Simmons dealt to Angels for two top pitchers, Aybar

[mossy]

Our attendance #s will be amusing next year.

I really thought about buying my yearly subscription to MLB.tv, can't see buying it any time soon now.

Not long ago we were contenders. Now this. Just hard to accept.

 

[auyushu]

I think we have the prospects to go out and get Frazier and Lucroy right now without gutting the farm system if we wanted to.

We do, but why the heck would we? Rentals do nothing for us. Rentals are only worthwhile if you are a piece or two away from a run, otherwise it's just a huge waste of resources. We need bats under our control for multiple years, not rentals.

 

[cajunrevenge]

We do, but why the heck would we? Rentals do nothing for us. Rentals are only worthwhile if you are a piece or two away from a run, otherwise it's just a huge waste of resources. We need bats under our control for multiple years, not rentals.

When you get down to it all players are rentals. The entire 2017 plan relies on trading pitching for hitting rentals when the time comes. Maybe it wont be Frazier or Lucroy but there will be bats out there for purchase before 2017.

 

[Dunit24]

It sucks to lose Simmons but once Albies is up and Newcomb is one of our aces, I think we will be fine without him.

 

[rico43]

What crosses my mind is this is the first trade by Copo as the official GM and with Kiley McDaniel as his personal talent guru. There are a bunch of people who have sworn by McDaniel's talent assessments before he was hired by the Braves. Why has that suddenly changed here?

I guarantee you that this deal isn't made if McDaniel hadn't put a seal of approval on the minor leaguers. Keep that in mind moving forward.

 

[blueagleace1]

Not sure why my original post was deleted but..

I know I'm going to get torn apart for this but here it goes...

I'm in agreement with [MENTION=21]rico43[/MENTION].

First off, I absolutely loved having Simba at SS and looked forward to seeing him make plays that most wouldn't think to make. Like keeping the tag on Dom Brown, his backpicks of guys rounding first base, and most of all his relays from the outfield where he would use his absolute cannon of an arm to throw guys out at the plate. There is no doubt I will sincerely miss Simmons playing shortstop for the Atlanta Braves on a daily basis. While I agree that we could have probably gotten a little more for him there are a few points that I will make that seem to make this trade a win for the Braves.

1. Ozzie Albies- it's pretty apparent that the font office is high on Ozzie and for good reason. Is his defense going to be as good as Andrelton's was? Of coarse not, there currently isn't another Simmons in any organization. However, Albies will be above average defensively and be a huge upgrade offensively and on the base paths. So while we won't ever be able to replace Simba's defensive ability or awareness we will have an overall upgrade in Albies.

2. Pitching, pitching, and more pitching- I think we saw how valuable a good pitching staff can be in October with the way the Mets were able to make a run. The Braves are in the process of putting together a dominate staff, that will/can rival any in baseball come 2017/2018. As things stand and assuming (not saying it won't happen) no trades are made involving Miller or Teheran we're looking a future staff of:

1. Shelby Miller
2. Sean Newcomb
3. Julio Teheran
4. Max Fried
5. Kolby Allard
6. Touki Toussaint
7. Lucas Sims
8. Tyrell Jenkins

That's as deep of a staff as any in baseball, no questions asked. With all of those arms it leads me to point #3..

3. Pitching currency- I've seen numerous people on here say that it's dumb to be acquiring all these arms to be used as currency to acquire bats because of how deep this years free agent class is in terms of arms. Yes, this years free agent class is stacked full of quality arms, BUT look at the 2017-2018 classes.. Not much at all. So while teams could just go out and purchase starting pitching this offseason and save their prospects (bats) the same can't be said for the following two offseasons. I agree that trading arms this offseason for bats would be selling short (supply and demand) but the next two offseasons could very well play right into our hand, which (un)coincidently is right when the front office wants to be competitive again.

Just off the top of my head some names we could target in trades next offseason by using our glut of pitching include:

Nolan Arenado-
Evan Longoria-
Michael Brantley-
Starlin Marte-
Todd Frazier-
Rafael Devers-
Alex Jackson
Ryan McMahon
Albert Almora
Max Pentecost
Gary Sanchez

My only complaint is the fact we traded away Peraza.

Again let me reiterate the fact that I absolutely hate to see Simmons go but with that being said I really do believe that we're doing the right thing and we got a good return for him that will allow us to go after anyone we really want in the next couple of seasons. I wish nothing but the best for Andrelton and hope he continues his dominance for many many years. He will always be one of my favorites to watch and pull for. Don't be too quick to judge, we may have just found ourselves the "Ace" we've all been seeking...

Sorry for the long post.

 

[Tapate50]

Wow what? You think Freeman's not pissed off?

He'd have been a free agent after this upcoming miserable season. I'm sure he's regretting this extension.

I think Freddie should probably act like a grown up about it. He will be alright, heck he might be next.

 

[Tapate50]

Aybar is a place holder/trade bait and Ellis is filler imo. Sean is the headliner and only player of real importance here. And the only true impact prospect we have acquired since we started unloading players.

7th ranked player in a unanimously agreed upon highly ranked system... Is "filler"? Got it.

