brass willing to start all those clocks at some point in the second half or next spring AND live with the growing pains? Who knows? They don't seem to want to answer that question. JMO, but if they are it's time to move Colon, Dickey, and Garcia for whatever you can get for them and commit to getting the kids' feet wet during the second half (at least Sims and Weigel if he's not done for the year) - and they have to be open to Wright, Soroka, and possibly Allard in the rotation next season regardless of their ages. To me, if the answer is that they are you keep Adams as a bench bat and find a way to get him regular ABs (defense be damned) spelling Freddie and Kemp, spend the only money this winter to sign Moustakas to play 3B, and just go out and try to bludgeon everybody to death. Deal with defense in the 8th and 9th innings AFTER you've put 5 or 6 runs on the board.

While it certainly makes much more sense to be patient for one more year and promote EVERYBODY in 2019, the regular fan in everyone still has to want to be better next season - we've been bad for too long already. Although some folks like to bitch about anyone ever mentioning the thought, what's even more fun is dreaming on the idea that the brass would do what it takes to go get Machado and go full bore from within...

 

[clvclv]

I wouldn't offer any of our top guys in any deal for a starting pitcher. But I would offer a package of 2 or 3 from the next group of prospects. Guys like Touki, Mueller, Suarez, Demeritte, Riley, Sims. Keep in mind that the trade value of some of the pitchers like Cueto and Samardzija is held down to varying extents by their contracts. We would probably not have to give up an elite prospect. And if that turned out to be the price I would pass.

If Touki and say Ricardo Sanchez nets you Samardzija - sign me up. Just don't think it does.

 

[chop2chip]

Thanks DOB for starting another fire that won't go anywhere but will still pollute every thread on this board.

According to David O'Brien of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the Braves remain interested in trading for White Sox left-hander Jose Quintana or Rays right-hander Chris Archer.

It's no surprise, as the Braves were linked to both pitchers during the offseason. O'Brien hears that the club had scouts at Sonny Gray's start on Sunday, but they are more interested in landing either Quintana or Archer. The Braves aren't a contender, so they are looking for a pitcher under team control for multiple seasons. Both pitchers qualify. Quintana might be a more realistic target, as the Rays have a legitimate shot to win this year. Either way, the price tag would be substantial.

Source: Atlanta Journal-ConstitutionJun 27 - 2:21 PM

 

[CJ9]

Thanks DOB for starting another fire that won't go anywhere but will still pollute every thread on this board.

According to David O'Brien of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the Braves remain interested in trading for White Sox left-hander Jose Quintana or Rays right-hander Chris Archer.
It's no surprise, as the Braves were linked to both pitchers during the offseason. O'Brien hears that the club had scouts at Sonny Gray's start on Sunday, but they are more interested in landing either Quintana or Archer. The Braves aren't a contender, so they are looking for a pitcher under team control for multiple seasons. Both pitchers qualify. Quintana might be a more realistic target, as the Rays have a legitimate shot to win this year. Either way, the price tag would be substantial.
Source: Atlanta Journal-ConstitutionJun 27 - 2:21 PM

Ugh, not this again.

 

[bravesfanMatt]

Thanks DOB for starting another fire that won't go anywhere but will still pollute every thread on this board.

According to David O'Brien of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the Braves remain interested in trading for White Sox left-hander Jose Quintana or Rays right-hander Chris Archer.
It's no surprise, as the Braves were linked to both pitchers during the offseason. O'Brien hears that the club had scouts at Sonny Gray's start on Sunday, but they are more interested in landing either Quintana or Archer. The Braves aren't a contender, so they are looking for a pitcher under team control for multiple seasons. Both pitchers qualify. Quintana might be a more realistic target, as the Rays have a legitimate shot to win this year. Either way, the price tag would be substantial.
Source: Atlanta Journal-ConstitutionJun 27 - 2:21 PM

DOB is a tool.. Bowman may be goofy and looks like a thumb.. but I like him so much better. DOB needs to hop on his hog and ride off with Frediot...

 

[jpx7]

Really likely comes down to the answer to the question that no one seems to want to answer - are we serious about 2018, or is 2019 the target?

