I really fail to see how this outcome is a major victory for Trump. The report basically said that they welcomed the help from Russia and failed to do anything about Russian interference but stopped short of actively assisting Russia in the process, and that Trump tried basically everything to obstruct justice and people just stopped him from going too far off the rails. That’s not exactly a reason to celebrate.
Russia Collusion Scandal (aka A Leftist fantasy)
- Thread starter Runnin
- Start date
I really fail to see how this outcome is a major victory for Trump. The report basically said that they welcomed the help from Russia and failed to do anything about Russian interference but stopped short of actively assisting Russia in the process, and that Trump tried basically everything to obstruct justice and people just stopped him from going too far off the rails. That’s not exactly a reason to celebrate.
Welcomed help from Russia (Steele Dossier - DNC/HRC)
Failed to do anything about Russian intereference (Obama administration)
Obstruct Justice at all ends (Deleting e-mails after subpoena / Using bleach bit to remove data / Smashing phones with a hammer)
Yeah - Out of everything that has happened the last 3 years Trump is the guilty one. Lets just gloss over the unprecedented amount of cooperation the Trump administration had with the Muller investigation in terms of documents turned over and the lack of executive privilege exercised in any facet of the investigation or the release of the report.
Give me a damn break. You guys are going to be pathetic and push this conspiracy for another 2 years to drive down approval ratings for 2020 which is the only reason you are knowingly pushing a flase narrative. Its disgraceful.
sturg33
I
I'm still confused what y'all want to happen here.
It is abundantly clear in the report that Mueller concluded there was no conclusion.
OK... what do you want to happen? Another investigation? impeachment for obstruction? Or move on?
Those are the only three options but yall's obsession with the collusion stuff is crazy.
It is abundantly clear in the report that Mueller concluded there was no conclusion.
OK... what do you want to happen? Another investigation? impeachment for obstruction? Or move on?
Those are the only three options but yall's obsession with the collusion stuff is crazy.
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
You seem to be misinformed about what the report says about "collusion."
What Mueller said the facts did not establish was an explicit agreement to coordinate. However there was a clear understanding by both parties that they stood to benefit by helping each other. The campaign knew about the help the Russians were providing and welcomed it and sought to weaponize it for maximum effect.
The quote from Giuliani is broadly consistent with the welcoming attitude that Trump had with respect to the activities undertaken by the Russians.
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sturg33
I
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
I'll ask you again. What exactly do you want to happen here? You have 3 options
1) I start with the observation that this is a discussion board. You have asked me several times what I want to happen here. I believe participation in a discussion board does not require that I state a wish for what will happen. Many people have posted in this thread and will continue to do so.
2) In post #8470 I offer the observation that you are confused about what the Mueller report said with respect to "collusion." You respond with several highlighted items from the report that do not contain the word collusion. Mueller explains in his report that "collusion is not a specific offense or theory of liability found in the United States code."
3) He does state in his report that the facts do not establish (to the standard necessary for prosecution) that there was an agreement to coordinate between the campaign and the Russians.
4) The facts do show that the campaign and the Russians each came to understand that they would benefit from helping each other. The campaign knew about the Russians' activities to influence the outcome of the elections. The campaign welcomed those activities. The campaign sought information about the hacked emails to maximize their effect. The quote in post #8468 from Giuliani expresses once again the campaign's attitude.
5) At the same time he was welcoming the Russians' hacking and other activities designed to influence the elections, Trump carried out negotiations for a lucrative real estate deal with Moscow. During this entire time, he repeatedly denied to the public having any business interests connected to Russia.
6) These are the facts. We may disagree as to what they mean about Trump's fitness to continue serving in office. But they are the facts. There are quite a few c words in play: collusion, coordination, conspiracy, corruption. I think corruption (both in a narrow sense of putting his financial and other personal interests ahead of the public interest, and more broadly his general moral corruption) is the most important and relevant of those words.
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nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
Rudy just reminded us of what Trump thinks the answer is:
There is nothing wrong with taking information from the Russians.
----------Rudy Giuliani 4/21/2019
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
I'll share one more. The FBI briefed Trump starting in August 2016 about Russian efforts to influence the elections. I believe Trump had a choice as to how to respond to that briefing. He made his choice.
Lets ignore dossier sources....
Trump used publically available information. The horror!!
AerchAngel
<B>Secretary of Statistics</B>
Nothing is going to happen.
Move on.
Concentrate on 2020 and get that dick out of office.
Move on.
Concentrate on 2020 and get that dick out of office.
nsacpi
Expects Yuge Games
from a realpolitik perspective the Dems should focus on doing a Benghazi on a grand scale to weaken him ahead of the elections...they have a lot of material to work with