REAL FOOTBALL Thread

zitothebrave said:
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I have to imagine this conversation was about how bad they wish they were on the same team right now.
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Yeah go ahead and get Fitzgerald. That will solve the issues.
 
sturg33 said:
You are really high on Ryan and really low on Stafford - yet Stafford has had a better start to his career. Stafford is a full 3 years younger than Ryan. And Ryan has really gone into elite status the last two years (age 27, 28), which Stafford is still a couple years away from.
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That's one of the dumbest ways to compare players.

You're comparing Ryan's rookie season to Stafford's 3-5. Ignoring of course the use of one of the worst stats there is.

On their careers Ryan throws more TDs, throws less picks, and moves the ball further down field every time he drops back. in the advanced metrics, Ryan trumps Stafford in just about any way except throwing the ball the most times of any QB.
 
NinersSBChamps said:
Yeah go ahead and get Fitzgerald. That will solve the issues.
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Wouldn't solve all the issues, but having Harry Douglas as your 1 is not a good way to play a season. What's funny is some team is gonna pay a **** ton for Harry Douglas cause of how he's putting up numbers now because of how awesome Ryan is.
 
zitothebrave said:
That's one of the dumbest ways to compare players.

You're comparing Ryan's rookie season to Stafford's 3-5. Ignoring of course the use of one of the worst stats there is.

On their careers Ryan throws more TDs, throws less picks, and moves the ball further down field every time he drops back. in the advanced metrics, Ryan trumps Stafford in just about any way except throwing the ball the most times of any QB.
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Or I'm comparing Stafford's same age/first 3 full seasons to Ryan's same age/first 3 seasons.

In my opinion (could be wrong), age is a bigger factor than years. Stafford was throwing passes in the NFL at the same time Ryan was doinating college teams. Of course, Stafford was pretty awful his rookie year, which brings down his numbers.

Then, Stafford has been on SIGNIFICANTLY worse teams throughout his entire career - meaning, we're always losing so we're always throwing.

Lastsly, Stafford has had far fewer weapons. By weapons I mean, OL, RB, and Wr. Yes, he has had MegaTron - but until this year, no running game and no pass protection makes it difficult to be consistently awesome.

My whole point is, Stafford is pretty darn awesome. He is only 25 (same age as Collin Kapernick) - he's only going to continue to get better. I believe Aaron Rodgers didn't even start until he was 27/28. Stafford is ahead of the curve.
 
I'm a big Stafford fan. You need a big arm in today's NFL to be elite. The mental aspect will continue to grow for Stafford. Sure he has Megatron but a big receiver like that is best with a big armed qb. I don't believe a guy like Ryan could fully utilize Megatron's ability
 
I love the excuses, they're so funny. I find it amazing that no one in the NFL but Matt Ryan has weapons. Ha

Stafford has the greatest WR talent of all time on his team. Of all freaking time. Megatron is more talented than Moss because he's a better after reception threat. But poor Matt Stafford hasn't had a running game.

Lions Running efficiency rank by season

2009 - 28
2010 - 24
2011 - 16
2012 - 12

So he had 2 years of ineffective running and 2 years of league average efficiency.

Compare it to Ryan's running game

2008 - 18
2009 - 13
2010 - 23
2011 - 23
2012 - 30

Maybe I should cry about Ryan's excuses. Or I can hope instead my QB isn't a moron and learns how to adjust to no running game and offensive line.

I still am laughing at how he had no wide receivers. What do you expect numbers of a second WR to look like? Unless you have a ROddy White type as your 2, or you have no true 1, your 2 is gonna post 600-800 yards tops. When you have a receiver who has 3 straight seasons with 100 y/g you cannot expect a number 2 to put up great numbers. Roddy and Julio eat from each other. If Ryan just has one odds are they're 1500+ yard receivers like Megatron is. But having more than one lets him spread it out more.
 
thethe said:
I'm a big Stafford fan. You need a big arm in today's NFL to be elite. The mental aspect will continue to grow for Stafford. Sure he has Megatron but a big receiver like that is best with a big armed qb. I don't believe a guy like Ryan could fully utilize Megatron's ability
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You don't watch Megatron play too often then. Most of his catches are intermediate grabs. And Ryan has a guy who's just as dangerous on Deepballs or jumpballs in Julio and before going down Julio was well on his way to a great season. His 116 YPG would put him just behind where Megatron is this year after his bonkers game yesterday. What makes Megatron deadly is he can play as any type of WR. He's got the physical size that you cannot dominate him in the short game, he's faster than most CBs, he can outjump just about anyone. Julio doesn't have that first quality. He's fast and awesomely athletic and can jump like a freak, but he's not an amazing receiver in all aspects like Megatron. The only thing that would hurt Megatron with Ryan is he'd get less targets, but he'd also get more catchable balls cause Ryan doesn't make as many errant passes as Stafford.
 
That's BS. Ryan is awesome no doubt but he can't attack the defense down field like Stafford can.
 