I've been saying for at least a year that the team probably can't realistically, and thus probably shouldn't, try to compete in 2018, meaning moves should be made foremost with an eye on 2019. I believe several others have voiced similar thoughts, so I wouldn't say that "no one seems to want to answer" that question.

 

[Russ2dollas]

Thanks DOB for starting another fire that won't go anywhere but will still pollute every thread on this board.

According to David O'Brien of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the Braves remain interested in trading for White Sox left-hander Jose Quintana or Rays right-hander Chris Archer.
It's no surprise, as the Braves were linked to both pitchers during the offseason. O'Brien hears that the club had scouts at Sonny Gray's start on Sunday, but they are more interested in landing either Quintana or Archer. The Braves aren't a contender, so they are looking for a pitcher under team control for multiple seasons. Both pitchers qualify. Quintana might be a more realistic target, as the Rays have a legitimate shot to win this year. Either way, the price tag would be substantial.
Source: Atlanta Journal-ConstitutionJun 27 - 2:21 PM

we should be interested.

we also shouldn't pay a bunch. therefore we won't get them.

Any 3+ WAR player that has a chance to be available I'd want us to call on and see what the price is.

 

[Enscheff]

LOL

That's all.

 

[Enscheff]

The Braves are like that guy who spends thousands of dollars filling his garage with the best tools, and then pays to have his oil changed.

Barves way!!

 

[striker42]

If Archer won't break the bank then we should absolutely be in on him. He's a long term piece. Problem is I don't see any way we get around giving up some prospects that hurt. If I'm the Rays I ask for Acuna, Allard, and Newk plus some other pieces.

 

[clvclv]

I've been saying for at least a year that the team probably can't realistically, and thus probably shouldn't, try to compete in 2018, meaning moves should be made foremost with an eye on 2019. I believe several others have voiced similar thoughts, so I wouldn't say that "no one seems to want to answer" that question.

The "no one" I'm referring to is the brass. While understandable, they aren't really in a position to say "we're going to tank for one more year and then go wide open" like Theo did - unlike Wrigley, SunTrust wouldn't likely ever be more than half-full at any point in 2018 if Coppy said "we're one year early" - even if they are. The hints are still there that they want to win now and next season - keeping Adams, trying Freeman at 3B, still considering trading for Archer or Quintana, etc..

Does it make more sense to hold off one more year before making a flurry of moves that you expect to make you an instant contender? Sure. Unfortunately typical fans aren't interested in waiting "one more year" - Cubs fans heard it so many times and had it never happen that they weren't disappointed anymore...it was just business as usual.

If those "average" fans knew what posters here know about our system and were assured that "we're going to sign Machado to hit behind Freddie and promote Wright, Soroka, Allard, and Acuna (and maybe even Maitan) in 2019", you'd probably be able to get a lot more people on board.

The danger some think comes with falling into that "one more year" trap is that you fall into a perpetual rebuild - like the Rays - and NEVER pull the trigger and go for it.

 

[msstate7]

If Archer won't break the bank then we should absolutely be in on him. He's a long term piece. Problem is I don't see any way we get around giving up some prospects that hurt. If I'm the Rays I ask for Acuna, Allard, and Newk plus some other pieces.

There's no way I'd give them those 3.

 

[striker42]

There's no way I'd give them those 3.

Me either. But that's what I'd ask for if I was the Rays GM.

 

[nsacpi]

I've been saying for at least a year that the team probably can't realistically, and thus probably shouldn't, try to compete in 2018, meaning moves should be made foremost with an eye on 2019. I believe several others have voiced similar thoughts, so I wouldn't say that "no one seems to want to answer" that question.

Projecting from this moment in time, I would say we project to be better in 2019 than 2018. But not dramatically better. And I would not apply a significant discount to moves that improve our chances of adding a win in 2018 versus adding a win in 2019.

 

[smootness]

If Archer won't break the bank then we should absolutely be in on him. He's a long term piece. Problem is I don't see any way we get around giving up some prospects that hurt. If I'm the Rays I ask for Acuna, Allard, and Newk plus some other pieces.

