The Coronavirus, not the beer

Dalyn said:
Some of the last studies on this issue pointed out that people in counties with high poverty are most prone to obesity. Counties with a poverty rate of something like 30% or greater have well over 100% greater rates of obesity than wealthy counties. The proof just keeps going and going. Are there some people who are obese because they are lazy and/or selfish? Yes. More than the ones who are obese because of the issues I mentioned? Not even ****ing close.
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So because you’re poor you can’t jog for 30 minutes a day.

GTFO
 
Dalyn said:
I hope you don't tell them all they need is a little personal responsibility. And we aren't talking about the majority of the population, we are talking about the majority of a segment of the population.
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Correct, but it isn’t easy and it’s work. Most people want a quick fix and that person didn’t. Endorphins help relieve some of the symptoms, as does a feeling of accomplishment.

Food has a HUGE bearing on mood and feelings
 
Tapate50 said:
For people that don’t get what is being said -

There is an extremely low percentage of people that have real reasons they have weight issues.

There are probably a small percentage of those people that could still do better and work toward not having them.

We have the highest obesity rate in the world and it’s not close.

The difference in those % CAN do something about it and usually choose not to.

No one is talking about people with depression but exercise and healthy food can and does help with that as well.

No one is talking about the fraction of a % point of people that have Prader- Willi syndrome.

Y’all act like this is all the norm. It is not
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The numbers on exercise and depression are flawed. They compare depression rates between people who exercise and people who don't. It is ridiculous, since OF COURSE the depression rates are going to be higher among people who don't exercise. That is not because they are not exercising. They are not exercising because they are depressed. When a down period is tapering off, they feel like exercising again. They are not helping their depression by exercising. They are exercising because their depression is loosening its hold for a bit. This stuff is also really hard to see when you're actively depressed. For me, I usually have to skip a shower before work or something that is really unusual for me for it to hit me that I am having an issue. These are not active decisions. Your chemicals are off, and it changes your decision making process to the point that you don't even recognize that it is happening, at least not at first. And this is all with medication. Without medication, which is unfortunately how many mentally ill people live their life, is a completely different monster.
 
Tapate50 said:
For people that don’t get what is being said -

There is an extremely low percentage of people that have real reasons they have weight issues.

There are probably a small percentage of those people that could still do better and work toward not having them.

We have the highest obesity rate in the world and it’s not close.

The difference in those % CAN do something about it and usually choose not to.

No one is talking about people with depression but exercise and healthy food can and does help with that as well.

No one is talking about the fraction of a % point of people that have Prader- Willi syndrome.

Y’all act like this is all the norm. It is not
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Are you saying anyone around here is saying people with Prader-Willi are the norm? I'm the only one here to mention Prader-Willi and I cited that as an extreme case.

But its not black and white. It's not a tiny number of people with Prader-Willi and the rest are just lazy and lack any discipline.

People who are obese occupy a spectrum. For some, a little guidance on nutrition and exercise will make a big difference. For others, even extreme intervention won't. If all it took was some discipline, lap band surgery and other extreme interventions wouldnt be a thing. And even an extreme intervention like lap band surgery doesn't always work (I will skip the obligatory anecdotes to avoid triggering thethe and the "hard data" folk around here).

I think there is a more interesting discussion to be had regarding why Americans in particular have such a high obesity rate, and why certain states like West Virginia, Mississippi and Arkansas have the highest rates within the country. That kind of discussion is more likely to uncover factors at work that could actually be addressed rather than just saying people in those places need better discipline and habits.
 
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Tapate50 said:
Correct, but it isn’t easy and it’s work. Most people want a quick fix and that person didn’t. Endorphins help relieve some of the symptoms, as does a feeling of accomplishment.

Food has a HUGE bearing on mood and feelings
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We can agree on food, at least. :) I do disagree that most people want a quick fix. I think for most people it gets so bad they just want it to be over or better, whichever they have access to.
 
thethe said:
Yes. Almost anyone can avoid being obese. It’s really simple but requires determination to exercise.
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Thank you, Mr. Morally Superior. I'm just going to start dealing with you in the same way I deal with Flat Earthers.
 
