The Trump Presidency

I think courts absolutely have an obligation to consider motivation...literacy requirements are not per se illegal but used as cover to suppress black voting certainly are...in the same way claims of national security cannot be used as a cloak for unconstitutional actions

Motivation? This case wasn't/isn't being litigated in a criminal court.

I'd like to respond here, but you are making random statements with no clear correlation, using no relevant (or even interesting) case law.

As for the comment after the final ellipsis ... remember the Patriot Act? National Security can, and has been, used as a 'cloak' for actions that have ultimately been determined to be unconstitutional. When executive authority factors into the equation it becomes substantially more murky. That particular issue is especially worth further debate, but we've got to start above the baseline.
 
Motivation? This case wasn't/isn't being litigated in a criminal court.

I'd like to respond here, but you are making random statements with no clear correlation, using no relevant (or even interesting) case law.

As for the comment after the final ellipsis ... remember the Patriot Act? National Security can, and has been, used as a 'cloak' for actions that have ultimately been determined to be unconstitutional. When executive authority factors into the equation it becomes substantially more murky. That particular issue is especially worth further debate, but we've got to start above the baseline.
you can't use the cloak of national security to discriminate based on religion...the courts will rightfully see this as something to be closely scrutinized during as long as trump is president
 
you can't use the cloak of national security to discriminate based on religion...the courts will rightfully see this as something to be closely scrutinized during as long as trump is president

How is it discrimination based on religion if the most populated Muslim countries aren't on the list?
 
How is it discrimination based on religion if the most populated Muslim countries aren't on the list?

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How is it discrimination based on religion if the most populated Muslim countries aren't on the list?

Obviously there is another line of discrimination at work.

Like the bully he is, he goes after those with little means to defend themselves. If it were an across the board ban of all Muslims, I could at least respect the purity of intention.
 
Obviously there is another line of discrimination at work.

Like the bully he is, he goes after those with little means to defend themselves. If it were an across the board ban of all Muslims, I could at least respect the purity of intention.

Or he just signaled out the countries with no central government and can't be trusted to do the right thing.
 
That's one of the reasons that I don't think they want to see this case proceed and be argued on its merits...which is further advertisement for how slipshod and amateurish this thing is. You can only go so far on bluster and bull****.

Some can go further than others.

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I'm sorry that I can't share your (apparently intoxicatingly) expansive viewpoint.

There's a baseline level of trust and credibility that anyone needs to effectively lead, well, anything, much less a country. Repeating endlessly debunked lies and conspiracy theories like verbal tics tends to be corrosive to establishing trust and credibility

Haha. Look, you clearly prefer your bull**** served on a silver platter Mr. Hope & Change. I'm not that fancy.

First off, I disagree that there's an effective level of 'trust and credibility' (which are relative, but that's beside the point) requisite to lead in contemporary American society. I actually don't see how you can assert that with a straight-face once you consider the administrations we've been subject to over the past half-century. Your first mistake is assuming that the populace at-large is even that interested, your second mistake is presuming they are educated enough to maneuver through the crossfire and political noise. I assume that the electorate is more interested in tangible results/damnable proof. I know that perception is more important than policy when it comes to swaying public opinion.

Like it or not, Trump is an anomaly. He's Teflon. The kitchen sink was thrown at him during the election. Hell, he threw half of it on himself. What happened? He garnered 30 million votes. He won. This in spite of being labeled (and, at times, was pretty damn well proven to be) a tax cheat, grossly unsympathetic to the military, a Manchurian candidate, a wife-abuser, a serial rapist, an inept businessman, a silver-spooned out-of-touch insensitive buffoon, habitual liar, narcissist, racist, bigot, etc.

And what? What has changed from the day he won the election until the present? Where is the Trump machine taking on water? The inauguration attendance 'scandal'? His obsession with illegal votes (that's actually a good thing for Republicans)? Sean Spicer? It's the same paradigm as the campaign, except now it's playing out in real time from the highest office in the land. What leads you to believe the endgame has changed, that most suddenly have an inherently greater negative perception of Trump than they did on election day?

People sit there and work themselves up in a tizzy over absolutely ludicrous and single, unnamed source character attacks of chalk-like consistency and it's the next media cycle, and then the next, and it's gone. Meanwhile, he's locked up his (oh so controversial, racist, and inexperienced) cabinet, he's delivered on a not insignificant number of his pre-election promises, the economy is booming, and he's fighting a smart political battle with the immigration ban.