Acuna is basically untouchable at this point, or should be. I'd ask for everything, but realistically the most I could see us being willing to give up would be something like Albies/Soroka/Newcomb. And even then I wouldn't like it.

 

[Enscheff]

Injecting some reality into the idea of acquiring Archer...

Smokey Joe
4:07 What would it take for the Braves to get Archer (if he gets moved)?
Steve Adams
4:08 A ton. It would probably genuinely infuriate Braves fans simply because of the level of prospects they'd have to give up. Start with Albies, Newcomb, add from there. I'd imagine we're talking a package of five players with three really notable headliners. I'd expect the Rays to ask for Swanson as well.
Archer is on such a ridiculously friendly contract and is so good that it's hard for me to see Tampa Bay making the move at all

There is simply no way the Braves are in position to make such a dramatic "win now" move.

 

[smootness]

Injecting some reality into the idea of acquiring Archer...

Smokey Joe
4:07 What would it take for the Braves to get Archer (if he gets moved)?
Steve Adams
4:08 A ton. It would probably genuinely infuriate Braves fans simply because of the level of prospects they'd have to give up. Start with Albies, Newcomb, add from there. I'd imagine we're talking a package of five players with three really notable headliners. I'd expect the Rays to ask for Swanson as well.
Archer is on such a ridiculously friendly contract and is so good that it's hard for me to see Tampa Bay making the move at all

There is simply no way the Braves are in position to make such a dramatic "win now" move.

Correct, and this is why it's generally so difficult to move these guys with really good contracts. Sale was only moved because the Red Sox had a loaded system and tons and tons of cash with which to buy players. Most organizations can't afford to give up a guy like Moncada for anything.

There's no way we're giving up a package of 5 players with 3 of them top guys, or even entertaining the thought of giving up Swanson, for Archer. So the Rays have signed him to a great deal but have also backed themselves into a corner in a way. If they give him up for less than he's worth, they get ridiculed. But if they hang onto him, how does that really help them?

 

[Enscheff]

Correct, and this is why it's generally so difficult to move these guys with really good contracts. Sale was only moved because the Red Sox had a loaded system and tons and tons of cash with which to buy players. Most organizations can't afford to give up a guy like Moncada for anything.

There's no way we're giving up a package of 5 players with 3 of them top guys, or even entertaining the thought of giving up Swanson, for Archer. So the Rays have signed him to a great deal but have also backed themselves into a corner in a way. If they give him up for less than he's worth, they get ridiculed. But if they hang onto him, how does that really help them?

The simple answer is this isn't the year to trade Archer. It isn't their MO anyways...which is to trade pitchers with 1-2 years of control remaining. It is an excellent plan, and there is no reason to alter it.

Archer probably won't be traded until the 2019/2020 offseason.

All this silly talk is exactly like the talk about the Braves signing Greinke, or Price, or Lester, or trading for Sale. It isn't going to happen, but these same impossible scenarios keep coming up year after year after year. And every time, folks fall for it like clockwork.

But, but, but, this time is different because....reasons! No, it isn't different, just like it wasn't different any of the other times. The Braves are still the same team with the same resources.

 

[clvclv]

Acuna is basically untouchable at this point, or should be. I'd ask for everything, but realistically the most I could see us being willing to give up would be something like Albies/Soroka/Newcomb. And even then I wouldn't like it.

Like it? Not at all. Think about it? Probably. Archer would simply be a beast in the NL.

If we were able to keep Acuna, Allard, Wright, etc. don't you at least have to consider it?

If an Archer, Folty, Wright, Teheran, Allard/Gohara/whomever rotation isn't good enough to make you a legitimate contender, will you ever have one that does???

Archer's so cheap, you can go spend the money you spent on veteran SPs this year on a "now" bat with Markakis' and Kemp's money coming off the books as the monster free-agent class gets here.

 

[Freshmaker]

If the Rays ask for Acuna AND Newcomb, Coppy will hang up with such force that everything within a 10 mile radius of the office will be obliterated