PSA

Social conditioning much?

It was violent video games, goths, and trench coats after Columbine. Now it's 'edgy' white boys who watch YouTube videos about guns and wear ****ty white on-ear headphones.

How about focusing on what might lead a young person down this kind of road? Did we already give up on anti-bullying measures? Too difficult I guess - so now we alienate and isolate these individuals even more.

Embarrassing.
 
Jeez, Evan can't catch a break. Finally tracks down the girl after who knows how many weeks and just as he's making his moves this asshole storms the gym with a gun.
 
Hawk said:
Social conditioning much?

It was violent video games, goths, and trench coats after Columbine. Now it's 'edgy' white boys who watch YouTube videos about guns and wear ****ty white on-ear headphones.

How about focusing on what might lead a young person down this kind of road? Did we already give up on anti-bullying measures? Too difficult I guess - so now we alienate and isolate these individuals even more.



Embarrassing.
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I think the heart of the video hits right on this point. Recognize signs and get the kid some help. As per anti-bullying measures, the conservatives here in Minnesota would just love to repeal what was put in place a few years ago as they view it as being too accepting of gay kids.
 
50PoundHead said:
I think the heart of the video hits right on this point. Recognize signs and get the kid some help. As per anti-bullying measures, the conservatives here in Minnesota would just love to repeal what was put in place a few years ago as they view it as being too accepting of gay kids.
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At the root of it all though, what are the signs?

How does the PSA enumerate on them in a clear way?

We were all about violent video games after Columbine. What changed? 35 seconds in for the most relevant footage.


This game came out less than a decade later. And the Columbine kids played ... Doom.

At some point, we've simply got to take a different approach to causation. The Sandy Hook Promise group's method is particularly lazy. We're lead to be wary of students who are different. Which makes me wonder if the 'brains' behind this have stepped into a school at any point over the past decade.

As for anti-bullying, I don't see why it should be legislated in any way beyond funding.
 
Hawk said:
At the root of it all though, what are the signs?

How does the PSA enumerate on them in a clear way?

We were all about violent video games after Columbine. What changed? 35 seconds in for the most relevant footage.


This game came out less than a decade later. And the Columbine kids played ... Doom.

At some point, we've simply got to take a different approach to causation. The Sandy Hook Promise group's method is particularly lazy. We're lead to be wary of students who are different. Which makes me wonder if the 'brains' behind this have stepped into a school at any point over the past decade.

As for anti-bullying, I don't see why it should be legislated in any way beyond funding.
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I work with school psychologists and school social workers. They could provide you with a veritable Encyclopedia Britannica of warning signs.
 
50PoundHead said:
I work with school psychologists and school social workers. They could provide you with a veritable Encyclopedia Britannica of warning signs.
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And yet, after virtually every school shooting, the question is asked; how did we miss the signs? Maybe because there are too many. Maybe because every case is different excepting the most egregiously psychotic.

I keep harping on this, but my concern is that 'troubled teen' becomes the new ADHD. Over-prescribed and over-medicated.

Social structures need to be analyzed, schools need to essentially force inclusivity - at a basic human level - beyond race and sexual orientation.

Makes kids sit in assigned seats a lunch. Play group games at recess. Encourage (and incentivize) intramural after school activities. Destroy school popularity gauges.

But don't blame the weird kid, label him as flawed. Don't write him off and drive him further in a dark direction.
 
This was some grade A bull**** designed to justify their zero-sense policies. I havent seen the movie minority report but this seems a lot like that. Punish people for crimes before they commit them. Except millions of kids will give multiple warning signs despite being no risk whatsoever. Is it worth it to suspend or expel millions of kids because 1 of them might shoot up a school? I have never read of a single case where zero tolerance stopped a school shooting. Not one. In fact I bet one of these days one of these kids they wrongly expel will actually come back and shoot up a school. I;m sure they will say that justified their actions but as far as I am concerned they will have deserved it.

The single biggest thing we can do to stop school shootings are to not post the name and picture of the shooters all over. A lot of these people do this to be famous. Even if its for something horrible. Every news media knows this. Those ****ers want more school shootings. Its great ratings for them.
 
50PoundHead said:
I think the heart of the video hits right on this point. Recognize signs and get the kid some help. As per anti-bullying measures, the conservatives here in Minnesota would just love to repeal what was put in place a few years ago as they view it as being too accepting of gay kids.
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I think I see it more the way you see it than the others.