I don't feel duped. But I'm not here picking my ass and talking about birtherism still either.

What *I* find tiresome is your telling people that it's not a concern. Sure, following the daily outrage like six-year-olds follow the ball on the soccer field may get ridiculous...but pointing out that it could be a genuine problem to have a President who's a reflexive, incredible bull****ter? I think we're all going to have to re-calibrate our expectations a tad.

I'll tell you what's concerning to me. It's the petulance that people who simply disagree with Trump resort to when challenged on the substance of their positions. Maybe he's rubbed off on you in that sense. I think we all realize that Trump is less than desirable in terms of his public persona, but he's not the Generalissimo FFS. He is, however, tied to an ideology, and you are slipping the clutch when you suggest anyone re-calibrate their belief system based on a handful of arbitrary infractions by its figurehead.
 
you can't use the cloak of national security to discriminate based on religion...the courts will rightfully see this as something to be closely scrutinized during as long as trump is president

Except there is no discrimination based on religion in this case according to the federal court in Massachusetts (which actually found against Trump on due process).

Or are you just speaking generally?
 
The 9th circuit is the most overturned court and there's a reason why.

that the radical right hates a the idea of the foundation of a liberal democratic republic and has been trying to destroy it for a while?
 
Haha. Look, you clearly prefer your bull**** served on a silver platter Mr. Hope & Change. I'm not that fancy.

First off, I disagree that there's an effective level of 'trust and credibility' (which are relative, but that's beside the point) requisite to lead in contemporary American society. I actually don't see how you can assert that with a straight-face once you consider the administrations we've been subject to over the past half-century. Your first mistake is assuming that the populace at-large is even that interested, your second mistake is presuming they are educated enough to maneuver through the crossfire and political noise. I assume that the electorate is more interested in tangible results/damnable proof. I know that perception is more important than policy when it comes to swaying public opinion.

Like it or not, Trump is an anomaly. He's Teflon. The kitchen sink was thrown at him during the election. Hell, he threw half of it on himself. What happened? He garnered 30 million votes. He won. This in spite of being labeled (and, at times, was pretty damn well proven to be) a tax cheat, grossly unsympathetic to the military, a Manchurian candidate, a wife-abuser, a serial rapist, an inept businessman, a silver-spooned out-of-touch insensitive buffoon, habitual liar, narcissist, racist, bigot, etc.

And what? What has changed from the day he won the election until the present? Where is the Trump machine taking on water? The inauguration attendance 'scandal'? His obsession with illegal votes (that's actually a good thing for Republicans)? Sean Spicer? It's the same paradigm as the campaign, except now it's playing out in real time from the highest office in the land. What leads you to believe the endgame has changed, that most suddenly have an inherently greater negative perception of Trump than they did on election day?

People sit there and work themselves up in a tizzy over absolutely ludicrous and single, unnamed source character attacks of chalk-like consistency and it's the next media cycle, and then the next, and it's gone. Meanwhile, he's locked up his (oh so controversial, racist, and inexperienced) cabinet, he's delivered on a not insignificant number of his pre-election promises, the economy is booming, and he's fighting a smart political battle with the immigration ban.

I don't feel duped. But I'm not here picking my ass and talking about birtherism still either.

I'll tell you what's concerning to me. It's the petulance that people who simply disagree with Trump resort to when challenged on the substance of their positions. Maybe he's rubbed off on you in that sense. I think we all realize that Trump is less than desirable in terms of his public persona, but he's not the Generalissimo FFS. He is, however, tied to an ideology, and you are slipping the clutch when you suggest anyone re-calibrate their belief system based on a handful of arbitrary infractions by its figurehead.

In four years the left is going to have another post election realization that they read the pulse of the country wrong. As long as the economy is roaring and the government is helping create a situation where there is less violence in this country then trump will be conside red a wildly successful president. So please continge to focus on his tact or Twitter usage. You'll be blindsided yet again.
 
Everytime one side wins the Presidency they say the losing side is doomed. The winners say the losing side needs to move more to the center while the losing side claims their candidate lost for being too moderate. Wasnt too long ago Republicans were considered on life support. Lets wait and see how mid terms go. If Democrats dont make serious gains there then it might be panic time for them. Very unlikely they win control of the senate but the whole house of represenatives is up for grabs.
 
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