Dalyn said:
Yeah. Because that's clearly what I'm talking about. This is what I mean about being willfully obtuse.
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You’re pretending that a majority of the obese population can’t just go outside and exercise.

I’m not expecting them to be chiseled athletes. But it easy to not be obese with minimal exercise.
 
Dalyn said:
Yeah. Because that's clearly what I'm talking about. This is what I mean about being willfully obtuse.
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You’re pretending that a majority of the obese population can’t just go outside and exercise.

I’m not expecting them to be chiseled athletes. But it easy to not be obese with minimal exercise.
 
thethe said:
You’re pretending that a majority of the obese population can’t just go outside and exercise.

I’m not expecting them to be chiseled athletes. But it easy to not be obese with minimal exercise.
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No. I'm not. That is ONE part of what I mentioned. Maybe I was wrong about the willful obtuseness.
 
I'll make one observation about public policy that covers a lot more things than obesity. Which is that reducing poverty fixes a lot of problems, obesity being one of them. Sure we can do things that specifically address eating and exercise habits, or that get people better access to healthcare. I'm all for doing that. But policies that reduce poverty are where you literally get the biggest bang for the buck. Reduce poverty and you reduce a lot of social pathologies.

Of course, fixing poverty will not eliminate obesity. We have a lot of rich obese people in this country.
 
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I just LOVE how the guy who wants to call people morally superior has gone off on a rant about how morally superior he is.
 
nsacpi said:
I'll make one observation about public policy that covers a lot more things than obesity. Which is that reducing poverty fixes a lot of problems, obesity being one of them. Sure we can do things that specifically address eating and exercise habits. I'm all for doing that. But policies that reduce poverty is where you literally get the biggest bang for the buck. Reduce poverty and you reduce a lot of social pathologies.
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This is not at all hard to understand.
 
Dalyn said:
I just LOVE how the guy who wants to call people morally superior has gone off on a rant about how morally superior he is.
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When obesity is the primary driver to restricting everyone’s rights and the destruction of the global economy is obesity then you better believe we should push to discourage it.
 
thethe said:
When obesity is the primary driver to restricting everyone’s rights and the destruction of the global economy is obesity then you better believe we should push to discourage it.
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I agree. I'm just trying to help you help in a way that is actually helpful. Even if you were right about laziness and selfishness, good luck getting those people to do anything. So maybe deal with the issues we actually have proof cause obesity, and ALSO already have ways in place to help that, you know...work.
 
Dalyn said:
I agree. I'm just trying to help you help in a way that is actually helpful. Even if you were right about laziness and selfishness, good luck getting those people to do anything. So maybe deal with the issues we actually have proof cause obesity, and ALSO already have ways in place to help that, you know...work.
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And if they don’t want to do it that’s there God given right. But that also means we shouldn’t shut down the economy or bear the burden of their health care costs.
 
Things I am doing to try: I give out healthy food. I donate (I live with two other people, so even at my low income I have a little extra). I encourage mentally ill people to get on medication, and go to therapy. I help the homeless fill out applications. I help them understand what is available in place to help. Many days I am doing this where I did not sleep because of depression. Or I am having to make private jokes about suicide to ease the urge. I know society likes to ignore that people with these issues exist, and add a whole stigma to it and attribute the symptoms to laziness and selfishness ( I have heard this kind of thing my whole life), but the truth is that there are many of us. Addressing poverty is the best way to help. At least then people can start getting the help they actually need. Also, when someone who is suffering tells you what would make it a little better, put your own opinions on the matter aside and show them that their needs actually register to some people.
 
nsacpi said:
I'll make one observation about public policy that covers a lot more things than obesity. Which is that reducing poverty fixes a lot of problems, obesity being one of them. Sure we can do things that specifically address eating and exercise habits, or that get people better access to healthcare. I'm all for doing that. But policies that reduce poverty are where you literally get the biggest bang for the buck. Reduce poverty and you reduce a lot of social pathologies.

Of course, fixing poverty will not eliminate obesity. We have a lot of rich obese people in this country.
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History shows this probably ages poorly.

But are those studies with a country as readily developed as the US is?
 
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