To me, the video made a very clear point of ticking off various warning signs. It showed a scene in the background of bullying along with the watching violent videos, sitting by himself, shooting a fake gun at the teacher, etc. It may have as well have been a re-enactment of Columbine because all of those things were contributing factors to that massacre. I don't think it seeks to further alienate the "outsiders," but it's more an appeal for people to pay attention, reach out and say something if you see something like a kid being bullied. How many times has it been the star quarterback or the valedictorian? Maybe they will make more videos that directly call for more a stronger emphasis on school counseling. Not every single like this can be prevented, but we can try. I can certainly understand why the families of little 6-year-old kids who were blown away would be involved in this kind of effort.
 
cajunrevenge said:
This was some grade A bull**** designed to justify their zero-sense policies. I havent seen the movie minority report but this seems a lot like that. Punish people for crimes before they commit them. Except millions of kids will give multiple warning signs despite being no risk whatsoever. Is it worth it to suspend or expel millions of kids because 1 of them might shoot up a school? I have never read of a single case where zero tolerance stopped a school shooting. Not one. In fact I bet one of these days one of these kids they wrongly expel will actually come back and shoot up a school. I;m sure they will say that justified their actions but as far as I am concerned they will have deserved it.

The single biggest thing we can do to stop school shootings are to not post the name and picture of the shooters all over. A lot of these people do this to be famous. Even if its for something horrible. Every news media knows this. Those ****ers want more school shootings. Its great ratings for them.
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Never have understood this line of thinking. Are they just supposed to not cover it, not report who did it? Act like the people didn't exist? Almost every single one of these shootings are a person feeling immense pain and wanting others to feel it. And some kind of vengeance. Getting their name on the news is probably a few spots down the list, especially since they often wind up dead from suicide.
 
bravesnumberone said:
Never have understood this line of thinking. Are they just supposed to not cover it, not report who did it? Act like the people didn't exist? Almost every single one of these shootings are a person feeling immense pain and wanting others to feel it. And some kind of vengeance. Getting their name on the news is probably a few spots down the list, especially since they often wind up dead from suicide.
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I was listening to a freakonmics podcast the other day about suicide... and they determined in a different country that the most effective (i.e. slowing down suicide) was the media portraying the suicide victim as a "loser."

I know that sounds pretty harsh. But one of the governments tried a bunch of different methods and that was the most effective. The idea that after you kill yourself, you're going to be portrayed as a loser to your family and friends was more of a deterrent than a sympathetic message from the media.
 
bravesnumberone said:
Never have understood this line of thinking. Are they just supposed to not cover it, not report who did it? Act like the people didn't exist? Almost every single one of these shootings are a person feeling immense pain and wanting others to feel it. And some kind of vengeance. Getting their name on the news is probably a few spots down the list, especially since they often wind up dead from suicide.
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[video=youtube;PezlFNTGWv4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PezlFNTGWv4[/video]

The media can cover it without naming the attacker or giving out their name. Obviously nothing will stop all school shootings but I think the media coverage is why its more of a problem now than ever. I bet a lot of these people get the idea from watching the non stop news coverage. Your right in that they want to inflict pain and suffering, and every time they see it on the news they fantasize about doing it themselves. These arent rational people having rational thoughts.
 
My opinion on this isn't popular, but I'll state it anyway.
Stop trying to end all violence in schools. School fights are a pressure valve. When you clamp it closed, things blow up.
I'm not saying to allow all out gang fights in the halls, but the way we prosecute this now is ridiculous. Two sixth graders can get in an argument, and if one of them throws a punch they both get to sit in a squad car. I've seen it happen. It's absurd.

At some point we have to accept that kids will be kids, and especially that boys will be boys. Confining them inside all day with other immature kids of the same ages and hormone levels is going to cause some flare ups. i would rather that flare up be a schoolyard fight where the likely outcome is a bloody lip, instead of some kid holding that in until he comes in with his momma's gun.
 
Oh yeah I agree with that. Its part of the school to prison pipeline. You get normal kids arrested for doing normal kid stuff and start them on probation. Then maybe they smoke a joint somewhere and fail a probation drug test. Then they go to juvenile detention where they develop serious mental issues. Remember, if you treat your kids they like they do the kids in juvenile detention you would be arrested for child abuse and negligence. Now the kid has spent 6 months in juvenile detention when he gets out. He struggles to readjust to the world. He is probably a grade or two behind his friends now. He is labeled a troubled child. He knows one slight slip up and he could go back to juvenile detention. Now he struggles in school, finds it hard to interact with normal kids in a normal environment. He used to be on the wrestling team but cant go back now that he is a criminal. Then he goes home and puts a shotgun to his head and blows his brains out.

[video=youtube;2zB8i6ftPU0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2zB8i6ftPU0[/video]
 
I think the problem with the "let 'em go" philosophy is that in the litigation-happy US, schools are on the hook for pretty much everything that happens within their jurisdiction (including co-curricular and extra-curricular activities). Taxpayers get mad enough when they believe their tax dollars are going for curricular decisions they don't agree with. They really get steamed when taxpayer dollars go to pay settlements. Thus, schools insure themselves to the hilt and try to clamp down on anything that might lead to a courthouse door.
 
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