Stafford is a thrower. Ryan is a passer. There is a difference. Having the greatest WR ever to walk the earth that beats triple teams on the reg is a HUGE asset. It makes Stafford look really good, when in all actuality he is just tossing it up. Daunte Culpepper comes to mind... Stafford has a HUGE arm. He isn't near the top in being an all around QB in the NFL.

I am not saying that Stafford couldn't be a league avg QB without him, but thats his ceiling. He would throw a litany of picks if he had to force balls into lesser receivers like he does Calvin.
 
Tapate50 said:
Stafford is a thrower. Ryan is a passer. There is a difference. Having the greatest WR ever to walk the earth that beats triple teams on the reg is a HUGE asset. It makes Stafford look really good, when in all actuality he is just tossing it up. Daunte Culpepper comes to mind... Stafford has a HUGE arm. He isn't near the top in being an all around QB in the NFL.

I am not saying that Stafford couldn't be a league avg QB without him, but thats his ceiling. He would throw a litany of picks if he had to force balls into lesser receivers like he does Calvin.
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You mean like the game where Calvin didn't play, and he threw 0 picks?

Truth be told, he throws most of his picks because of Calvin bc he is trying to force the ball to him.

By the way, Calvin had 14 catches on 16 targets yesterday, including a dropped pass. OMG STAFFORD SO INACCURATE!
 
zitothebrave said:
I love the excuses, they're so funny. I find it amazing that no one in the NFL but Matt Ryan has weapons. Ha

Stafford has the greatest WR talent of all time on his team. Of all freaking time. Megatron is more talented than Moss because he's a better after reception threat. But poor Matt Stafford hasn't had a running game.

Lions Running efficiency rank by season

2009 - 28
2010 - 24
2011 - 16
2012 - 12

So he had 2 years of ineffective running and 2 years of league average efficiency.

Compare it to Ryan's running game

2008 - 18
2009 - 13
2010 - 23
2011 - 23
2012 - 30

Maybe I should cry about Ryan's excuses. Or I can hope instead my QB isn't a moron and learns how to adjust to no running game and offensive line.

I still am laughing at how he had no wide receivers. What do you expect numbers of a second WR to look like? Unless you have a ROddy White type as your 2, or you have no true 1, your 2 is gonna post 600-800 yards tops. When you have a receiver who has 3 straight seasons with 100 y/g you cannot expect a number 2 to put up great numbers. Roddy and Julio eat from each other. If Ryan just has one odds are they're 1500+ yard receivers like Megatron is. But having more than one lets him spread it out more.
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I don't know what you're getting so upset about. I'm not saying Ryan is bad, in fact I'm saying the complete opposite.

I just don't get the Stafford hate. Dude is 25 freaking years old, is the fastest QB ever to 50,000 yards (yes I know he throws more - but the other top 5 are HOFers), has a rocket launcher for an arm is a really smart kid.

If "clutch" is your thing, Stafford is the highest rated 4th quarter QB over the last couple years.

I just don't think it's a good argument to say, "well yeah, he has great numbers, but he has Megatron so they don't count."

By the way, just for perspective:

Andrew Luck - 24 years old
RG3 - 23
Russell Wilson - 24 years old
Collin Kaepernick - 25 years old
Matt Stafford - 25 years old
 
sturg33 said:
You mean like the game where Calvin didn't play, and he threw 0 picks?

Truth be told, he throws most of his picks because of Calvin bc he is trying to force the ball to him.

By the way, Calvin had 14 catches on 16 targets yesterday, including a dropped pass. OMG STAFFORD SO INACCURATE!
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Wow what an impressive sample!

How do you come up with such a genius example?
 
zitothebrave said:
You don't watch Megatron play too often then..
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You have an amazing talent to be able to watch every Falcons game and every Lions game. I'm guessing you just see the highlights of his amazing catches, and not all the needle threaded passes that are thrown where only he can catch them.

But if you're unwilling to take my word for it - a guy who has seen every Lions game since Stafford was drafted, so be it. But I can honestly say the progression of Stafford has been very good, and this year he has been better than ever. He just doesn't make the same mistakes as he used to, and he will only get better as he keeps getting more polished
 
sturg33 said:
You mean like the game where Calvin didn't play, and he threw 0 picks?

Truth be told, he throws most of his picks because of Calvin bc he is trying to force the ball to him.

By the way, Calvin had 14 catches on 16 targets yesterday, including a dropped pass. OMG STAFFORD SO INACCURATE!
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So he even misfires to the greatest WR of all time a lot? Well THAT proves his accuracy.

Look, Ive watched Stafford every play since he took his first snaps at UGA. He is what he is. He has a huge arm. It isn't a knock, but he hovers at a 60% completion rate. Which is about 1% below average for the NFL last I checked.

Without Calvin, that completion percentage drops a few points. He has a shoe in HOF WR (Who could retire tomorrow and be a first ballot guy) that will likely never be rivaled. Calvin catches everything, and in triple coverage. This can't be disputed. Stafford gets away with it because he has Calvin. Period. It isn't a knock. He would be very solid with other weapons, but nothing near the top 5.
 
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