whaaa??? You seem to be forgetting about Carlos Quentin and Erik Aybar.
The cost of poor lineup optimization
- Thread starter Enscheff
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whaaa??? You seem to be forgetting about Carlos Quentin and Erik Aybar.
To be fair, we did receive Jace/Dustin Peterson and Mallex in the Upton deal, that's 3 bats.
IIRC correctly we acquired Riley with the SD pick and also got Ruiz in the Folty deal - these aren't blue-chip prospects, but we did get some bats through the trades; Swanson and Ender are two starters at the big league level acquired via trade as well.
IIRC correctly we acquired Riley with the SD pick and also got Ruiz in the Folty deal - these aren't blue-chip prospects, but we did get some bats through the trades; Swanson and Ender are two starters at the big league level acquired via trade as well.
sturg33
I
I'm obviously focusing on the center pieces of the deal, which the Braves clearly favored pitching.
Just pointing out the difference in strategy... the Cubs used their assets and high draft picks on hitters. The Braves on pitchers.
I like the Cubs strategy better
Certainly fair. I think some of this is draft variance - not the same caliber of pitcher and hitters in each draft, but it is inarguable that the Braves have gone pitching heavy.
Gohara was throwing 99 last night. Obviously the strategy is working.
The Braves sure we're getting a crap ton of guys in scoring position to start innings for such a bad offense then.
We also turned the pitching in the Heyward deal into hitting. And got Riley in the Kimbrel deal.
There also wasn't a Bryant or Schwarber available for us in our drafts.
I think there is a difference in approach to some degree, clearly, but I certainly don't think it's a 'We'd rather go pitching than take Kris Bryant' kind of difference in approach.
There also wasn't a Bryant or Schwarber available for us in our drafts.
I think there is a difference in approach to some degree, clearly, but I certainly don't think it's a 'We'd rather go pitching than take Kris Bryant' kind of difference in approach.
sturg33
I
Well, for example, we took Ian Anderson over guys like Corey Ray & Kyle Lewis. No, they're not Kris Bryant - but Ian Anderson isn't Stephen Strasburg either.
It's just been a strategy focused on pitching pitching pitching.
Yes, Shelby was traded for hitting - and not coincidentally we all agree that was the best deal we've made (and probably the only reason this re-build isn't a failure).
He also bizarrely traded two young players (Wood and Peraza) for and old hitter - which obviously didn't work out.
So two trades that brought in hitting. 5 trades that favored pitching, and two high draft years that favored pitching.
I'd have liked to see that reversed, or at least more balanced
SJ24
Well-known member
Well, they have pitching too. Best rotation in baseball last year.
Boston and Colorado scored more runs, but nobody had a better ERA, and it wasn't close.
Horsehide Harry
<B>Mr. Free Trade</B>
Besides the hitting vs pitching difference in philosophy, the Cubs also went through a full 5 year rebuild, where they picked top 5 in the draft year after year after year. The Braves OTOH are trying to short circuit the process to 3 years (likely because of the requirements of the new ballpark) and will have significantly less margin for error. If the wrong decisions are made by the Braves FO, or even if they just get a little unlucky, they could seriously find themselves deep into baseball purgatory for years (not good enough to really win, just good enough to make most think they still can) ultimately leading to another 5 year rebuild starting in 5 years or so.
The Swanson/Inciarte trade was truly a gift from above in that it provided two/eights of the long term lineup. Throw Freeman in there and you have 3/8. Albies looks really close and will likely be 4/8 but Inciarte, Swanson and Albies are all guys who look to be in the 1, 2 or 8 holes. Freeman is best suited as a 4, eventually shifting with age to a 5 or 6. Everyone else currently there is not part of a long term success. So the Braves need long term some production bats who can hit 3, 5, 6 and 7.
People point to Acuna (1-2 years away, probably 3-4 from being a key guy), Maitan (3-4 years away and probably 6 from being a key guy), Riley (bat speed issues, position issues), Peterson (probably a bench guy at best), etc. but those guys will come at different periods at different effectiveness levels all while the current ML core gets older year after year.
The Swanson/Inciarte trade was truly a gift from above in that it provided two/eights of the long term lineup. Throw Freeman in there and you have 3/8. Albies looks really close and will likely be 4/8 but Inciarte, Swanson and Albies are all guys who look to be in the 1, 2 or 8 holes. Freeman is best suited as a 4, eventually shifting with age to a 5 or 6. Everyone else currently there is not part of a long term success. So the Braves need long term some production bats who can hit 3, 5, 6 and 7.
People point to Acuna (1-2 years away, probably 3-4 from being a key guy), Maitan (3-4 years away and probably 6 from being a key guy), Riley (bat speed issues, position issues), Peterson (probably a bench guy at best), etc. but those guys will come at different periods at different effectiveness levels all while the current ML core gets older year after year.