Spring has Sprung

zbhargrove said:
Maybe, maybe not... He was a virtually identical player LHH and RHH in 2018... 2017 was a small sample and his first experience as a big leaguer, and in 2019 he was awful all around.

But let's not forget when he went back to AAA last year, he lit it up and when called back up he was on fire for the rest of the season before going out with the injury.
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Camargo in 3503 PAs over 8 seasons: .284/.338/.382/.720

Camargo in the majors, 504 PAs, 2017 and 2019 combined: .266/.305/.419/.724

Camargo in 2018: .272/.349/.457/.806


It's really not that hard to see which us the outlier.
 
Snowman said:
Camargo in 3503 PAs over 8 seasons: .284/.338/.382/.720

Camargo in the majors, 504 PAs, 2017 and 2019 combined: .266/.305/.419/.724

Camargo in 2018: .272/.349/.457/.806


It's really not that hard to see which us the outlier.
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The sample you threw out (2018, 524 PA) is larger than the one you used at MLB level
 
zbhargrove said:
Maybe, maybe not... He was a virtually identical player LHH and RHH in 2018... 2017 was a small sample and his first experience as a big leaguer, and in 2019 he was awful all around.

But let's not forget when he went back to AAA last year, he lit it up and when called back up he was on fire for the rest of the season before going out with the injury.
Click to expand...

2018 numbers

321 BABIP against righties
300 BABIP against lefties

87.6 exit velocity against righties
88.9 exit velocity against lefties

2019 Exit Velocity
85.8 against righties
89.5 against lefties

While the end result numbers in 2018 were pretty similar I think it's clear he hits better against lefties and the 2018 numbers against righties were a little luck based
 
Take a look at Camargo’s exit velocities from each side of the plate. It is clear he is not useful as a LHH. The Braves know this.

Edit: already done a few seconds before this post.
 
Let's try to simplify that for you.

In 77.3% of his time as a professional, Camargo has been a .720 OPS minor league hitter.

In 11.1% of his time as a professional, Camargo has been a .724 OPS major league hitter.

In 11.6% of his time as a professional, Camargo has been an .806 OPS major league hitter.

Again, this isn't a difficult outlier to spot.


Edit: I was typing this as wupk and Encheff were posting, so I hadn't seen theirs as I typed it.
 
I think it’s pretty clear the Braves need to add a LHH 3b like Holt. The need is great enough that it may be worth cutting costs in the OF or BP to make it happen.
 
Enscheff said:
Take a look at Camargo’s exit velocities from each side of the plate. It is clear he is not useful as a LHH. The Braves know this.

Edit: already done a few seconds before this post.
Click to expand...

The troubling thing to me is that the Braves aren't behaving like they know this. They signed guys like Hech and Solarte, but I don't think either of them adequately fills that LHH 3rd base hole that we need filled. The only remaining FA who comfortably fills that slot is Holt and we haven't heard any substantial rumors regarding him either.

The further along ST goes, the more concerned I get that the front office is content with Camargo manning 3rd base, at least for the first half of the season. Maybe they think he's made some strides this offseason and are willing to give him a shot. And if he fails they will address 3rd through a midseason trade.
 
Snowman said:
Let's try to simplify that for you.

In 77.3% of his time as a professional, Camargo has been a .720 OPS minor league hitter.

In 11.1% of his time as a professional, Camargo has been a .724 OPS major league hitter.

In 11.6% of his time as a professional, Camargo has been an .806 OPS major league hitter.

Again, this isn't a difficult outlier to spot.


Edit: I was typing this as wupk and Encheff were posting, so I hadn't seen theirs as I typed it.
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I never stated that 2018 wasn't an outlier. I just don't know if I'd say Camargo is "not useful" as a LHH at this point. I'd say the jury is out. Certainly he's better as a RHH, but I'm not convinced he's "not useful" as a LHH.