 

[Tapate50]

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/evaluating-the-prospects-los-angeles-angels/

Scouting report from FG back in March.

 

[nsacpi]

We didn't lose an offensive, but we lost arguably our best asset to acquire any.

The only sure thing we have on offense is Freeman, and if I were him, I'd contemplate even showing up. The Braves bought out his prime years only to tear down the team to what will likely be 4-5 years of awfulness.

From Freeman's perspective this rebuild is terrible. I wonder what he would say if another player thinking of signing with the Braves gave him a call.

 

[nsacpi]

To build a rotation like the Mets, you actually need good pitching prospects.

For all of our wheeling and dealing.. which of our pitching prospects are actually safe bets? Newcomb?

We turned valuable assets into a few lottery tickets. That's really disappointing. And our offense is getting worse by the day.

Maybe there's a plan in place.. but it's a bad one.

Wisler and Newcomb are the only top tier pitching prospects we're traded for.

 

[nsacpi]

Newcomb is a lefty and throws mid 90's that's probably alot of the comparison. Price has always had pretty good control. If Newcomb can cut down a little on the walks he will be a stud #1 pitcher.

Thing is if you look at the universe of prospects similar to Newcomb the top 1% turn into David Price. I understand the front office's desire to spin everything in a positive way. But we have to understand that there is a lot of spinning that goes on after these sorts of trade. I do worry a little about how good a job our front office does in calibrating the odds of a Sean Newcomb turning into a David Price. If you make a list of pitching prospects ranked in the 20-30 range of BA's annual list you will see a lot of busts and very very few David Prices.

 

[Dunit24]

I highly doubt Freeman is pissed off. He was sat down last off season and was told the plan is for 2017. It's 2015. He jumps ship now, which he won't, he will miss out on when we start using this pitching depth to trade for those big bats.

Patience

 

[striker42]

All I can think is that the Braves are convinced Simmons' is on the decline defensively. The trade was fair but they didn't clearly win it. A team with one of the best SSs in the game who is under a team friendly contract should only deal him when they clearly win the trade. If they don't win, they just keep him. However, if that SS is declining in what makes him good, then they might not have the luxury of waiting.

SS's peak early defensively and ESPN quoted some scouts yesterday who said that Simmons didn't seem to be getting to everything he had gotten to in previous years. Simmons is still the best defensive SS in the game but if he's declining then that's reason to deal him now and not wait. If we'd waited and Simmons went from the best to simply very, very good, then he wouldn't have near the value he has now. He still might be among the best SS's in the game, but no one is going to give you a ransom for a SS whose value is almost entirely based on his defense when that defense is declining.

If we're convinced Simmons is what he is as a hitter and is going to slowly decline in the field, trading him now for the best deal you can makes perfect sense. Otherwise, I don't get the urgency.

 

[chipchildress]

this is a brilliant move by the braves. can't believe the reaction here.

 

[50PoundHead]

All I can think is that the Braves are convinced Simmons' is on the decline defensively. The trade was fair but they didn't clearly win it. A team with one of the best SSs in the game who is under a team friendly contract should only deal him when they clearly win the trade. If they don't win, they just keep him. However, if that SS is declining in what makes him good, then they might not have the luxury of waiting.

SS's peak early defensively and ESPN quoted some scouts yesterday who said that Simmons didn't seem to be getting to everything he had gotten to in previous years. Simmons is still the best defensive SS in the game but if he's declining then that's reason to deal him now and not wait. If we'd waited and Simmons went from the best to simply very, very good, then he wouldn't have near the value he has now. He still might be among the best SS's in the game, but no one is going to give you a ransom for a SS whose value is almost entirely based on his defense when that defense is declining.

If we're convinced Simmons is what he is as a hitter and is going to slowly decline in the field, trading him now for the best deal you can makes perfect sense. Otherwise, I don't get the urgency.

The hands at the Triple J ranch are just getting too impulsive for my tastes. Simmons really needs to do something about his approach at the plate, but he's still a premium defender at a premium defensive position. I'm not saying the return is horrid and maybe it was the best that was on the table, but there's no harm in waiting a bit if they were intent on moving him. I've said several times that Simmons may be a luxury on a team that doesn't hit much, so I'm not shocked by the move.

 

[IslandBrave]

Wisler and Newcomb are the only top tier pitching prospects we're traded for.

Could argue Shelby was a top tier prospect.

 

[Dunit24]

As a big fan, I hated this trade for one reason. Simmons was one of my favs. On the baseball side of things, I loved this trade and what we got back. Braves fans are just tired of seeing the regulars traded away, but its hard, IMO, to knock this trade from the Braves side.

 

[50PoundHead]

Wisler and Newcomb are the only top tier pitching prospects we're traded for.

I think Fried would also qualify as top-tier, but he does have a huge injury question mark.

 

[jdunn]

Wow what? You think Freeman's not pissed off?

He'd have been a free agent after this upcoming miserable season. I'm sure he's regretting this extension.

He'll be pissed until that he sees his bank statement showing this month's direct deposit.