There's a chance that Camargo was a late bloomer type that ends up being better than his minor league stats suggest. And I don't put a lot of credence in his 2019 as he was never an every day player. I think he struggles when he's not getting consistent at bats. Its worth it to see if he is, in fact, a late bloomer.
 
thewupk said:
2018 numbers

321 BABIP against righties
300 BABIP against lefties

87.6 exit velocity against righties
88.9 exit velocity against lefties

2019 Exit Velocity
85.8 against righties
89.5 against lefties

While the end result numbers in 2018 were pretty similar I think it's clear he hits better against lefties and the 2018 numbers against righties were a little luck based
Click to expand...

For sure he's a better hitter against lefties. Most hitters, especially switch hitters, have a better side. I was never trying to say it was equal, but those 2018 BABIP and exit velo numbers are really not a ton different. I'm not saying his 2018 is the real Camargo, I'm just saying he may not be as useless as a LHH as some are making him out to be. I am just arguing that we may not exactly know what we have in Camargo yet.
 
Over a decent chunk of 3 seasons Camargo has posted an above average xwOBA vs LHP, and a well below average xwOBA vs RHP. His exit velocities tell exactly the same story.

That’s 1000+ PAs over his age 23-25 seasons.

I think the Braves and everyone else paying attention knows what Camargo is by now...I’ve been stating as much for years. Luckily, a platoon 3b is something they should be able to pick up relatively cheaply.
 
Enscheff said:
Luckily, a platoon 3b is something they should be able to pick up relatively cheaply.
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I’m guessing we haven’t heard anything about Holt because (a) he’s a below-average defender everywhere, including 3B (which is less than ideal for the strong side of a platoon), along with (b) the fact that he’s reportedly holding out for a guaranteed MLB contract (at who knows what rate/length).

The question then becomes: who else is comparable and available? Because I agree: a platoon 3B is something they should be able to pick up relatively cheaply and easily. But the fact that they haven’t either means it’s not looking cheap/easy, or the FO indeed believes this idea that Camargo can be productive in a full-time role.
 
jpx7 said:
I’m guessing we haven’t heard anything about Holt because (a) he’s a below-average defender everywhere, including 3B (which is less than ideal for the strong side of a platoon), along with (b) the fact that he’s reportedly holding out for a guaranteed MLB contract (at who knows what rate/length).

The question then becomes: who else is comparable and available? Because I agree: a platoon 3B is something they should be able to pick up relatively cheaply and easily. But the fact that they haven’t either means it’s not looking cheap/easy, or the FO indeed believes this idea that Camargo can be productive in a full-time role.
Click to expand...

Or Riley
 
jpx7 said:
I’m guessing we haven’t heard anything about Holt because (a) he’s a below-average defender everywhere, including 3B (which is less than ideal for the strong side of a platoon), along with (b) the fact that he’s reportedly holding out for a guaranteed MLB contract (at who knows what rate/length).

The question then becomes: who else is comparable and available? Because I agree: a platoon 3B is something they should be able to pick up relatively cheaply and easily. But the fact that they haven’t either means it’s not looking cheap/easy, or the FO indeed believes this idea that Camargo can be productive in a full-time role.
Click to expand...

There will likely be someone similar to Holt available towards the end of ST. Maybe Lamb? Maybe Solarte shows he can be part of the solution? Maybe someone we haven’t thought of yet?

I imagine Plan B is to open with Camargo, give Riley a chance at some point, and then address 3b at the deadline if needed.

My guess is the guy playing 3b for the Braves during the most important stretch of the season (assuming they are contenders) isn’t yet in the organization.
 
Enscheff said:
There will likely be someone similar to Holt available towards the end of ST. Maybe Lamb? Maybe Solarte shows he can be part of the solution? Maybe someone we haven’t thought of yet?

I imagine Plan B is to open with Camargo, give Riley a chance at some point, and then address 3b at the deadline if needed.

My guess is the guy playing 3b for the Braves during the most important stretch of the season (assuming they are contenders) isn’t yet in the organization.
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I agree with this.

I’ll also add that Camargo slimming down (therefore more mobile hopefully) means he can possibly fulfill the Duvall role of RH OF. I know “Camargo Super Sub” didn’t go so well last year, but I still have hopes he can excel in that role the next few years.
 
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